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***OMT TOTTENHAM HOTSPUR FC V fulham...Sat 29th (today FFS!) 8pm - BTW HAPPY BIRTHDAY FERNADEZ'S OLDEST KID***

thfcsteff said:
(sigh)...OK. Perhaps it is acceptable to rock up to your new job and say you didn't really know too much about the club you're now working with beyond a shared Dane in the late '90s. I might well be expecting a little too much with regards to speaking of our history or at least the traditions and ways the club stands for (stood for??????)...
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That’s different to what you said he said that annoyed you in the post I quoted.
 
Baleforce said:
That’s different to what you said he said that annoyed you in the post I quoted.
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Indeed I can see that it does phrase differently. To yours and @billyiddo's points, it is perhaps harsh and somewhat unfair of me to pick up on that again now given there are plenty of other things to discuss and the liklihood is that a man who does prepare as he seems to would certainly have done his Spurs DNA homework.
 
thfcsteff said:
...I was going to go point by point replying to your post, however I realise that really, THIS particular response proves my point EXACTLY and evrything else is just forum tennis.

Stop seeing what you want to see in my comments, and see what I am saying. And I have said repeatedly that I do not actually give a fudge about poor results IF the manner of play, the style of play, and the intent of play shows some cohesive focus, consistency, and understanding of what THFC is all about (for me at any rate) which is creative, attacking football. You mentioned Maresca's first season (curiously really, he's a totally different manager to Frank) but I'll tell you this, if Frank carried similar conviction and self-belief - even with his horrendous style of play - I'd be more willing to extend my patience by a couple of years. again, please please please try and understand, it is NOT necessarily about results for me, it is about what we are building toward and who we are...or currently aren't.
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So its Frank's lack of conviction that is upsetting you. Not the results. I think the result is probably the biggest driver of discontent for most. We weren't so bad against fullham, truth be told. Personally, I saw us build and develop through midfield and dominate in spells. I saw Muani look like a proper forward which was encouraging. Yes crosses were poor. But we progressed the ball to make openings. Final ball was weak. And then when the kids came on our left was so dissapointing. Udogie, Simons, Tel, Odobert all not cutting it under pressure. They need time and confidence. Easier to play away for them, where they don't have negative fans putting so much pressure on.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
A new coach
Or some home wins
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Wins at home would indeed help.
But i think it's now become a bit Chicken-and-egg now.
And the chickens are coming home to roost.

I'm not trying to absolve all blame from Thomas Frank's shoulders (the attacking play looks worse and worse at home) but i go back to the summer after Ange narrowly missed out on Champions league and finished 5th.
Only buying one player who would immediately go into the first team as a starter (Solanke) was setting the standard that we didn't or couldn't reach further up.
Getting Odobert instead of Neto (apparently our initial target) was settling for someone who might become top PL standard but would need time and good coaching. It's a tall order for someone like that to take over within a year from Son. And all a bit piecemeal.

If Son was still at his peak and being rotated with someone like Odobert a year or two earlier he might be experienced enough to take over and handle the pressure etc

I use Odobert as one example of a symptom of shortsightedness we are now suffering from. Ditto: why do we still not have a left-footed left-back to make it that when Udogie plays like he's drunk and can barely control a football (like on Saturday night) we have no rotation option to bench him because he's playting so crap...

Oh well.

Let's hope we don't give up at Saudi Sportswashing Machine like we did under Stellini
 
glorygloryeze said:
Wins at home would indeed help.
But i think it's now become a bit Chicken-and-egg now.
And the chickens are coming home to roost.

I'm not trying to absolve all blame from Thomas Frank's shoulders (the attacking play looks worse and worse at home) but i go back to the summer after Ange narrowly missed out on Champions league and finished 5th.
Only buying one player who would immediately go into the first team as a starter (Solanke) was setting the standard that we didn't or couldn't reach further up.
Getting Odobert instead of Neto (apparently our initial target) was settling for someone who might become top PL standard but would need time and good coaching. It's a tall order for someone like that to take over within a year from Son. And all a bit piecemeal.

If Son was still at his peak and being rotated with someone like Odobert a year or two earlier he might be experienced enough to take over and handle the pressure etc

I use Odobert as one example of a symptom of shortsightedness we are now suffering from. Ditto: why do we still not have a left-footed left-back to make it that when Udogie plays like he's drunk and can barely control a football (like on Saturday night) we have no rotation option to bench him because he's playting so crap...

Oh well.

Let's hope we don't give up at Saudi Sportswashing Machine like we did under Stellini
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Ododbert got MOTM vs United and I believe he hasn’t started a game since
Thats odd, right?
 
Serious question: does anyone know if the players had some kind of impromptu celebration a night or two before the Fulham game? Or maybe there was a recently birthday for a popular player and they went out a bit later than normal (not on a big bender but just late)?

I ask because many of them had such poor touches and could barely do basics and generally we often asleep. Chief culprits: Porro, Udogie, MVDV, Bergvall (look at that stretch he tried before the Fulham first goal), Bentancur when he came on (though you could say for the last year he's increasingly looked slow and unaware of his surroundings when on the ball).
I again noticed how many time two/three players are jumping to head the same ball without knowing one of our players is already vuying for that header....

It would actually make me feel better if there had been some celebration that led to such poor control/awareness from so many: if you have 2/3 players who are under par that can make a massive difference in the team downturn of effectiveness (the multiplier effect?)
 
SpurMeUp said:
So its Frank's lack of conviction that is upsetting you. Not the results. I think the result is probably the biggest driver of discontent for most. We weren't so bad against fullham, truth be told. Personally, I saw us build and develop through midfield and dominate in spells. I saw Muani look like a proper forward which was encouraging. Yes crosses were poor. But we progressed the ball to make openings. Final ball was weak. And then when the kids came on our left was so dissapointing. Udogie, Simons, Tel, Odobert all not cutting it under pressure. They need time and confidence. Easier to play away for them, where they don't have negative fans putting so much pressure on.
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There were a few people putting all their eggs in the 'Frank is just what the club and players need after big bad Ange'. As that is not happening (yet), I would suggest the over-reactions say more about the posters saving face, than the effort the players and staff are putting into trying to find what works.

IMO, it would be better to have a wait-and-see outlook, not only before a ball is kicked, but also until the latest incumbent has had a couple of seasons (bar staring relegation in the face).

The one and only thing the 'supporters' can do, to help towards a positive outcome, is to lift the players with unconditional vocal support at games. The moaning and booing and outright abuse, and the shear weight of negative social media does the opposite. Reap what you sow.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
You don’t get many fans anywhere in the world paying the prices we do as fans for what we get to see
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You don't see many fans anywhere in the world booing their own players and team as much as at our ground, regardless how bad they are!
If they want to tell the team something, I'd much prefer if they did something funny about it, like Mageburg fans did when they hadn't scored for 6 games. Pointing at where the goal is. Screenshot_2025-12-01-14-03-16-53_40deb401b9ffe8e1df2f1cc5ba480b12.jpg
 
Lemonade Money said:
There were a few people putting all their eggs in the 'Frank is just what the club and players need after big bad Ange'. As that is not happening (yet), I would suggest the over-reactions say more about the posters saving face, than the effort the players and staff are putting into trying to find what works.

IMO, it would be better to have a wait-and-see outlook, not only before a ball is kicked, but also until the latest incumbent has had a couple of seasons (bar staring relegation in the face).

The one and only thing the 'supporters' can do, to help towards a positive outcome, is to lift the players with unconditional vocal support at games. The moaning and booing and outright abuse, and the shear weight of negative social media does the opposite. Reap what you sow.
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Yes it is rarely as good, or a as bad, as the moment suggests. Frank isn't as good as all the fuking hype when we signed him. But he isn't as bad as many are making out now. Who'd have thought that a new manager with an unsettled side would take time to gel? Obviously we are going to take time to refine. Both the selection, shape, and confidence. Chelsea last season were woeful with similar upheaval, now looking a lot better. In their case, they had sacked and reset so many times, they had to stick with it. Maybe we're not there yet. And the realisation hasn't hit that stability is more effective than change :)
 
Lemonade Money said:
The one and only thing the 'supporters' can do, to help towards a positive outcome, is to lift the players with unconditional vocal support at games. The moaning and booing and outright abuse, and the shear weight of negative social media does the opposite. Reap what you sow.
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spot on
 
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