Mathys Tel

[Jurgen the German]

You didn’t see that raw talent in Bale or Kane at all. No one did!

Yes I said that Kane surprised everyone with how good he turned out. Bale was highly rated as a youngster. Again no one foresaw how good he actually became, but you could see he had talent.

 

[Bishop]

You didn’t see that raw talent in Bale or Kane at all. No one did!

Hmmm people did see the raw attacking talent in Bale. He was always a good attacker, that's what stood out about him. The misconception was the thought that he could learn and improve his defensive game.

Later on we abandon ed the idea of him being a LB entirely and he blossomed even further and became a great player probably better than anyone actually expected but to say no one saw the talent is not the case at all. Kane I'll agree, he had something but I don't think anyone can honestly say they saw him becoming one of the greatest PL strikers of all time and arguably our greatest.

 

[DTA]

He just does not look physically strong enough to play there in this league. Lacks the strength to hold up the ball I fear.

I think he has looked stronger this season.

 

[revlis]

Yes I said that Kane surprised everyone with how good he turned out. Bale was highly rated as a youngster. Again no one foresaw how good he actually became, but you could see he had talent.

Hmmm people did see the raw attacking talent in Bale. He was always a good attacker, that's what stood out about him. The misconception was the thought that he could learn and improve his defensive game.

Later on we abandon ed the idea of him being a LB entirely and he blossomed even further and became a great player probably better than anyone actually expected but to say no one saw the talent is not the case at all. Kane I'll agree, he had something but I don't think anyone can honestly say they saw him becoming one of the greatest PL strikers of all time and arguably our greatest.

He obviously had talent, just like Mathys Tel has talent. But even that was ignored at the time. I mean the curse was the thing he was known for and many would happily have let him go before he broke out. No one saw what was coming with Gareth Bale. If you tell me you did, I will not believe you.

 

[thfcsteff]

Had some bellend behind me in the South calling Archie a c*** every time he touched the ball on Saturday. Started from 5 minutes in. I just don’t get why you go along to watch a game and get on like that. It’s pathetic.

Please tell me you swiftly told him to STFU

 

[thfcsteff]

Hmmm people did see the raw attacking talent in Bale. He was always a good attacker, that's what stood out about him. The misconception was the thought that he could learn and improve his defensive game.

Later on we abandon ed the idea of him being a LB entirely and he blossomed even further and became a great player probably better than anyone actually expected but to say no one saw the talent is not the case at all. Kane I'll agree, he had something but I don't think anyone can honestly say they saw him becoming one of the greatest PL strikers of all time and arguably our greatest.

There isn't a single person on this forum who can claim to have repeatedly said (when he was struggling at FB) that Gareth Bale was so swiftly going to become one of the greatest modern wingers in the game. Seeing some talent? Fine. And yes, the Kane thing is similar, albeit I knew he was special in Poch's first preseason game against Seattle when Harry received a ball deep with his back to goal on the left near the halfway line, turned and played a fudging sublime 40 yarder into attacking space on the right wing. It was jaw-dropping at the time...but yes, we didn't ever see it coming...
GHod we've had some fantastic players at this football club!!!

 

[NaijaSpurs]

Tel being physically stronger than Marmoush is an objective fact.

My bad. I actually thought you were talking about Solanke. Marmoush has played his best football as a second striker not the main central striker, which is why I do not see him as a natural number 9. When City bought him from Frankfurt he was playing off Hugo Eketike, not as the main centre forward.

 

[Bishop]

There isn't a single person on this forum who can claim to have repeatedly said (when he was struggling at FB) that Gareth Bale was so swiftly going to become one of the greatest modern wingers in the game. Seeing some talent? Fine. And yes, the Kane thing is similar, albeit I knew he was special in Poch's first preseason game against Seattle when Harry received a ball deep with his back to goal on the left near the halfway line, turned and played a fudging sublime 40 yarder into attacking space on the right wing. It was jaw-dropping at the time...but yes, we didn't ever see it coming...
GHod we've had some fantastic players at this football club!!!

Hmmm when he was struggling at FB I was saying he shouldn't be playing Lb because he was useless defensively and that he should play in front of Ekotto. Now did I think he would go on to become one of the world's best attackers, I'm not sure I can claim that, but did I see he had great attacking potential? Yes I did see that and I wasn't the only one.

Kane I absolutely agree. I don't think many thought he was going to be what he became. There was one guy in the Coys forum though who I remember who really, really believed in him but he was probably the only person I saw speaking about him that way.

 

[robp135]

My bad. I actually thought you were talking about Solanke. Marmoush has played his best football as a second striker not the main central striker, which is why I do not see him as a natural number 9. When City bought him from Frankfurt he was playing off Hugo Eketike, not as the main centre forward.

That’s true but De Zerbi has a history of using that type of player as his #9. Kroupi was his first choice and he is 5ft9 and probably not over 70KG.

 

[Bishop]

He obviously had talent, just like Mathys Tel has talent. But even that was ignored at the time. I mean the curse was the thing he was known for and many would happily have let him go before he broke out. No one saw what was coming with Gareth Bale. If you tell me you did, I will not believe you.

You can believe me or not. I'm not going to lie about it. I posted on the Coys forum at the time. If you are a member you can possibly go back and look back at what I said about Bale at the time. I never thought he was a FB, I always said he should be playing LW because what I saw at Southampton was an attacker and his attacking game is what attracted us in the first place. It's why we and United were desperate to sign him.

Article about bale was from 06. Some of us were fully football nerds at the time and really paid attention to all of the chat.

"skill: BALE: As full of skill and trickery as a winger - which some feel he might evolve into, possibly as a long-term replacement for Ryan Giggs (for Wales, if not Man Utd). Loves to swashbuckle forward and is a real threat to opponents with his ability to beat his man and get in a telling cross. ROUND FIVE: Richards 7 Bale 10."

Remember Bale won the Football League young player of the year award and that certainly wasn't for his defensive play. To claim no one saw his attacking qualities is crazy.

I'm not claiming that I thought he would go on to play for Real Madrid but his attacking quality and output was obvious. It was super clear to me should be playing as an attacker because that's what he was. He'd scored 5 goals for Southampton nominally as a LB and was already getting called the heir to Giggs claim thrown his way at 17 years old.

There is a reason Alex Ferguson got into a mini bidding war with us over him, he was the most highly touted prospect around at the time. Liverpool also tried to sign him before we did. There is zero comparison between how Bale was thought of at 17 and how Tel has ever been thought of in his career and that's fine Tel doesn't need to be as good as Bale to be effective, but if you didn't see it with Bale that's fine but you can't tell me what I did or didn't see or think about the player just because you didn't see it.

"In 2006, Liverpool sent their premier scouting team to watch Southampton's youth squad with the specific intention of assessing striker David McGoldrick. The scouts completely ignored the striker because they were transfixed by Bale’s offensive overload from the back. As the scouting team later revealed to talkSPORT:

“We went back and said, 'McGoldrick isn't for us, but there's this 16-year-old kid called Gareth Bale we. Liverpool immediately tried to engineer a player-plus-cash swap deal for him. They weren't looking for a defensive full-back; they were trying to buy a teenager who had just dominated the entire left flank single-handedly.

 

[Raziel]

Agree with @Bishop here re Bale, it was obvious. I actually told friends that preseason that he was going to be one of the best.

Now, I didn't see it with Kane, also thought Ronaldo (CR) was a one trick pony at United, so we all see some, miss most.

 

[Bishop]

Agree with @Bishop here re Bale, it was obvious. I actually told friends that preseason that he was going to be one of the best.

Now, I didn't see it with Kane, also thought Ronaldo (CR) was a one trick pony at United, so we all see some, miss most.

I was similar with Kane and CR7. Kane had something but I though he would probably be a decent lower PL level striker and CR7 was a fun and talented player but I can't lie and say I ever thought he was going to to and do what he did. I thought Queresma was more talented at the time (and he arbuably was) and I would have put money on Queresma being the player who would go on to be the a Worlds Best between them.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

The difference with Savio is that those who are proclaiming his potential and quality have actually watched him play and perform to a high level previously. So it's not quite the same scenario as it is with Tel. Then add that a player not good enough for City might still good be enough for many or even most teams. A player not good enough for 17th placed Spurs doesn't quite have the same space below.

I don't really buy your argument about not wanting to see a player develop. I am for example quite hopeful for Odobert because in him I see quite some potential, not to be generational or anything but just a good level attacker and hopefully one that is good enough to offer us something. I just don't see that with Tel. I may well be wrong (hopefully), but I'm not gonna lie about how I perceive him currently.

But it is the same scenario, a stint 3 years ago does not take away the fact that people are seemingly banking on a player who in the same way as Tel here, City fans treated Savio.

I didn't say people don't want to see people develop, they just don't have the stomach for it and I maintain that as I have seen it for 20+ years. People want the journey other clubs put in with players, clubs that take the rough with the smooth in development but they don't and wouldn't take the rough IMO. People on here and esp in the stands would not have taken the first 6 months of some players we then subsequently coveted

 

[TonyL]

I am probably late for the party. I still think it was ok to take him on loan, but I still don't see what they saw when we signed him, especially for a substantial fee.

 

[TonyL]

And I am fairly sure you are going to be disappointed if you are dreaming of Bale, Kane and CR7.

 

[Bishop]

But it is the same scenario, a stint 3 years ago does not take away the fact that people are seemingly banking on a player who in the same way as Tel here, City fans treated Savio.

I didn't say people don't want to see people develop, they just don't have the stomach for it and I maintain that as I have seen it for 20+ years. People want the journey other clubs put in with players, clubs that take the rough with the smooth in development but they don't and wouldn't take the rough IMO. People on here and esp in the stands would not have taken the first 6 months of some players we then subsequently coveted

City treating Savio that way is fine imo. They've had better players, they have and should have higher standards than ourselves. They have no need to wait 5 years for Savio to become a decent player when they are trying to win titles right now and have both the pull and finances to attract pretty much any player on the open market.

Maybe with your general comment you are correct and as a club we don't have the stomach but at the same time we've rarely actually purchased the players who it has been worth putting that time into. Even when those players have moved to other clubs we see they usually aren't top 6 level players. Probably what causes the friction with these players that need development is the over hyped expectations. We always hear such and such is generational, a future England captain or one of the top prospects in Europe. When you attach those expectations to players the reality is often going to be dissapointing.

For me at least, its not a lack of patience (in the case of Tel). I don't mind giving him time to develop, I just don't believe hes ever going to blossom into someone we need. So its not a time thing, its fundemntally I just don't believe he has the raw minerals to be a player that when his development is complete that we would want to sign. An alternative example is Papa Mata Sarr, i've always thought he has massive potential, I would give him all the time possible even now to develop into the player we need because i believe he has it within him to become such a player. I'm begining to feel similarly about Moore, I already feel that way with Odobert. These are players I think its worth investing our time and respources into simply because I believe in their potential whereas I don't with Tel. Hopefully i've misjudged him and he proves me wrong.

 

[Jurgen the German]

He obviously had talent, just like Mathys Tel has talent. But even that was ignored at the time. I mean the curse was the thing he was known for and many would happily have let him go before he broke out. No one saw what was coming with Gareth Bale. If you tell me you did, I will not believe you.

Bale’s talent was more obvious than Tel.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

City treating Savio that way is fine imo. They've had better players, they have and should have higher standards than ourselves. They have no need to wait 5 years for Savio to become a decent player when they are trying to win titles right now and have both the pull and finances to attract pretty much any player on the open market.

Maybe with your general comment you are correct and as a club we don't have the stomach but at the same time we've rarely actually purchased the players who it has been worth putting that time into. Even when those players have moved to other clubs we see they usually aren't top 6 level players. Probably what causes the friction with these players that need development is the over hyped expectations. We always hear such and such is generational, a future England captain or one of the top prospects in Europe. When you attach those expectations to players the reality is often going to be dissapointing.

For me at least, its not a lack of patience (in the case of Tel). I don't mind giving him time to develop, I just don't believe hes ever going to blossom into someone we need. So its not a time thing, its fundemntally I just don't believe he has the raw minerals to be a player that when his development is complete that we would want to sign. An alternative example is Papa Mata Sarr, i've always thought he has massive potential, I would give him all the time possible even now to develop into the player we need because i believe he has it within him to become such a player. I'm begining to feel similarly about Moore, I already feel that way with Odobert. These are players I think its worth investing our time and respources into simply because I believe in their potential whereas I don't with Tel. Hopefully i've misjudged him and he proves me wrong.

We will soon find out I am sure