Fourth - who are we going to beat to it?

[SteveAWOL]

Twitter / OptaJoe: 42+ - This is the first time in Premier League history where the top 4 have all had 42 or more points after 21 games. Competitive.

The whole thing is just ridiculous if you start looking at some of the scores they've predicted.

Spurs 1-2 Arsenal

Come on....

Well it's not called the Daily Fail for nothing! Jamie Redknapp fits in perfectly there :lol:

 

[Jordinho]

 

[Nigeyman]

Wasnt quite sure where to post this, thought this seemed to be the best place.

Just got thinking today that the media pundits are always wanting to give a definite opinion on teams and where they are in the league, the common thinking now is that those in the top 3 have now broken away and that there are 4 teams in the hunt for fourth place....a position which if attained by us as a finishing position would see most of us doing cartwheels.

I dont quite know what point im trying to make.....I think there is still an awfull lot of football still to be played...and an awful lot of drama still to be played out......teams sufferering a dramatic loss of form....injuries to key players......certain players having an excellent 2nd half to the season.

When we beat Man utd it was massive to me.....I felt that if we lost then any dream of the title would die....I know its silly 'the title'...I guess the point I am trying to make is that I think its on and anything is possible and that we shouldn't just get wrapped up in 4th just because thats what the media tells us.

I do not think that 8 points in January is a massive margin and I will try and explain why and my thoughts as to why the upcoming game is vs City is crucial.

Imagine a scenario where we pull off a win vs city (4 points behind) and Southampton manage a win against the goons (5 points behind) naturally I dont think Chelsea will drop any points at home to West Ham (6 points behind)........what then??? winning our next game could be the rocket fuel to propell us to a long run of succesful results.....in terms of catching the goons & chelsea we do get to play them again...so we can gain further ground on them.....Arsenal have a horrible March....City will have all the big teams to play away!

I know some people will think I am mental....and maybe just maybe my title dream will die if we cant beat city as we must imo......I want to believe that we can go on amazing run while other teams falter and find their star players getting fatigued!!! we have ridden the injury storm and suddenly have fresh, hungry quality players raring to go and give others some much needed rest.

Basically I think there are now signs of players settling...I feel really positive about the next few months!! I reckon it will take a gargantium effort to beat city and I believe we CAN do it! and then for me its all on!!!! I would have course feel that finishing 4th would be a decent achievement for us this season but sometimes I think we should all aim higher,aim for the top, and hopefully if our players are looking up thinking in this positive manner we will attain the highest league position possible.

And for those who might scoff....just consider that not long ago we were six points behind pool and everyone was writing us off in the race for 4th.....if you dont belive me see the top3/bottom3 prediction thread. I said in that we would finish 4th and there isnt many putting us in there........is there any harm in daring to believe????

 

[SteveAWOL]

I'd love a glass / gram of whatever you're on Nigeyman

After 3 decades of following Tottenham, and enduring mid-table mediocrity for most of the 1990s followed by the heartbreak Lasagne-gate and the Chavs fluking the Champions League, I cannot even bring myself to have even a jot of hope that we might finish in the Top 3 for the first time in a quarter century let alone challenge for the title!

My outlook is rather more along the lines of (boyhood Spurs fan) Roy Keane's:

[video=youtube;sLhWlODDsRU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLhWlODDsRU[/video]

 

[El Guepardo]

Didn't Keane have a chance to move to us, before he joined Man U? Why didn't he join?

 

[El Guepardo]

Wasnt quite sure where to post this, thought this seemed to be the best place.

Just got thinking today that the media pundits are always wanting to give a definite opinion on teams and where they are in the league, the common thinking now is that those in the top 3 have now broken away and that there are 4 teams in the hunt for fourth place....a position which if attained by us as a finishing position would see most of us doing cartwheels.

I dont quite know what point im trying to make.....I think there is still an awfull lot of football still to be played...and an awful lot of drama still to be played out......teams sufferering a dramatic loss of form....injuries to key players......certain players having an excellent 2nd half to the season.

When we beat Man utd it was massive to me.....I felt that if we lost then any dream of the title would die....I know its silly 'the title'...I guess the point I am trying to make is that I think its on and anything is possible and that we shouldn't just get wrapped up in 4th just because thats what the media tells us.

I do not think that 8 points in January is a massive margin and I will try and explain why and my thoughts as to why the upcoming game is vs City is crucial.

Imagine a scenario where we pull off a win vs city (4 points behind) and Southampton manage a win against the goons (5 points behind) naturally I dont think Chelsea will drop any points at home to West Ham (6 points behind)........what then??? winning our next game could be the rocket fuel to propell us to a long run of succesful results.....in terms of catching the goons & chelsea we do get to play them again...so we can gain further ground on them.....Arsenal have a horrible March....City will have all the big teams to play away!

I know some people will think I am mental....and maybe just maybe my title dream will die if we cant beat city as we must imo......I want to believe that we can go on amazing run while other teams falter and find their star players getting fatigued!!! we have ridden the injury storm and suddenly have fresh, hungry quality players raring to go and give others some much needed rest.

Basically I think there are now signs of players settling...I feel really positive about the next few months!! I reckon it will take a gargantium effort to beat city and I believe we CAN do it! and then for me its all on!!!! I would have course feel that finishing 4th would be a decent achievement for us this season but sometimes I think we should all aim higher,aim for the top, and hopefully if our players are looking up thinking in this positive manner we will attain the highest league position possible.

And for those who might scoff....just consider that not long ago we were six points behind pool and everyone was writing us off in the race for 4th.....if you dont belive me see the top3/bottom3 prediction thread. I said in that we would finish 4th and there isnt many putting us in there........is there any harm in daring to believe????

Please don't get too carried away. I said that we could win the league, at the start of the season. I still believe we can, but it's highly unlikely. We slipped up and lost too many games that we shouldn't have.

Likewise, other teams have you could say, but if we're strictly looking at our own team. Had we beaten West Ham, WBA and Saudi Sportswashing Machine, like we could have, we would be joint top.

As it is, we didn't and the margin of 8 points is less than we'll likely finish behind the eventual winners.

So yes, I said we would win the Premiership. Yes, I believe there's any outside chance still. But, our turmulous run of form from the West Ham loss, through to the Liverpool loss, will ultimately prove too costly.

 

[Nigeyman]

Please don't get too carried away. I said that we could win the league, at the start of the season. I still believe we can, but it's highly unlikely. We slipped up and lost too many games that we shouldn't have.

Likewise, other teams have you could say, but if we're strictly looking at our own team. Had we beaten West Ham, WBA and Saudi Sportswashing Machine, like we could have, we would be joint top.

As it is, we didn't and the margin of 8 points is less than we'll likely finish behind the eventual winners.

So yes, I said we would win the Premiership. Yes, I believe there's any outside chance still. But, our turmulous run of form from the West Ham loss, through to the Liverpool loss, will ultimately prove too costly.

Look I am sorry I am not trying to get carried away..my post is also a message that we dont just have to be fixated on 4th place....belief and confidence can carry a team a long way.....and though I agree its unlikely I still dont think the top three are neccesarily set just yet.

 

[90291Spur]

Wasnt quite sure where to post this, thought this seemed to be the best place.

Just got thinking today that the media pundits are always wanting to give a definite opinion on teams and where they are in the league, the common thinking now is that those in the top 3 have now broken away and that there are 4 teams in the hunt for fourth place....a position which if attained by us as a finishing position would see most of us doing cartwheels.

I dont quite know what point im trying to make.....I think there is still an awfull lot of football still to be played...and an awful lot of drama still to be played out......teams sufferering a dramatic loss of form....injuries to key players......certain players having an excellent 2nd half to the season.

When we beat Man utd it was massive to me.....I felt that if we lost then any dream of the title would die....I know its silly 'the title'...I guess the point I am trying to make is that I think its on and anything is possible and that we shouldn't just get wrapped up in 4th just because thats what the media tells us.

I do not think that 8 points in January is a massive margin and I will try and explain why and my thoughts as to why the upcoming game is vs City is crucial.

Imagine a scenario where we pull off a win vs city (4 points behind) and Southampton manage a win against the goons (5 points behind) naturally I dont think Chelsea will drop any points at home to West Ham (6 points behind)........what then??? winning our next game could be the rocket fuel to propell us to a long run of succesful results.....in terms of catching the goons & chelsea we do get to play them again...so we can gain further ground on them.....Arsenal have a horrible March....City will have all the big teams to play away!

I know some people will think I am mental....and maybe just maybe my title dream will die if we cant beat city as we must imo......I want to believe that we can go on amazing run while other teams falter and find their star players getting fatigued!!! we have ridden the injury storm and suddenly have fresh, hungry quality players raring to go and give others some much needed rest.

Basically I think there are now signs of players settling...I feel really positive about the next few months!! I reckon it will take a gargantium effort to beat city and I believe we CAN do it! and then for me its all on!!!! I would have course feel that finishing 4th would be a decent achievement for us this season but sometimes I think we should all aim higher,aim for the top, and hopefully if our players are looking up thinking in this positive manner we will attain the highest league position possible.

And for those who might scoff....just consider that not long ago we were six points behind pool and everyone was writing us off in the race for 4th.....if you dont belive me see the top3/bottom3 prediction thread. I said in that we would finish 4th and there isnt many putting us in there........is there any harm in daring to believe????

Well said and congrats (or Mazel Tov) on thinking so positively. The spirit of Micky Hazard lives in you and may it inhabit the rest of us!!

COYS!!!!!

 

[El Guepardo]

Yup, there's nothing wrong with thinking positively. We need to aim as high as we can, 'it's better to fail aiming high, than it is to aim low and succeed'. It's a better mentality to have, for the club to try to push every bit of effort we have, in to achieving as much as we can, that way even if we can't win the league, there's a good chance that we'll finish top 4.

I think we should have been more of a challenger in the season, under Redknapp, in which we were right at the top. Our fall away was very disappointing, as we didn't even end up with Champions League football. We promised so much, and delivered so little.

 

[SteveAWOL]

Yup, there's nothing wrong with thinking positively. We need to aim as high as we can, 'it's better to fail aiming high, than it is to aim low and succeed'. It's a better mentality to have, for the club to try to push every bit of effort we have, in to achieving as much as we can, that way even if we can't win the league, there's a good chance that we'll finish top 4.

I think we should have been more of a challenger in the season, under Redknapp, in which we were right at the top. Our fall away was very disappointing, as we didn't even end up with Champions League football. We promised so much, and delivered so little.

Yeah it was around this time 2 years ago that we could've gone top of the Premier League on 2 occasions but failed to beat Wolves at WHL then Defoe was inches away from scoring the winner at the Etihad... despite that, there was still some optimism as Bale was starting to show his true potential, with 12 goals in his previous 20 league games, and a couple of days after Harry was cleared of tax evasion we spank Saudi Sportswashing Machine 5-0 to go 10pts clear of ARSEnal... but in true Tottenham fashion it all proved too good to be true, as the tabloid campaign to get Redknapp the England job went into full swing and our form dramatically declined with the next 10 matches yielding only 6pts... not forgetting (I certainly won't as I was there!) the fact that we lost our 6th consecutive FA Cup semi-final... :-&

Maybe if we can finally end our Stamford Bridge hoodoo I might dream of us become title challengers again but for now I'm just content to see us beating the teams we should be beating and hope that we can finish this season as strongly as 09/10 [-o<

 

[glorygloryeze]

Wasnt quite sure where to post this, thought this seemed to be the best place.

Just got thinking today that the media pundits are always wanting to give a definite opinion on teams and where they are in the league, the common thinking now is that those in the top 3 have now broken away and that there are 4 teams in the hunt for fourth place....a position which if attained by us as a finishing position would see most of us doing cartwheels.

I dont quite know what point im trying to make.....I think there is still an awfull lot of football still to be played...and an awful lot of drama still to be played out......teams sufferering a dramatic loss of form....injuries to key players......certain players having an excellent 2nd half to the season.

When we beat Man utd it was massive to me.....I felt that if we lost then any dream of the title would die....I know its silly 'the title'...I guess the point I am trying to make is that I think its on and anything is possible and that we shouldn't just get wrapped up in 4th just because thats what the media tells us.

I do not think that 8 points in January is a massive margin and I will try and explain why and my thoughts as to why the upcoming game is vs City is crucial.

Imagine a scenario where we pull off a win vs city (4 points behind) and Southampton manage a win against the goons (5 points behind) naturally I dont think Chelsea will drop any points at home to West Ham (6 points behind)........what then??? winning our next game could be the rocket fuel to propell us to a long run of succesful results.....in terms of catching the goons & chelsea we do get to play them again...so we can gain further ground on them.....Arsenal have a horrible March....City will have all the big teams to play away!

I know some people will think I am mental....and maybe just maybe my title dream will die if we cant beat city as we must imo......I want to believe that we can go on amazing run while other teams falter and find their star players getting fatigued!!! we have ridden the injury storm and suddenly have fresh, hungry quality players raring to go and give others some much needed rest.

Basically I think there are now signs of players settling...I feel really positive about the next few months!! I reckon it will take a gargantium effort to beat city and I believe we CAN do it! and then for me its all on!!!! I would have course feel that finishing 4th would be a decent achievement for us this season but sometimes I think we should all aim higher,aim for the top, and hopefully if our players are looking up thinking in this positive manner we will attain the highest league position possible.

And for those who might scoff....just consider that not long ago we were six points behind pool and everyone was writing us off in the race for 4th.....if you dont belive me see the top3/bottom3 prediction thread. I said in that we would finish 4th and there isnt many putting us in there........is there any harm in daring to believe????

 

[BrainOfLevy]

Wasnt quite sure where to post this, thought this seemed to be the best place.

Just got thinking today that the media pundits are always wanting to give a definite opinion on teams and where they are in the league, the common thinking now is that those in the top 3 have now broken away and that there are 4 teams in the hunt for fourth place....a position which if attained by us as a finishing position would see most of us doing cartwheels.

I dont quite know what point im trying to make.....I think there is still an awfull lot of football still to be played...and an awful lot of drama still to be played out......teams sufferering a dramatic loss of form....injuries to key players......certain players having an excellent 2nd half to the season.

When we beat Man utd it was massive to me.....I felt that if we lost then any dream of the title would die....I know its silly 'the title'...I guess the point I am trying to make is that I think its on and anything is possible and that we shouldn't just get wrapped up in 4th just because thats what the media tells us.

I do not think that 8 points in January is a massive margin and I will try and explain why and my thoughts as to why the upcoming game is vs City is crucial.

Imagine a scenario where we pull off a win vs city (4 points behind) and Southampton manage a win against the goons (5 points behind) naturally I dont think Chelsea will drop any points at home to West Ham (6 points behind)........what then??? winning our next game could be the rocket fuel to propell us to a long run of succesful results.....in terms of catching the goons & chelsea we do get to play them again...so we can gain further ground on them.....Arsenal have a horrible March....City will have all the big teams to play away!

I know some people will think I am mental....and maybe just maybe my title dream will die if we cant beat city as we must imo......I want to believe that we can go on amazing run while other teams falter and find their star players getting fatigued!!! we have ridden the injury storm and suddenly have fresh, hungry quality players raring to go and give others some much needed rest.

Basically I think there are now signs of players settling...I feel really positive about the next few months!! I reckon it will take a gargantium effort to beat city and I believe we CAN do it! and then for me its all on!!!! I would have course feel that finishing 4th would be a decent achievement for us this season but sometimes I think we should all aim higher,aim for the top, and hopefully if our players are looking up thinking in this positive manner we will attain the highest league position possible.

And for those who might scoff....just consider that not long ago we were six points behind pool and everyone was writing us off in the race for 4th.....if you dont belive me see the top3/bottom3 prediction thread. I said in that we would finish 4th and there isnt many putting us in there........is there any harm in daring to believe????

Liking this idea. The idea of narratives has really bugged me this season. Journos will make subtle/not so subtle references in their articles to who are the title contenders, who is under pressure, who is having a great season, and it bugs me because these assertions take on a life of their own.

Apparently Everton, Liverpool and Southampton are fantastic, while Saudi Sportswashing Machine are a laughing stock, Moyes is clueless and Spurs are just bang average and not in with a chance of anything this year. It's all nonsense. We are bang in with a chance of 4th and always have been, and just because it looks like Arsenal and City are impregnable I don't think it means they will perform like it all year. I think Chelsea can perform consistently enough to win the league and may pull ahead, but I look at Arsenal's squad and I just do not believe they are that far ahead of us. We can catch them. As for 'Title contenders' Liverpool and 'outside bets' Everton, we already have caught them. It's a friggin joke!

It's going to be tough, but we have a great squad and a manager that seems to know how to get the best out of them in a variety of situations.

 

[Libero]

Didn't Keane have a chance to move to us, before he joined Man U? Why didn't he join?

Nope. Although I was 11 at the time, I definitely remember it was a three way chase between Arsenal, Manchester United and Blackburn Rovers. I think his fee, £3.75m might have been a British Record at the time in August 1993. In the end I think it was a straight choice between Arsenal and United, he has never been fondly regarded by Arsenal fans as a result. Pretty sure in the first 3-4 seasons at Man U he took a lot of stick when they went to Highbury despite not being as big a star as he was later in his United career.

To answer your question, in 1993, if Spurs or Man Utd were coming in for you, realistically who would choose to go Spurs over Man Utd? They had just won the title as well as having won the FA Cup, League Cup and Cup Winners Cup in the previous 3 seasons so it was pretty obvious what direction they were heading.

As for Spurs in 1993, well we had the debacle of the Sugar-Venables fall out, losing a few players as a result. The relegation scrap of that season probably being a definition of our existence for the next 15 years.

 

[DublinSpur]

Didn't Keane have a chance to move to us, before he joined Man U? Why didn't he join?

As Libero pointed out, there's never been any suggestion that Roy Keane was headed to Tottenham. Maybe you're just misremembering the fact that he was a Spurs fan as a kid? And it's definitely something I'd have heard about if there was ever any chance of him coming to Spurs; Keane is my all-time favourite non-Spurs player*, and to have him at Spurs would've been a dream come true.

* Yes, I know about the controversy and the dodginess and that some fans really hate him, but as someone who tries to get to every Ireland match, I've always said that Roy Keane was the only truly world-class player I've ever seen turn out for my country. I even took his side in the Saipan nonsense (which put me on the opposite side of the fence to a lot of Irish fans).

 

[spurs' magna carter]

So far this season we have average 1.95 points a game. To put that into context if you times that by 38 you'd be left with 74 Pts.

On top of that we have 13 in 22 games, one more than at this stage last season and only bettered by the 2011/12 season.

Our target for points total this season should be 75 and I think we're course to do that but is most noticeable is that we haven't peaked yet this season, I really don't think we've seen the best of this squad, that despite the our current form under Tim, and if we were to then I feel we could end the season with anything between 77 and 82 pts.

With 16 games left I think our target should be to win 10 of those which would give us a minimum 30 extra points taking us to 73 but also if the six others games were 3 draws and 3 losses then we'd finish with 76.

I recently watched the 2009/10 review DVD again for the first time in about 3 and a half years, one thing that I noticed and had forgotten was how competitive it actually was, there was Emirates Marketing Project, Aston Villa and Liverpool competing against us for those positions right till final part of the season. This season it seems to be

Aston Villa > Everton
Liverpool
Emirates Marketing Project > Man Utd

As we know the competition is stronger than we've ever experienced before but what gives me confidence is that we're not looking over our shoulder which usually led to us buckling under pressure, this season we're the under dogs much like 2009/10 (where we were predicted to finish 6th). I think being under the radar, rather than being under spotlight suits us better....

 

[Rorschach]

Nope. Although I was 11 at the time, I definitely remember it was a three way chase between Arsenal, Manchester United and Blackburn Rovers. I think his fee, £3.75m might have been a British Record at the time in August 1993. In the end I think it was a straight choice between Arsenal and United, he has never been fondly regarded by Arsenal fans as a result. Pretty sure in the first 3-4 seasons at Man U he took a lot of stick when they went to Highbury despite not being as big a star as he was later in his United career.

To answer your question, in 1993, if Spurs or Man Utd were coming in for you, realistically who would choose to go Spurs over Man Utd? They had just won the title as well as having won the FA Cup, League Cup and Cup Winners Cup in the previous 3 seasons so it was pretty obvious what direction they were heading.

As for Spurs in 1993, well we had the debacle of the Sugar-Venables fall out, losing a few players as a result. The relegation scrap of that season probably being a definition of our existence for the next 15 years.

Arguably Fergies best ever signing IMO.

 

[Nezza]

Arguably Fergies best ever signing IMO.

Cantona for me.

 

[Robbo]

So far this season we have average 1.95 points a game. To put that into context if you times that by 38 you'd be left with 74 Pts.

On top of that we have 13 in 22 games, one more than at this stage last season and only bettered by the 2011/12 season.

Our target for points total this season should be 75 and I think we're course to do that but is most noticeable is that we haven't peaked yet this season, I really don't think we've seen the best of this squad, that despite the our current form under Tim, and if we were to then I feel we could end the season with anything between 77 and 82 pts.

With 16 games left I think our target should be to win 10 of those which would give us a minimum 30 extra points taking us to 73 but also if the six others games were 3 draws and 3 losses then we'd finish with 76.

Incredible isn't it that we've done so well, despite losing our best player, sacking our manager and basically not clicking at all.

Looking at our run-in, Saudi Sportswashing Machine, Chelski and Liverpool away are the trickiest on paper, although we've been doing very well away this season. Home games against ****, Everton and City will be tough as well. But ten wins out of these? Definitely doable, but as we all know, we're prone to mess up at some point - hopefully we have a surprise win or two in us as well.

City (H)
Hull (A)
Everton (H)
Saudi Sportswashing Machine (A)
Norwich (A)

Cardiff (H)
Chelski (A)
**** (H)
Southampton (H)
Liverpool (A)

Sunderland (H)
WestBrom (A)
Fulham (H)
Stoke (A)
West Ham (A)

Villa (H)

 

[Rorschach]

Cantona for me.

That's the argument I guess

 

[DublinSpur]

Incredible isn't it that we've done so well, despite losing our best player, sacking our manager and basically not clicking at all.

Looking at our run-in, Saudi Sportswashing Machine, Chelski and Liverpool away are the trickiest on paper, although we've been doing very well away this season. Home games against ****, Everton and City will be tough as well. But ten wins out of these? Definitely doable, but as we all know, we're prone to mess up at some point - hopefully we have a surprise win or two in us as well.

City (H)
Hull (A)
Everton (H)
Saudi Sportswashing Machine (A)
Norwich (A)

Cardiff (H)
Chelski (A)
**** (H)
Southampton (H)
Liverpool (A)

Sunderland (H)
WestBrom (A)
Fulham (H)
Stoke (A)
West Ham (A)

Villa (H)

Amazing when you look at it... once we're past the Liverpool game, in theory there's nothing to stop us winning our last six on the bounce. Won't happen of course (we'll end up losing 2-1 to Fulham at home despite being 1-0 up with 80 minutes to play, or something) but even if we're a little bit off the pace at the beginning of April, on paper we have the easiest run-in of all the teams around us. COYS!