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Pre Season Thread

Exactly, thats where I think most people are. If you are going to sell talent like Vusko and Bergvall for example then you have to deliver on the path you choose working.

For all the youth that havent been deemed good enough I can name as many expensive mistakes we bought who are the same.

Its clearly a balance

It's interesting the 2 names you pull out of the hat. I don't think RDZ was phased by Vusko's reputation and was probably more on the thought process of whether the young guy was going to subserve to his manager and get his head down to fight for a place. That Vuskovic sale probably sent a big message to guys like Bergval who has always had it quite easy in their early career. Lucas was always ahead of his age group and playing first team football. He's at that point of inflexion now where he in the bigger pool and needs to fight a 22 year old Fernandes for a shirt. Mateus has done it the other way where he's lost 2 relegation scraps for Saints and Hammers but picked up a ton of experience.

I'm still in the camp where I'd love to see Gray and Bergval completely trust RDZ with their careers.
 
It's interesting the 2 names you pull out of the hat. I don't think RDZ was phased by Vusko's reputation and was probably more on the thought process of whether the young guy was going to subserve to his manager and get his head down to fight for a place. That Vuskovic sale probably sent a big message to guys like Bergval who has always had it quite easy in their early career. Lucas was always ahead of his age group and playing first team football. He's at that point of inflexion now where he in the bigger pool and needs to fight a 22 year old Fernandes for a shirt. Mateus has done it the other way where he's lost 2 relegation scraps for Saints and Hammers but picked up a ton of experience.

I'm still in the camp where I'd love to see Gray and Bergval completely trust RDZ with their careers.
Yeh and look I am ok with it for sure, time will tell if swapping out Vusko got JPVH will pay dividends long term
 
I'm not sure "not seeing age" is 100% a good thing - clubs need to develop younger players and part of that requires making allowances for their inexperience.
I think it's more about not discriminating against young players more than totally forgetting about considering their age. I doubt he thinks LWB is ready, but I don't think he will be looking to get rid of him bar a loan either.

Also worth considering specifically for this season with no Europe and our aspirations it is difficult to develop them in our squad. Hopefully we get some good loans for them this season....
 
I'm not sure "not seeing age" is 100% a good thing - clubs need to develop younger players and part of that requires making allowances for their inexperience.
Agree completely, it’s needs to be a balance between seeing a players potential and where they are in the here and now, and deciding will training and being around the first team or going on loan suit them better.
 
Agree completely, it’s needs to be a balance between seeing a players potential and where they are in the here and now, and deciding will training and being around the first team or going on loan suit them better.

It's also about the "2 players for each position" model. If RDZ is age agnostic then he has to believe that if Madds or Kudus can't start a game then LWB can perform at that level in their place. Once you have 22 players there is only a 2 or 3 realistic slots left. Obviously, Davies has one and Austin has another. We have an abundance of centre mids taking more of these slots.

I also think it is about age and maturity. I think it was right to keep a 16/17 year old Moore at the club training with the first team. As an 18 year old, it was fine to get out on loan because he passed some maturity tests with the club. Nothing to with his football ability. LWB is still 17 and we can see some amazing confidence on the pitch. Off the pitch none of us know whether a move out of the family home and a different lifestyle will be the making of him. It's university entry age when you think about it.
 
I think it's more about not discriminating against young players more than totally forgetting about considering their age. I doubt he thinks LWB is ready, but I don't think he will be looking to get rid of him bar a loan either.

Also worth considering specifically for this season with no Europe and our aspirations it is difficult to develop them in our squad. Hopefully we get some good loans for them this season....
Im more a believer that less games means more opportunities for minutes.
 
Im more a believer that less games means more opportunities for minutes.

Admittedly, I'm left confused with the entire thing. We've just about seen it all in the last 2-3 years.

For me, logically the best opportunity for kids to make breakthroughs is EL/ECL campaign seasons and of course these pre-season tours that coincide with WC/Euro summers. You would also think that injury periods for the 1st team open doors but that hasn't really happened. Just ask a kid like Olusesi who sat on his hands for endless games only to come on a look like he should have been used way more for cameos.

The Elfsborg game was probably the highlight for me with Scarlett doing his thing and enabling Ajayi and Moore with assists. That was a great day for the club.

This season will be interesting. The squad is close to converging to 2 players per position. Prior to Xmas, the league cup campaign will be an opportunity for players to get a much needed 90 mins. Then as the FA Cup kicks in, we can continue with the rotation. Personally, I don't think the younger players will be that prominent though.
 
It’s about 10 hours after the match and the full replay is still unavailable on Spursplay. I raised a similar issue on Wednesday, suggesting they should have anticipated the potential numbers looking to view. Given the 4am kick off today, they should have also expected a significant number of people looking to watch the replay on Sunday morning.
 
I'm hoping we avoid the dreadful injury problems we've had in the last 2 seasons and it allows us to give young players a chance, last year our team was struggling with injuries, lost of form and confidence plus adapting to major system change. It was hard to expect young players to come in to a side like that and perform. Young players may have talent but they're lacking in experience and this really shows when a team is struggling. DeZebri pick his most experienced players to keep us in the division and I expect him to rely on a similar plan when the season starts, if we are playing well and with confidence I think he'ii give those he thinks are ready a chance gradually.
 
If that is the choice then it’s a no brainer..

"Get the fudge out of this team, Manor!"
"Literally celebrated a post celebrating Hind Rajabs death you dirty that'sfudge this ZIONIST TERRORIST OFF"
"Fk off out of my club"
"Get this Zionist clam out of my club"
"Get this dirty little genocide supporting rat out my club "

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Just a temperature guage on the idea of him playing for us after his social media posts
 
Admittedly, I'm left confused with the entire thing. We've just about seen it all in the last 2-3 years.

For me, logically the best opportunity for kids to make breakthroughs is EL/ECL campaign seasons and of course these pre-season tours that coincide with WC/Euro summers. You would also think that injury periods for the 1st team open doors but that hasn't really happened. Just ask a kid like Olusesi who sat on his hands for endless games only to come on a look like he should have been used way more for cameos.

The Elfsborg game was probably the highlight for me with Scarlett doing his thing and enabling Ajayi and Moore with assists. That was a great day for the club.

This season will be interesting. The squad is close to converging to 2 players per position. Prior to Xmas, the league cup campaign will be an opportunity for players to get a much needed 90 mins. Then as the FA Cup kicks in, we can continue with the rotation. Personally, I don't think the younger players will be that prominent though.

For me I think less is more and with less comes more stability and improvements in the team in a year like the one we have ahead. With that improvement comes more scenarios in which you bring kids into stable situations where you are up by 2 with 15 to go which it much more conducive to development on all levels than what we have seen the club do in the previous couple of years.

I also am not a fan of what we have done in years where we have made so many changes in cups like the EL etc where you end up having such a disjointed look that invariably the kids look like rabbits in a headlight and then get targeted as not good enough. Also what generally happens is those games dry up when getting through means more and the kids don't get seen again when it hits the business end.

For me you need to have real time, real competitive scenarios where you have someone come into a settled side to show what they can do, rather than something like we might have served up previously which would be "lad we are 2 down with 30 mins, off you go and show what you can do"........whats not progress or development for me.

For balance, I am not a believer in having loads of kids round the squad for the sake of it, or filling the bench with it (unless you have to), but I see a massive opportunity for a season like next where you take your greatest youth asset like in our case LWB and integrate him into games where the scenario is suitable and for me those seasons come when you are not in loads of comps, that comes when your base side AKA the PL side is so improved and can offer up those chances, IMO that comes with less European distractions.

It isn't a maths problem in terms of opportunities, its a quality of opportunity and environment problem IMO
 
"Get the fudge out of this team, Manor!"
"Literally celebrated a post celebrating Hind Rajabs death you dirty that'sfudge this ZIONIST TERRORIST OFF"
"Fk off out of my club"
"Get this Zionist clam out of my club"
"Get this dirty little genocide supporting rat out my club "

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For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Just a temperature guage on the idea of him playing for us after his social media posts

Another lovely endorsement of Spurs social media, its a pit
 
"Get the fudge out of this team, Manor!"
"Literally celebrated a post celebrating Hind Rajabs death you dirty that'sfudge this ZIONIST TERRORIST OFF"
"Fk off out of my club"
"Get this Zionist clam out of my club"
"Get this dirty little genocide supporting rat out my club "

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Just a temperature guage on the idea of him playing for us after his social media posts

Social media does not reflect the fan base that attend games closely at all.
 
"Get the fudge out of this team, Manor!"
"Literally celebrated a post celebrating Hind Rajabs death you dirty that'sfudge this ZIONIST TERRORIST OFF"
"Fk off out of my club"
"Get this Zionist clam out of my club"
"Get this dirty little genocide supporting rat out my club "

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Just a temperature guage on the idea of him playing for us after his social media posts
That’s a reflection of the posters themselves isn’t it? Should Danso not play because of the racist abuse he got after the Brighton game?

What’s Solomon done to receive that abuse other than be Israeli?
 
That’s a reflection of the posters themselves isn’t it? Should Danso not play because of the racist abuse he got after the Brighton game?

What’s Solomon done to receive that abuse other than be Israeli?

I think he does post and share a lot of pro Israeli content on his socials to be fair.
 
For me I think less is more and with less comes more stability and improvements in the team in a year like the one we have ahead. With that improvement comes more scenarios in which you bring kids into stable situations where you are up by 2 with 15 to go which it much more conducive to development on all levels than what we have seen the club do in the previous couple of years.

I also am not a fan of what we have done in years where we have made so many changes in cups like the EL etc where you end up having such a disjointed look that invariably the kids look like rabbits in a headlight and then get targeted as not good enough. Also what generally happens is those games dry up when getting through means more and the kids don't get seen again when it hits the business end.

For me you need to have real time, real competitive scenarios where you have someone come into a settled side to show what they can do, rather than something like we might have served up previously which would be "lad we are 2 down with 30 mins, off you go and show what you can do"........whats not progress or development for me.

For balance, I am not a believer in having loads of kids round the squad for the sake of it, or filling the bench with it (unless you have to), but I see a massive opportunity for a season like next where you take your greatest youth asset like in our case LWB and integrate him into games where the scenario is suitable and for me those seasons come when you are not in loads of comps, that comes when your base side AKA the PL side is so improved and can offer up those chances, IMO that comes with less European distractions.

It isn't a maths problem in terms of opportunities, its a quality of opportunity and environment problem IMO

Do you think we would have LWB as one of the 20 man squad though when we're in that 2-0 up position with 20 mins to go?

It all sounds great, but I've not seen that ruthlessness in any Spurs manager with the older players.
 
Do you think we would have LWB as one of the 20 man squad though when we're in that 2-0 up position with 20 mins to go?

It all sounds great, but I've not seen that ruthlessness in any Spurs manager with the older players.

Thats a totally different question hahaha, but its certainly the basis of how I would bring kids through.

I think chucking kids into EL dead rubbers isn't development
 
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