Frank Give him time or get rid?

[Jurgen the German]

that depends how we play, how we lose (the premise of the question), how the game was officiated

similarly, would any kind of win, mean he HAS to stay?

I don’t think he should be here beyond today, but I don’t think beating Burnley is anything to write home about. You’ve said we have improved, but the points total is eerily similar to what it was at this stage last season so it’s a negligible progression at best.

 

[Baleforce]

I don’t think he should be here beyond today, but I don’t think beating Burnley is anything to write home about. You’ve said we have improved, but the points total is eerily similar to what it was at this stage last season so it’s a negligible progression at best.

by that metric alone yes

but its a complicated game

 

[Mr Gogolak]

United put a caretaker in for first 2 games of City & Scum, and they are already ahead.

We aren't going to win brick with Frank, so even a 10% chance of getting something from those games is upside

I'm definitely not defending the idea that he should be kept after that. I used to think he should be given the season more to protect our reputation than out of hope he'd turn it around but after today, I don't think there's any point in prolonging this. Maybe he'll end up being the new Espirito Santo but, in any case, it doesn't matter: nobody bounces back from a situation like that, and particularly not with that kind of run of fixtures.

All I'm saying is we should wait until it's over before we actually unveil the our new manager.

 

[Gutter Boy]

The only argument against appointing a new manager now is that the new guy would have to bed in in the middle of a terrible run of fixtures. I'm not sure that's the best way to get started at a club like Spurs. I'd let a caretaker take the fall for what will inevitably be a very depressing sequence and try to look like a hero if the new manager can turn things around in March.

Well United gave Carrick an unwinnable one at City.

Them acting will get them EL/EC. Us not will see us in a relegation scrap

 

[Mikey10]

Well United gave Carrick an unwinnable one at City.

They were at home. And City on current form are average.

 

[Baleforce]

Well United gave Carrick an unwinnable one at City.

Them acting will get them EL/EC. Us not will see us in a relegation scrap

No game against Guardiola is unwinnable. It's proven again, again and again.

 

[Mr Gogolak]

Well United gave Carrick an unwinnable one at City.

Them acting will get them EL/EC. Us not will see us in a relegation scrap

I don't think anyone can argue with that. I'd still wait to be out of the Champions League and out of that horrible run of fixtures before appointing the new guy (use a caretaker in the meantime), because a poor momentum makes it harder to get your ideas across, but it's all academic at the moment anyway.

 

[El Dante]

Well United gave Carrick an unwinnable one at City.

Them acting will get them EL/EC. Us not will see us in a relegation scrap

City’s defence was underwhelming. Missing key players it gifted the initiative to United. United still played very well and fully deserved their win but it wasn’t an unwinnable match. Plus I doubt he had to motivate the team so much against their rivals.

That said it can be argued strongly that Thomas Frank is unable to motivate our team against our rivals or at least I’ve seen little evidence of it.

 

[thfcsteff]

I wonder if Heating is a sneaky 'potential rtide-over' appt until the summer? Again, before anyone goes bonkers I am NOT saying whether I'd want him to do the job or not. Just speculating...

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

The myth of Angeball persists for some.

Go back and watch the tie against Telford in last season’s FA Cup (amongst many other examples) and remind yourself of how utterly, utterly shi t and clueless we were.

Cast your mind back to last season before December. It may not have been perfect, but it was levels above what we’re seeing now, and have done for most of this season.

 

[totalspurs]

I think he has to go...the main barometer for me is:
If we win do we look good (No)
If we lose do we look competitive (No)

How many times last season, when we lost, it was 3-2. Most games we scored 2 or more goals per game. Yes we conceded too many, but most of the defeats were by one goal only. Our goal difference for most of the season was ridiculously disproportionate to our position in the league.

This season I feel lucky if we managed to score one goal per game.

 

[SpurMeUp]

I think he has to go...the main barometer for me is:
If we win do we look good (No)
If we lose do we look competitive (No)

How many times last season, when we lost, it was 3-2. Most games we scored 2 or more goals per game. Yes we conceded too many, but most of the defeats were by one goal only. Our goal difference for most of the season was ridiculously disproportionate to our position in the league.

This season I feel lucky if we managed to score one goal per game.

Who was scoring those goal for us? That might give you a hint as to why we’re in the zhit. Agree Frank has to go. But at least appreciate that he doesn’t have a lot to work with in attack.

 

[Welshspur60]

With the run of games coming up between now and the end of February the only chance of picking up points is against Burnley. By the end of that run we will be in a relegation battle, especially if we drop points against Burnley.

Its very likely Burnley will beat us. Drew at Liverpool and they are hard to beat at home.

 

[Welshspur60]

Do you think managers have clauses in their contracts that say something like: if placed lower that 15th in the PL table after Xmas you can be sacked with £1m payoff only.

Would make sense. Agents might argue against it, but CL big clubs would say: look you’re a great manager, there’s no way you’ll be in this position, and if you are you will deserve to go.

I’d certainly have something like this in the contract, and any manager unwilling to sign i would question their ambition and confidence in their ability.

(Yes injuries is a logical caveat and issue outside a managers gift).

You' d hope so wouldnt you. Just as there would be some sort of bonus scheme for getting say top 6. The club would be mugs not to have a clause saying something like "bottom 6 by xmas" we may terminate your contract without compensation".

 

[Welshspur60]

Would those still backing him accept that if he’s still here next week and we lose to Burnley then he HAS to go immediately after?

Im amazed he hasnt been sacked yet. The board must act now.

 

[Welshspur60]

I think we were way worse last season.

Werent we almost stoneclad safe by now though?

 

[DeanoAustin]

Well United gave Carrick an unwinnable one at City.

Them acting will get them EL/EC. Us not will see us in a relegation scrap

I’ve seen United used as an example of why we should act now as they beat City. It’s one game. It proves nothing. Carrick has the ability to be a good manager but let’s not forget he was sacked by one of the most patient chairmen in football.

Nuno beat City in his first game.
Ossie beat Saudi Sportswashing Machine in his first game.
Even Christian Gross won his first game at Everton.

Frank has to go for no other reason than I don’t think it’s possible to do much worse. However, following United’s example guarantees us nothing and it certainly guarantees them nothing yet.

 

[tommysvr]

I’ve seen United used as an example of why we should act now as they beat City. It’s one game. It proves nothing. Carrick has the ability to be a good manager but let’s not forget he was sacked by one of the most patient chairmen in football.

Nuno beat City in his first game.
Ossie beat Saudi Sportswashing Machine in his first game.
Even Christian Gross won his first game at Everton.

Frank has to go for no other reason than I don’t think it’s possible to do much worse. However, following United’s example guarantees us nothing and it certainly guarantees them nothing yet.

What you say is very true, but it was the performance more than the result. I don't think I've seen Man Utd play with the freedom and confidence for a long, long time. It's like a huge toxic force was taken out and suddenly the players can go out and do what they need to do. I can see them finishing in the top 4 and Carrick being given the job full time.

 

[DeanoAustin]

What you say is very true, but it was the performance more than the result. I don't think I've seen Man Utd play with the freedom and confidence for a long, long time. It's like a huge toxic force was taken out and suddenly the players can go out and do what they need to do. I can see them finishing in the top 4 and Carrick being given the job full time.

Let’s see. I would like to see Carrick do well as, despite how he left us, I’ve always liked him as a player and from his interviews.

However, and I will put my hand up to being guilty of this myself, all too often football fans are far too reactive to one result or a small series of results.