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Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

galeforce said:
It’s been nearly two years since that election, we know a fair bit more now.
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Yeah about project fear and that a lot of companies have chief excs who are European and been getting back handers from their home governments. Also we know it is now the plan that the EU want to control taxation and that we can not do our own trade deals, create our own laws or control our own borders.

Even with 3 years of project fear, leave is still up in the 40's per cent.

They will keep going till they get the answer they want, the EU has previous on this, democracy pfft it has already gone, sad really.
 
Danishfurniturelover said:
Yeah about project fear and that a lot of companies have chief excs who are European and been getting back handers from their home governments. Also we know it is now the plan that the EU want to control taxation and that we can not do our own trade deals, create our own laws or control our own borders.

Even with 3 years of project fear, leave is still up in the 40's per cent.

They will keep going till they get the answer they want, the EU has previous on this, democracy pfft it has already gone, sad really.
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So you admit things have changed massively?
 
Danishfurniturelover said:
Well maybe I am mad but I would actually say we need to make more cuts.

When I was that age I had to work to put a roof over my head, then of course I wanted to make money to go to watch Tottenham and chase girls. Lets stop giving any benefits to anyone who carries a knife or their mothers, so the mums have to kick them onto the streets, then lets see if they want to be a gangster sleeping in a shop doorway or perhaps go and work at a Tesco express for a few years to make them understand the real world, when after a few years hard work they decide to go to evening school to get qualified as a plumber or whatever.

So cuts to jobseekers allowance and other benefits like child tax credits for the parents and put all that money into adult education and building new prisons. Carrot and stick, job sorted.
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Worth a watch....

https://twitter.com/x/status/1102685970720272384
 
Gutter Boy said:
I saw that broadcast at the time, and thought he came across excellently.

It kind of fits in with one of my beliefs - that things generally aren't that bad/are slowly improving, but that both the agenda of 24 hour news, and its poor use of stats, mean nothing is ever presented with any context.
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Hence Brexit

(That's not meant to wind anyone up. Just my view that propoganda and business interests drove an overinflated narrative of negativity.)
 
monkeybarry said:
Hence Brexit

(That's not meant to wind anyone up. Just my view that propoganda and business interests drove an overinflated narrative of negativity.)
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My perspective, with context, is that opposition to neo-liberal globalisation has been rising steadily since the 1970s (but especially since 2000), and Brexit was just a marker that it had exceeded 50%. So a gradually shifting paradigm, not an event

But I agree that it is the media (inadvertently and deliberately) that drives anger in society, when cohesion would be stronger in a more natural state
 
Gutter Boy said:
My perspective, with context, is that opposition to neo-liberal globalisation has been rising steadily since the 1970s (but especially since 2000), and Brexit was just a marker that it had exceeded 50%. So a gradually shifting paradigm, not an event

But I agree that it is the media (inadvertently and deliberately) that drives anger in society, when cohesion would be stronger in a more natural state
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your equation between Brexit and Globalisation is not Valid - most Brexit voters were Tories, they do not oppose neo-liberal globalisation.
 
r-u-s-x said:
your equation between Brexit and Globalisation is not Valid - most Brexit voters were Tories, they do not oppose neo-liberal globalisation.
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Most Tory voters are village fete committee members from the shires. They are very opposed to globalisation. I know there's extreme neo-liberalism amongst some MPs and big business backers, but I would say the mass of their voters are far more pre-Thatcherite/one-nation tories.

Most Tory voters are village fete committee members from the shires. They are very opposed to globalisation. I know there's extreme neo-liberalism amongst some MPs and big business backers, but I would say the mass of their voters are far more pre-Thatcherite/one-nation tories.

It's not just a Tory thing. 71% of Tory constituencies were leave, but 61% of Labour ones were too. One of the most interesting thing about Brexit was how it managed to unite middle England and the working classes, against basically London and Scotland.
 
Gutter Boy said:
My perspective, with context, is that opposition to neo-liberal globalisation has been rising steadily since the 1970s (but especially since 2000), and Brexit was just a marker that it had exceeded 50%. So a gradually shifting paradigm, not an event

But I agree that it is the media (inadvertently and deliberately) that drives anger in society, when cohesion would be stronger in a more natural state
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Is it the globalisation aspect of neo-liberalism that you're opposed to? Give me your negatives (and any positives)......just interested
 
Gutter Boy said:
Most Tory voters are village fete committee members from the shires. They are very opposed to globalisation. I know there's extreme neo-liberalism amongst some MPs and big business backers, but I would say the mass of their voters are far more pre-Thatcherite/one-nation tories.

Most Tory voters are village fete committee members from the shires. They are very opposed to globalisation. I know there's extreme neo-liberalism amongst some MPs and big business backers, but I would say the mass of their voters are far more pre-Thatcherite/one-nation tories.

It's not just a Tory thing. 71% of Tory constituencies were leave, but 61% of Labour ones were too. One of the most interesting thing about Brexit was how it managed to unite middle England and the working classes, against basically London and Scotland.
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Please provide the link between Brexit and anti Globalisation, especially where it shows 100% of leave voters are anit-Globalisation. Thanks
 
Akala is a ledge. I’d urge anyone to read his latest book Natives.


Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk
 
the dza said:
I haven't said either of those things in any of my posts. 1. I don't think anyone to the right of me is a violent right-wing nutter. 2. I don't think the ERG are neo-nazis prepared to incite violence and murder, but they have overlapping views with those who do and they court the same political strategist, Steve Bannon, who has showed himself to be a friend of the far-right. I feel like I'm repeating myself, but that's the link between the groups and why I feel they swim in the same swamp. It's why, imo, the murder of the Labour MP occurred during the Brexit campaign, the far right are emboldened by the right of the Tory Party imo, and the sway that they have over the government and by extension, mainstream politics.

The reason I made this point initially is because it's the left who are accused of being extremists, violent, bullying etc. when the real political violence in the UK today is on the right.

I'm happy to leave it there because I feel like I am being quite repetitive, but I wanted to do you the courtesy of a reply as you wrote quite a long post in response (sorry if I have bored you to death in the process!)
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Sorry I've not replied earlier, in hospital this morning for an endoscopy, not something I'd recommend.
As I said before some of your poi have validity, but I would suggest if you want really make them stick to tone it down. It's easy online to sound a bit mad.
I'm happy to leave it here, except to say I don't argue online it's pointless but it is good to have a Frank discussion.
 
glasgowspur said:
Sorry I've not replied earlier, in hospital this morning for an endoscopy, not something I'd recommend.
As I said before some of your poi have validity, but I would suggest if you want really make them stick to tone it down. It's easy online to sound a bit mad.
I'm happy to leave it here, except to say I don't argue online it's pointless but it is good to have a Frank discussion.
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I struggle to tone it down at times, I'm an argumentative pr1ck -- probably why I enjoy posting in this thread.

Hope everything was ok at the hospital mate.
 
I'm a passionate person and have watch how I discuss certain topics, I can sound very strident im told.
I have some views that are right of centre, but only just, that are jumped on in Scotland because everybody loves here loves to hate a tory, but I'm mostly slightly left of centre. But people find it d to get past their initial impressions, so I'm labelled as right wing until they actually think about what I'm saying.
A lot of it is not what's said, it's how you say it.

Everything is OK health wise, waiting on getting my gall bladder removed and today was just a precautionary chech that there's nothing else.
Been hoarding spurs books to read when I'm off work after the op:)
 
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