Richarlison

[P.D.]

I thought we didn't accept the bids from Turkey or Brazil so it's partly our fault if we didn't as well.

Interesting that Bergvall signed a new contract after wanting to leave, shows there's definitely some team spirit there if he was convinced. We won't offer Richie a new contract but that's for different reasons.

 

[Baleforce]

I thought we didn't accept the bids from Turkey or Brazil so it's partly our fault if we didn't as well.

Interesting that Bergvall signed a new contract after wanting to leave, shows there's definitely some team spirit there if he was convinced. We won't offer Richie a new contract but that's for different reasons.

Yeah the completely different treatment of the two is interesting.

 

[Clarky]

In Dubai we trust.

 

[Bullet]

Ok, so why did he start vs Brentford then??

Good point! In my head we had to name the Prem squad before the Prem started, but of course that makes too much sense.
I guess Richie was our only fit striker with Solanke hobbling and Marmoush/Savio not around etc??? I can't remember that far back man!


I presume RDZ realises Richie is very clunky and is not a player we really want leading the line, he does score but he also kills attacking flow, so RDZ pushed hard for more skilful players like Gakpo, Ndiaye, Marmoush etc.


I was explaining to a Liverpool supporting friend that we replaced an entire team pretty much, just one player missing iirc.
He was amazed how much squad reshuffle we had achieved in one window. So I guess not EVERYTHING panned out perfectly.

Dubravka
Tosin VanHecke Senesi Robertson
Fernandes Tonali
Savio Marmoush Mudryk
X

 

[Mikey10]

Something has happened between that Brentford game and Richarlison not being registered.

My suspicion is that RDZ is quite impatient and volatile with his attacking players and Richi was told that he played like sh!t and things blew up from there.

Think what happened with Tel times a hundred because Richarlison himself is quite emotional/volatile.

This whole "Richjarlison said he wanted to leave in the summer" doesn't make sense when you remember he started vs Brentford....

I'm not sure we can base anything on supporters' suspicions; which is kind of the issue. None of us know.

What we do know is that the player is acting up on social media like some sort of teenager who has been told that he's been banned from the youth club.

The club should surely be looking at his behaviour/messaging for breach of contract clauses. Or is it fine for someone taking £90,000 per week from their employer to get on like this? I know I'd be out the door without having time to clear my desk if I did it.

 

[Bishop]

Ok, so why did he start vs Brentford then??

Solanke wasn't fully fit yet (and still isn't) and Marmoush wasn't yet signed. Richy was the only real option.

Sucha brick position to be in when Richy and Solanke are your striking options. We've seen this story for 2 seasons, we already know the ending.

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

I thought we didn't accept the bids from Turkey or Brazil so it's partly our fault if we didn't as well.

Interesting that Bergvall signed a new contract after wanting to leave, shows there's definitely some team spirit there if he was convinced. We won't offer Richie a new contract but that's for different reasons.

I don’t think we know exactly what happened with the Turkey bid. It doesn’t make sense that we would accept a presumably lower one from Brazil but not accept the Turkey one.

In any case, Richy is acting like a child on social media about this. It’s all very well both sides having their own incentives and their own ground to hold. There are multiple sides to this. But he is acting like it is incomprehensible that he cannot play with the team now. He doesn’t get it, and he’s trying to draw out sympathy for himself against the club and the manager.

He is acting irrationally and miscalculated. Clearly the club having to pay him to not play is a risk they judged worth taking, for the larger message it sends.

 

[Baleforce]

I don’t think we know exactly what happened with the Turkey bid. It doesn’t make sense that we would accept a presumably lower one from Brazil but not accept the Turkey one.

In any case, Richy is acting like a child on social media about this. It’s all very well both sides having their own incentives and their own ground to hold. There are multiple sides to this. But he is acting like it is incomprehensible that he cannot play with the team now. He doesn’t get it, and he’s trying to draw out sympathy for himself against the club and the manager.

He is acting irrationally and miscalculated. Clearly the club having to pay him to not play is a risk they judged worth taking, for the larger message it sends.

So we don't know exactly what happened, but it's clearly all Richie's fault?

I'd say it's also irrational and a miscalculation to leave your best goal scorer out of the squad, did he not score more goals last season than Solanko, Savio and Marmoush combined?

Social media isn't anything to get hung up on imo.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

So we don't know exactly what happened, but it's clearly all Richie's fault?

I'd say it's also irrational and a miscalculation to leave your best goal scorer out of the squad, did he not score more goals last season than Solanko, Savio and Marmoush combined?

Social media isn't anything to get hung up on imo.

I think the point most are ignoring is regardless of their quality we were having to rely on Solanke and Richy for goals and now its just Solanke. I am not here to say either are world beaters but I do think many are towing this, new regime can't be wrong party line to justify why we are now a striker down when our options were on the floor. Forget about blame we fcukign need goals and we have one striker on the naughty step, its a mess no matter how any of us paint it

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

So we don't know exactly what happened, but it's clearly all Richie's fault?

I'd say it's also irrational and a miscalculation to leave your best goal scorer out of the squad, did he not score more goals last season than Solanko, Savio and Marmoush combined?

Social media isn't anything to get hung up on imo.

We don’t know exactly what happened, but only one side of this is acting like a child on social media. I’m not hung up on it, I’m sure the club aren’t too fussed and will continue about their business. It just makes Richy look bad.

We do know what RDZ has explained. And even just knowing that, I’d say Richy is acting in a poor way.

If we assume there is no benefit to the club culture and a reinforcement of standards and motivation by leaving him out, then yes, it’s a miscalculation from the club. But if we assume there is a benefit to that, then Richy has miscalculated. The club will play football every week. He won’t.

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

I think the point most are ignoring is regardless of their quality we were having to rely on Solanke and Richy for goals and now it’s just Solanke. I am not here to say either are world beaters but I do think many are towing this, new regime can't be wrong party line to justify why we are now a striker down when our options were on the floor. Forget about blame we fcukign need goals and we have one striker on the naughty step, its a mess no matter how any of us paint it

Even if he was registered, Richy would be behind Solanke and Marmoush in the selection order. Probably also behind Tel upfront too.

We also need goals, and will start scoring them as the team clicks in possession. I don’t think our problems are solved by Richy suddenly playing. Our problems are solved by chemistry, cohesion and confidence coming together in attack.

He’s on the naughty step because we are trying to send a message, to build a culture, to reinforce standards and to not have anyone in the team who is half in or half out. Every other player was afforded the opportunity to find a move and took it if they wanted to leave. This allowed us to sign replacements that actually wanted to be here. He has managed to not find a move despite multiple opportunities, but clearly the club needs it to be known if you say you want to leave, you need a move otherwise you will not play here anymore, because we do not want players who do not really want to be here. This has benefits to culture, to motivation, to the intensity. All of these things will pay off over the course of a season. We are not going to have people going through the motions seeing out their contracts anymore, and I’m delighted about that.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

Even if he was registered, Richy would be behind Solanke and Marmoush in the selection order. Probably also behind Tel upfront too.

He would not be behind Tel as a Striker, he hasn't been for 12 months ever, so not sure he would be no, other than just because. Solanke can't stay fit, which plays into my reckoning on the subject. I love Marmoush but he isn't a striker in the traditional sense, he isn't playing the 9 role like anyone else is in the PL and it is showing in his lack of real threat to now (bar NF).

We also need goals, and will start scoring them as the team clicks in possession. I don’t think our problems are solved by Richy suddenly playing. Our problems are solved by chemistry, cohesion and confidence coming together in attack.

He scored 11 PL goals last season, you take them out the side as a stat alone and the prospect for goals in this side diminishes even further in a side that as pointed out previously, as players, have not scored enough goals in any season in the PL. I have said this isn't about Richy per say, its about the fact we need his goals.

I am not being harsh but this is what I am talking about mate, its the copium of everything is fine, when we have yet to score a goal this season, I don't rate Richy but I take the fact he can score a goal above what the alternatives seem to be and can at worse be moving forward should we get injuries, which seems likely every week. Thats the point really.

He’s on the naughty step because we are trying to send a message, to build a culture, to reinforce standards and to not have anyone in the team who is half in or half out. Every other player was afforded the opportunity to find a move and took it if they wanted to leave. This allowed us to sign replacements that actually wanted to be here. He has managed to not find a move despite multiple opportunities, but clearly the club needs it to be known if you say you want to leave, you need a move otherwise you will not play here anymore, because we do not want players who do not really want to be here. This has benefits to culture, to motivation, to the intensity. All of these things will pay off over the course of a season. We are not going to have people going through the motions seeing out their contracts anymore, and I’m delighted about that.

We all know that, this is not a defence of Richy this is a point of fact that the situation regardless who is to blame (neither you or me know) has stuffed us in an area in which we are clearly struggling and needed help with in the summer.

The lack of adding a striker and the Richy situation stuffs us for additional goals, thats the long and short of it, no blame no defence of anyone on any side, thats just the reality

I get people all want to be on the "all is fine" train, but it is ok to observe and see a situation for what it is. We are a striker down in a team that does not seem to be scoring goals. Thats a HUGE worry

 

[Baleforce]

Even if he was registered, Richy would be behind Solanke and Marmoush in the selection order. Probably also behind Tel upfront too.

We also need goals, and will start scoring them as the team clicks in possession. I don’t think our problems are solved by Richy suddenly playing. Our problems are solved by chemistry, cohesion and confidence coming together in attack.

He’s on the naughty step because we are trying to send a message, to build a culture, to reinforce standards and to not have anyone in the team who is half in or half out. Every other player was afforded the opportunity to find a move and took it if they wanted to leave. This allowed us to sign replacements that actually wanted to be here. He has managed to not find a move despite multiple opportunities, but clearly the club needs it to be known if you say you want to leave, you need a move otherwise you will not play here anymore, because we do not want players who do not really want to be here. This has benefits to culture, to motivation, to the intensity. All of these things will pay off over the course of a season. We are not going to have people going through the motions seeing out their contracts anymore, and I’m delighted about that.

Bergvall was more vocal over the summer regarding moving on.

He has been treated differently.

I think RDZ has been just a performative as Richie here, only he is doing it in press conferences rather than on instagram.

RDZ has jumped on a very high horse imo.

It’s also needlessly stubborn during an injury crisis to rule out a fit and available player.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

Bergvall was more vocal over the summer regarding moving on.

He has been treated differently.

I think RDZ has been just a performative as Richie here, only he is doing it in press conferences rather than on instagram.

RDZ has jumped on a very high horse imo.

It’s also needlessly stubborn during an injury crisis to rule out a fit and available player.

Seem to be far too much ease at which people view the Richy situation because of their bias against the player rather than looking at the wider implication of the situation and taking that element out of it.

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

Bergvall was more vocal over the summer regarding moving on.

He has been treated differently.

I think RDZ has been just a performative as Richie here, only he is doing it in press conferences rather than on instagram.

RDZ has jumped on a very high horse imo.

It’s also needlessly stubborn during an injury crisis to rule out a fit and available player.

Clearly the Bergval conversation was more ‘yes we’ve signed other players, but we love you and want to keep you, can we convince you to stay?’ to which Bergval said ‘yes’ and he deserves massive props for doing it.

Richy is an experienced player who outright said he would not extend his contract and wanted to move. Of course he’s been treated differently.

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

Seem to be far too much ease at which people view the Richy situation because of their bias against the player rather than looking at the wider implication of the situation and taking that element out of it.

I’d ask you not to be assuming bias or some other motive for the thoughts that I or anyone else has. I have never been ‘anti Richy’ and I am also not so blind towards the owners that I wouldn’t criticise them. I did that plenty last season. But I also think they’ve done a fantastic job this summer and everything around the club they can influence has been pointing in a direction I personally have wanted to see ever since I gave up on Levy being the right guy for us years ago.

In this situation, I am calling it like I see it. I may be wrong, but I care more about building a culture again than I do about a backwards looking idea of how many goals Richy scored last season in a terrible team playing a different way for the most part. I think we have enough upfront without him, especially with no Europe, and I am actively glad that we have a manager who wants to create a squad of players that actively want to be here because I think it will pay off long term and enable us to over perform. I have never been anti Richy, just in this situation I think he’s miscalculated, and I’m not remotely fussed that he isn’t registered because I believe the cultural benefits override it.

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

He would not be behind Tel as a Striker, he hasn't been for 12 months ever, so not sure he would be no, other than just because. Solanke can't stay fit, which plays into my reckoning on the subject. I love Marmoush but he isn't a striker in the traditional sense, he isn't playing the 9 role like anyone else is in the PL and it is showing in his lack of real threat to now (bar NF).



He scored 11 PL goals last season, you take them out the side as a stat alone and the prospect for goals in this side diminishes even further in a side that as pointed out previously, as players, have not scored enough goals in any season in the PL. I have said this isn't about Richy per say, its about the fact we need his goals.

I am not being harsh but this is what I am talking about mate, its the copium of everything is fine, when we have yet to score a goal this season, I don't rate Richy but I take the fact he can score a goal above what the alternatives seem to be and can at worse be moving forward should we get injuries, which seems likely every week. Thats the point really.



We all know that, this is not a defence of Richy this is a point of fact that the situation regardless who is to blame (neither you or me know) has stuffed us in an area in which we are clearly struggling and needed help with in the summer.

The lack of adding a striker and the Richy situation stuffs us for additional goals, thats the long and short of it, no blame no defence of anyone on any side, thats just the reality

I get people all want to be on the "all is fine" train, but it is ok to observe and see a situation for what it is. We are a striker down in a team that does not seem to be scoring goals. Thats a HUGE worry

I simply think that when the team clicks in attack we will start scoring goals and they will be spread around. RDZ has repeatedly talked about different players being capable of getting 10-15 goals and that’s clearly what he’s aiming for. I think the system will ultimately create that.

I don’t think it’s as simple to say we’ve taken Richy’s goals out, so we’re gonna struggle for goals. We have not clicked in attack yet with a more complicated system to play, which has tended to take a while to heat up when implemented at other clubs too.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

I’d ask you not to be assuming bias or some other motive for the thoughts that I or anyone else has. I have never been ‘anti Richy’ and I am also not so blind towards the owners that I wouldn’t criticise them. I did that plenty last season. But I also think they’ve done a fantastic job this summer and everything around the club they can influence has been pointing in a direction I personally have wanted to see ever since I gave up on Levy being the right guy for us years ago.

In this situation, I am calling it like I see it. I may be wrong, but I care more about building a culture again than I do about a backwards looking idea of how many goals Richy scored last season in a terrible team playing a different way for the most part. I think we have enough upfront without him, especially with no Europe, and I am actively glad that we have a manager who wants to create a squad of players that actively want to be here because I think it will pay off long term and enable us to over perform. I have never been anti Richy, just in this situation I think he’s miscalculated, and I’m not remotely fussed that he isn’t registered because I believe the cultural benefits override it.

There are people who are, I never said you, I will also say what I see with this also. If this was a 20 goal a season striker the feeling would be different. I know this fanbase and football fans well enough to know that. Hell many wanted us to get Greenwood.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

I simply think that when the team clicks in attack we will start scoring goals and they will be spread around. RDZ has repeatedly talked about different players being capable of getting 10-15 goals and that’s clearly what he’s aiming for. I think the system will ultimately create that.

I don’t think it’s as simple to say we’ve taken Richy’s goals out, so we’re gonna struggle for goals. We have not clicked in attack yet with a more complicated system to play, which has tended to take a while to heat up when implemented at other clubs too.

I think you can absolutely wonder and question where goals will come from when those that are left have no history of getting goals in the PL.

We are relying on some break out seasons till Christmas, the lack of goals so far isn't just coincidence

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

There are people who are, I never said you, I will also say what I see with this also. If this was a 20 goal a season striker the feeling would be different. I know this fanbase and football fans well enough to know that. Hell many wanted us to get Greenwood.

My biggest thing that I have been consistent with ever since we sacked Poch is the culture that he created allowed the whole to be greater than the sum of the parts. But there were steps he took early doors to establish that, and it does take being a little bit controversial or creating some enemies so that the people that you actually want will rally behind you.

He started and first used Kaboul, Adebayor etc. and then for a few months we were very inconsistent. I think Adebayor was even talking in the press about how it wasn’t working and needed to start working. And then we get to that League Cup game where Mason scores, and he, Bentaleb, Kane, Townsend basically form a core along with Dier that really buys in. Because they knew that buying in was going to get them the exposure and development they wanted on a rapid timescale. And then you get people like Jan go along with it too. And then when Poch drops Townsend because he talks back to the fitness coach, it’s again a reinforcement of those standards.

For the years since we sacked him, we completely lost that foundation that allowed us to compete. We let players like Eriksen hang around despite obviously wanting to move on. We then enter an era under Paratici where he can find great talent but it’s questionable how it all comes together to build a culture. Maybe we had Juventus standards in how we expected our away accommodation to look and feel, but I don’t think we had it on the pitch. We never took the steps to create it.

So the reason I am really happy with what we are doing with Richy is because I look at it like we are back at the start of creating something special, like we did with Poch. It’s these sort of markers, these lines that leaders draw, which show a squad what is expected and where the line is. I truly believe the goals will come and the system will spread them around. But the long term benefits of establishing the right behaviours and expectations will pay off over the course of the next 2-3 years.