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Repetitive bickering and point scoring about money and our transfer policy

Jimmy B -thanks that's a bit clearer. Any idea how much he could choose to invest though, disposable income so to speak?

I've no idea what is income is or what his liquid asset situation is. I wouldn't want to speculate.

But at one extreme end of the spectrum, there's no reason why he couldn't sell off all his other investments and property and invest every penny from the proceeds in the club.

Obviously, that's not going to happen, though!
 
Why would there be no incentive to invest until ENIC were sole owners? As long as they were majority shareholders they could appoint board members and pretty much run the entire company.


I didn't think they had 100% of the company yet.

You made the point that ENIC hadn't just given money to the club; that they had received shares in return for their investment.

I merely made the further, clarifying point that there would have been no incentive for them to have invested money into the club if they hadn't received shares in return. That's because Spurs' situation isn't analogous to clubs with single owners.
 
:ross: at the title of this thread.

It's amazing how repetitive bickering is at an all time high, since Arcy and KD rode back into town together...
 
I've no idea what is income is or what his liquid asset situation is. I wouldn't want to speculate.

But at one extreme end of the spectrum, there's no reason why he couldn't sell off all his other investments and property and invest every penny from the proceeds in the club.

Obviously, that's not going to happen, though!

OK, so let's assume he has spent less than £20m of a £1bn+ fortune, is Tottenham Hotspur actually that good an investment? I mean, what is he getting/likely to get in return?

I'm not asking with any particular agenda here, I'm just curious.
 
OK, so let's assume he has spent less than £20m of a £1bn+ fortune, is Tottenham Hotspur actually that good an investment? I mean, what is he getting/likely to get in return?

I'm not asking with any particular agenda here, I'm just curious.

They were rumoured to be asking for £300m a few years back and I'd imagine they'd want more once everything is in place for the new stadium, which is a very decent return on their investment
 
OK, so let's assume he has spent less than £20m of a £1bn+ fortune, is Tottenham Hotspur actually that good an investment? I mean, what is he getting/likely to get in return?

I'm not asking with any particular agenda here, I'm just curious.

Investing in ANY football club only brings a return when you can sell them for a profit unless you invest via shares and can claim dividends from them. So to answer your question no it's not a good investment.

What would he get in return, probably only abuse from the fans when he doesn't stick in another £10m.
 
Re: what has happened to the transfer section?

I would be bothered. I didn't say i wouldn't be.


However if it was due to injections from the owner i wouldn't really give a brick if we did win. It would feel hollow.

I have to agree with that, I remember the bad times before ENIC when we weren't even around the top 4, I'd much rather prefer that over a Chelsea or Emirates Marketing Project overnight job..
 
Am I the only one who thinks that opinions like "Lewis and Levy need to just put more money into the club" smacks of a sense of entitlement?
 
OK, so let's assume he has spent less than £20m of a £1bn+ fortune, is Tottenham Hotspur actually that good an investment? I mean, what is he getting/likely to get in return?

I'm not asking with any particular agenda here, I'm just curious.

Ah, well that's another matter altogether.

You're now talking about what it has cost ENIC to own what they now own of Tottenham. I used to have all the figures and a list of the key events but not any more, I'm afraid. I'll try to recall it as best I can.

When ENIC first agreed to buy 27% of the club from Alan Sugar in late 2000, they already owned some 3% of the club. They paid Sugar a little over £21 million for that 27%, if memory serves. So their overall investment at that stage was probably around £24 million.

The subsequent January 2004 share issue cost them a further £11 million but increased their shareholding to about 55%.

They subsequently bought the remainder of Sugar's shareholding for £25 million, I think, in 2007. By this stage, therefore, ENIC had paid a total of £60 million for a little over 65% of the club.

ENIC then made an offer for all remaining shares in the club. I vaguely remember that that left them with a shareholding of a little over 75%. If they paid the same for those shares as they had paid for Sugar's, then it would have cost them in the region of a further £25 million - taking their overall investment to £85 million.

Since then, they've also contributed 100% of the £15 million raised in the 2009 share placement. And they might have hoovered up a few more shares too.

So £100 million in total. Maybe a bit more. And, in return, they now own 85% of the club.

Has it been a good investment? Yes. Emphatically so.

When the stadium is built, the club will be worth north of £500 million. So ENIC's profit will be north of £300 million or, in percentage terms, 400%. Not bad. Not bad at all!
 
Ah, well that's another matter altogether.

You're now talking about what it has cost ENIC to own what they now own of Tottenham. I used to have all the figures and a list of the key events but not any more, I'm afraid. I'll try to recall it as best I can.

When ENIC first agreed to buy 27% of the club from Alan Sugar in late 2000, they already owned some 3% of the club. They paid Sugar a little over £21 million for that 27%, if memory serves. So their overall investment at that stage was probably around £24 million.

The subsequent January 2004 share issue cost them a further £11 million but increased their shareholding to about 55%.

They subsequently bought the remainder of Sugar's shareholding for £25 million, I think, in 2007. By this stage, therefore, ENIC had paid a total of £60 million for a little over 65% of the club.

ENIC then made an offer for all remaining shares in the club. I vaguely remember that that left them with a shareholding of a little over 75%. If they paid the same for those shares as they had paid for Sugar's, then it would have cost them in the region of a further £25 million - taking their overall investment to £85 million.

Since then, they've also contributed 100% of the £15 million raised in the 2009 share placement. And they might have hoovered up a few more shares too.

So £100 million in total. Maybe a bit more. And, in return, they now own 85% of the club.

Has it been a good investment? Yes. Emphatically so.

When the stadium is built, the club will be worth north of £500 million. So ENIC's profit will be north of £300 million or, in percentage terms, 400%. Not bad. Not bad at all!

Top post.

Spending in an unsustainable manner would reduce the value of the club which is why it is unrealistic to think that ENIC would consider doing so. They've bought us as an investment and they are not going to act in a way that would reduce the return on their investment or adopt a high risk approach.
 
Am I the only one who thinks that opinions like "Lewis and Levy need to just put more money into the club" smacks of a sense of entitlement?

Completely agree.
Reminds me of Everton fans last year saying that they deserved a billionaire to come in to buy the club.
 
bickering? it's actually a pretty good debate. Posts like yours turn debates to arguments.

Absolutely this

Whoever made the thread title should really take time and re-evaluate what is the kind of debate they want to stimulate/promote in this place.

This has probably been one of the better topics lately with good input from both sides as opposed to some live scores updates or an ITK reachaournd of pointless 'agreement'
 
They were rumoured to be asking for £300m a few years back and I'd imagine they'd want more once everything is in place for the new stadium, which is a very decent return on their investment

When do you anticipate the 'new stadium' would commence / be completed?
 
Let me put it this way - do you think it would still happen under ENIC?

The rumour a couple of years ago was that ENIC would sell once approvals and finance was in place for the stadium, with AEG the rumoured buyers. The first part seems like a reasonable assumption to me because it is probably the point where they maximize the return on their investment but I don't have anything to back this up.
 
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