Ange in or out?

[DTA]

I'd be delighted for you to tell me. I remember the game well.
Maybe I missed something.
Hurzler himself stated that the biggest difference was the level of application in his initial plan. Estupian 'could' be considered a 'tactical' change. I'd consider it replacing an inferior player with a better one.
I remember being absolutely shocked at how suddenly, in the very same patterns the game had shown first-half, we were so flat.
Tell mew this; do you remember us playing ewith the same zip, urgency and (most importantly) desire we showed in the first-half?



This discussion has been all over this forum as you know. I assume you believe that he is out of his depth. I also assume that you do not like the high-line + high inverted FBs. I also assume you do not like the reliance we have on speed/pace in defensive transitions to make up for the areas we principly get caught (in behind where the FBs have vacated and the midfield has not adequetely covere or is imbalanced due to two no natural or double pivot structure. All good. I get it. I personally was relieved when he stopped sending the FBs so high all the time in early March, and I did wish he'd been more pragmatic in Jan/Feb when the injuries were frankly immense. I saw plenty of times this season (like last) where the football was wonderful, great moves executed, and great goals scored. I equally saw some of the worst errors/ratio of individual mistakes, I've ever seen in a season. Ultimately though, I think it's impossible to accurately evaluate due to the circumtances around him/injuries, which robbed us of any pattern of consistency even in the ability to rotate.
Me?
I'd like us to be a 4-2-3-1 or a 3-5-2.
I think 4-3-3 requires very elite players and/or players confidently bedded into that system.




I am not sure 'shown up' is the phrase. Such suggestions make me wonder if people genuinely believe that the entire club would've let a naive manager who is being shown up remain in his job if that were the case?





That won't work.




You have the same fears that many here have. I don't have them to anything like that degree, partially because I believe some things will have changed as a consequence of this season.

As I have also said, I (sadly) feel this is all wasted 'fret' and 'fro' because I believe they are waiting for the emotional clouds to part before they announce his sacking (in a very nice way)...

Ok so from memory. Going forward Wellbeck and their other forward dropped deeper Inbetween bentancur and our back line meaning they could out number him and compress our back line moving Porro when he wasn’t out of position already because of Ange’s favoured inverted fullback tactics infield. They also built from the right and switched quickly to the left Meaning that Mitoma was able to totally dominate. He had a good first half anyway but in the second half he had so much time and space it was criminal negligence

 

[Muttley]

Because I like him, I love his story, I relate to his story.

Would love to hear more about this observation.

 

[DTA]

I'd be delighted for you to tell me. I remember the game well.
Maybe I missed something.
Hurzler himself stated that the biggest difference was the level of application in his initial plan. Estupian 'could' be considered a 'tactical' change. I'd consider it replacing an inferior player with a better one.
I remember being absolutely shocked at how suddenly, in the very same patterns the game had shown first-half, we were so flat.
Tell mew this; do you remember us playing ewith the same zip, urgency and (most importantly) desire we showed in the first-half?



This discussion has been all over this forum as you know. I assume you believe that he is out of his depth. I also assume that you do not like the high-line + high inverted FBs. I also assume you do not like the reliance we have on speed/pace in defensive transitions to make up for the areas we principly get caught (in behind where the FBs have vacated and the midfield has not adequetely covere or is imbalanced due to two no natural or double pivot structure. All good. I get it. I personally was relieved when he stopped sending the FBs so high all the time in early March, and I did wish he'd been more pragmatic in Jan/Feb when the injuries were frankly immense. I saw plenty of times this season (like last) where the football was wonderful, great moves executed, and great goals scored. I equally saw some of the worst errors/ratio of individual mistakes, I've ever seen in a season. Ultimately though, I think it's impossible to accurately evaluate due to the circumtances around him/injuries, which robbed us of any pattern of consistency even in the ability to rotate.
Me?
I'd like us to be a 4-2-3-1 or a 3-5-2.
I think 4-3-3 requires very elite players and/or players confidently bedded into that system.




I am not sure 'shown up' is the phrase. Such suggestions make me wonder if people genuinely believe that the entire club would've let a naive manager who is being shown up remain in his job if that were the case?





That won't work.




You have the same fears that many here have. I don't have them to anything like that degree, partially because I believe some things will have changed as a consequence of this season.

As I have also said, I (sadly) feel this is all wasted 'fret' and 'fro' because I believe they are waiting for the emotional clouds to part before they announce his sacking (in a very nice way)...

As a side note I actually think Ange’s system would work better with a 343/3511/3421

 

[DTA]

Would love to hear more about this observation.

Nothing too exciting. Just us being southern Mediterranean and having similar relationships with our fathers, his father seemed very similar to mine in attitude (although my father doesn’t like football so I have had to try to find other things to try to build a relationship with him with)

 

[veryoldspur]

As a side note I actually think Ange’s system would work better with a 343/3511/3421

But that's a total of 7275, and each team is only allowed 11 players

 

[Legohamster]

Miguel Delaney says there is less than a percent chance of him staying , a rather specific number

 

[lurker of old]

Maybe the answer is to get someone in directly under him that will implement their own tactical system and coaching and use him as a motivational man manager. I really thing that could work if we get someone in that’s really good.
Ange's ego wouldn't allow it.

 

[kb 1984]

Miguel Delaney says there is less than a percent chance of him staying , a rather specific number

Who is Miguel Delaney

 

[Daisuk]

Miguel Delaney says there is less than a percent chance of him staying , a rather specific number

I saw that doing the rounds on X being quotes from a "Spurs News" something or other, but trying to find Delaney actually saying that proved to be a difficult task. I couldn't find him saying that anywhere.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Ultimately, at least for me, do I think giving Ange 6 months to show what he can do without all the injuries issues will impact us more then the upheaval of sacking a trophy winning manager who the squad clearly love and having to start from scratch.

I would rather give him the 6 months, because it won’t really make a difference to spurs in the grand scheme of things, and not one person can guarantee anyone new coming in could actually utilise this squad more. If he fails, he can go with my gratitude for winning a trophy but if he succeeds, then finally we can put an end to this damn manager merry go round that everyone apparently hates, yet seem to ask for the second things get hard.

Why do you think the injuries would stop? We still lost Maddison and Kulu during the last 3 weeks of the season when we were in everyone in cotton wool mode?

 

[Bishop]

Why do you think the injuries would stop? We still lost Maddison and Kulu during the last 3 weeks of the season when we were in everyone in cotton wool mode?

Injuries have been the pattern, there's really nothing to suggest that our injury situation will be significantly improved next season. It seems to be the nature of his training and playing schemes along with his use of the squad that lead to the injuries. Next season is not going to be any easier, we will have just as many games and many if them coming in a more difficult competition.

 

[harr1984]

Every team gets injuries, no one is saying they are going to miraculously disappear. But Ange was clearly rotating more and waiting longer before bringing injured players back into the fold compared to before the injury nightmare, we wasn't getting a new substantial injury every week in the second half of the season like we was the first....

 

[Gutter Boy]

Injuries have been the pattern, there's really nothing to suggest that our injury situation will be significantly improved next season. It seems to be the nature of his training and playing schemes along with his use of the squad that lead to the injuries. Next season is not going to be any easier, we will have just as many games and many if them coming in a more difficult competition.

Injuries are also cumulative, esp muscular ones. So the damage done to players last season will make it more likely to reoccur in them

 

[Mikey10]

Who is Miguel Delaney

Football journalist at The Independent.

I saw that doing the rounds on X being quotes from a "Spurs News" something or other, but trying to find Delaney actually saying that proved to be a difficult task. I couldn't find him saying that anywhere.

It’s in his weekly Reading the Game newsletter which you can sign up to through The Independent. The comments are being widely carried in a lot of news websites.

Ange Postecoglou still expected to leave Tottenham Hotspur despite no official decision made as of today | SportsView

Tottenham Hotspur manager Ange Postecoglou is still expected to leave the club despite winning the Europa League, according to the Independent journalist Miguel Delaney. “As of Friday morning, Tottenham Hotspur still hadn’t made an official decision on Ange Postecoglou, but the chances of...

sportsview.co.uk

Fresh Ange Postecoglou sack update emerges out of Tottenham

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[kb 1984]

Football journalist at The Independent.



It’s in his weekly Reading the Game newsletter which you can sign up to through The Independent. The comments are being widely carried in a lot of news websites.

Ange Postecoglou still expected to leave Tottenham Hotspur despite no official decision made as of today | SportsView

Tottenham Hotspur manager Ange Postecoglou is still expected to leave the club despite winning the Europa League, according to the Independent journalist Miguel Delaney. “As of Friday morning, Tottenham Hotspur still hadn’t made an official decision on Ange Postecoglou, but the chances of...

sportsview.co.uk

Fresh Ange Postecoglou sack update emerges out of Tottenham

The manager's future is still in doubt

www.givemesport.com

Thanks for posting. As I live in Oz could you tell me if he is reliable when it comes to us.

 

[Bishop]

Every team gets injuries, no one is saying they are going to miraculously disappear. But Ange was clearly rotating more and waiting longer before bringing injured players back into the fold compared to before the injury nightmare, we wasn't getting a new substantial injury every week in the second half of the season like we was the first....

Ermm Madison, Kulu, Bergvall, Solanke and now Vicario. The injuries haven't abated at all.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Before the game I was very much Ange out regardless of the result but winning the bloody trophy changes things. I’d be ok with him taking charge next season but on a short leash. If we start badly in the first 10 games then he’s gone IMO or he should be. My only concern is will he now be loyal to certain players who need to be binned like Bissouma, Richarlison and Vicario for instance.

 

[harr1984]

Ermm Madison, Kulu, Bergvall, Solanke and now Vicario. The injuries haven't abated at all.

Yes they have, that is nothing compared to what we went through first half of the season. And injuries are everywhere now in the modern game with all the extra games these guys are going through. Brighton apparently suffered more players out with injuries than us, Bournemouth had a big injury crisis too both with no Europe.

It's just the realities of playing in the fast paced PL, Ange has clearly been adapting since last time, injuries are still going to happen to us and every other club....

 

[Bishop]

Before the game I was very much Ange out regardless of the result but winning the bloody trophy changes things. I’d be ok with him taking charge next season but on a short leash. If we start badly in the first 10 games then he’s gone IMO or he should be. My only concern is will he now be loyal to certain players who need to be binned like Bissouma, Richarlison and Vicario for instance.

I had decided I was Ange out a couple of weeks before the final and honestly nothing has changed for me.

I kind of don't see the point in giving him a trial period next season as that's just puts us in a bad place in terms of summer recruitment and a lack of preseason for the new manager.

If we don't sack him now then realistically we have to commit to him for the entire season otherwise what's the point ? Besides his supporters will always find an excuse. Next season I expect to hear about the difficulty of playing PL and CL games, injuries, settlement times for new players etc.

Sack the man now or give him the entire season good or bad.

 

[Jurgen the German]

I had decided I was Ange out a couple of weeks before the final and honestly nothing has changed for me.

I kind of don't see the point in giving him a trial period next season as that's just puts us in a bad place in terms of summer recruitment and a lack of preseason for the new manager.

If we don't sack him now then realistically we have to commit to him for the entire season otherwise what's the point ? Besides his supporters will always find an excuse. Next season I expect to hear about the difficulty of playing PL and CL games, injuries, settlement times for new players etc.

Sack the man now or give him the entire season good or bad.

I can’t disagree with your reasoning and I agree his fans will always make excuses for him. But I feel winning the Europa League should be him a little more time. Not a whole season though. If the first 6-10 games begin in a similar vein to the end of last season (bar the final) then he gets the chop.