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*** OMT Tottenham Hotspur v AFC Bournemouth ***

fernadez said:
Be interesting to see how the fans back the manager in his third game in charge and reason his performances compared to the allowances that were made for worse performances last couple of years.
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Only an idiot would jump on Frank. I find it interesting that you even raised the question. It's almost as though you wish someone would LOL...
 
Finney Is Back said:
Kudus himself didn’t help with that though. With 2 or 3 players around him there were numerous occasions where a simple pass to a better placed teammate was on but he instead kept the ball and tried to dribble. He has bundles of talent but needs to play for the team more, same with his defending today that was really poor, he massively left Porro out to dry having to defend both Semenyo and thei Bournemouth left back
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I think that's too harsh. He is here to create and was trying to. He wasnt helped by the movement either ahead or around him, and it wasn't until Bergvall started moving into half-space and (as you observed elsewhere) Tel looked to connect things by finding the pockets of space and moving that we started to look like our Frank-selves. Yes, there were moments when Kudus did not play a decent ort even simple ball, but he also did this several times. I would agree with the criticism of his first-half lack of tracking.

I think the biggest issue we had all game was not winning second balls or duals. I was really surprised by that TBH.
We were bullied/allowed ourselves to be, and we also felt too sorry for ourselves with regards to decisions we were not getting. It was a shame to see Richy not able to turn his frustrations around in that regard.
 
Yiddo said:
Who is realistically coming into a new job and upsetting the applecart after 2 games by making subs in the 30th minute? Lets be realistic, we were always going to have performances like this, its better being early on and whilst the transfer market is open so we can change accordingly.
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That performance was worse than some of last seasons shockers. Even the home losses v Ipswich and Leicester we had plenty of possession and shots at goal.
Making changes early would show the players that efforts like that are not acceptable.
 
Bishop said:
Johnson and Richarlison were especially terrible. I do think their inability to either control or hold the ball really hampered us. It just made it super easy for Bournemouth to triple up on Kudus. Simons makes a difference but I don't think despite how good he is that he changes everything when the problem players would likely still be on the pitch even with Simons present.
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I guess in a way they were "terrible", they didn't do much. To me they pretty much exclusively got the ball in situations where they don't thrive. Situations where I don't expect them to do well. I don't think that's on them.

There was a lot of space in that game, we just couldn't exploit it. I think a player like Simons or Maddison change that. Yes because they're good players, but not just that they're THAT good on their own.

How many times did Palhinha, Sarr and Bentancur do something useful in terms of ball progression through their pressure in the first half? They too were "terrible" in that regard. But they to mostly found themselves in situations where I wouldn't expect them to do well. I would expect Simons or Maddison to do well in those situations.

Frank mostly agreed with the reporter who mentioned that Klopp quote about a good press being more creative than any 10 post City. That can be true, but not if the opposition just play it long and you hardly ever get those turnovers.
 
Silly McSilly Face said:
I actually thought he got the starting XI wrong as well as not making subs early enough. Captain hindsight and all that but I think he should have gone with the more aggressive/progressive line-up we played against Burnley rather than the "contain and counter" type line up we played against City. I'd have started with Bergvall for example.
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In a way he ran into similar problems that Ange did, imo for similar reasons. Too many players that aren't good at progressing the ball under pressure. Makes a game against a very good pressing side a pain.

The players available that could have made a difference in that regard, Odobert, Bergvall, Gray. All very young. Tough game. Can understand not starting them, but as you say in hindsight... Probably wouldn't have been much worse at least.

I do also think perhaps there are ways to change that game with the players on the pitch, but very early days and we're probably still in the getting the basics right of playing under Frank.
 
fernadez said:
Doesn't seem like it.

People who refused to judge the last manager for any number of reasons are ready to now Frank has lost his first game

Bit brick if you've spent the previous year telling people to support managers and give them time while explaining the parameters needed for a manager to be judged for performances.
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You are not a serious person. Last season people mentioned that there were extenuating circumstances which led to most of the poor performances. Instead some insisted on insulting the manager and his quality. You were one of them. You are now trying to wind people up because you must have realised that there was some truth in it and you are launching the equivalent of a pre-emptive strike. Passion rules reason.

For my part I was unable to watch the game and I am glad for that based on the result and the posts I have seen. On to the next match.
 
Yiddo said:
The good thing about this is Frank and his team will analyse this thoroughly to try improve so it rarely happens again. Ange would have gone never mind the next game it will work.
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Let me speak my mind clearly. You are looking for trouble with this post. You are creating a very strong rod for Frank's back by bringing up Ange. I advise you to not do that as you would be seriously disappointed when people point out the ignorance in your post. Just move on and don't mention our European winning manager who has won multiple trophies in his career, just move on. Stay focused on supporting Frank and stay away from making this kind of post.
 
afsoc4life said:
You are not a serious person. Last season people mentioned that there were extenuating circumstances which led to most of the poor performances. Instead some insisted on insulting the manager and his quality. You were one of them. You are now trying to wind people up because you must have realised that there was some truth in it and you are launching the equivalent of a pre-emptive strike. Passion rules reason.

For my part I was unable to watch the game and I am glad for that based on the result and the posts I have seen. On to the next match.
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The combination of "people are ready to judge the manager" and the complete absence of literally any posts in the Frank thread post game is kind of funny.
 
SteveAWOL said:
Only the 2nd time we’ve achieved that in 22 years!

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This is a worrying statistic. Not one shot in the first half? Now I am really glad that I didn't watch the match. My blood would have been very hot.
 
Finney Is Back said:
Kudus himself didn’t help with that though. With 2 or 3 players around him there were numerous occasions where a simple pass to a better placed teammate was on but he instead kept the ball and tried to dribble. He has bundles of talent but needs to play for the team more, same with his defending today that was really poor, he massively left Porro out to dry having to defend both Semenyo and thei Bournemouth left back
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I agree there were some situations where he should have released it earlier.

I think he worked reasonably well defensively. But it's tough for wingers when it becomes direct counter attack after direct counter attack against us and we can't really get forward well ourselves. He looked rather heavy legged towards the end and I think put everything physically he could into the game (and that's was quite a lot).
 
Observations.

We have to hope that’s the end of Johnson on the left. If Frank thinks Odo and Tel aren’t up to it then we need to go into the market again. Starting to become apparent that Tel wasn’t a Frank signing (which I said at the time). Tough to watch when you see what someone like Grealish is doing.

You can’t have a team that only has one player in midfield and attack who’s capable of receiving the ball.

We look pretty threadbare up top again - Solanke just can’t seem to get fit which is going to cost us.
 
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Benny_Lad said:
Observations.

We have to hope that’s the end of Johnson on the left. If Frank thinks Odo and Tel aren’t up to it then we need to go into the market again. Starting to become apparent that Tel wasn’t a Frank signing (which I said at the time). Tough to watch when you see what someone like Grealish is doing.

You can’t have a team that only has one player in midfield and attack who’s capable of receiving the ball.

We look pretty threadbare again up top again - Solanke just can’t seem to get fit which is going to cost us.
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Johnson on the left isn't a problem in itself imo.

What you say about only having one player in midfield and attack capable of receiving the ball (under pressure and then doing something useful/progressive) definitely is. Shut that player down, shut us down. Same as when we only had Maddison that was good at that.
 
Finney Is Back said:
Kudus himself didn’t help with that though. With 2 or 3 players around him there were numerous occasions where a simple pass to a better placed teammate was on but he instead kept the ball and tried to dribble. He has bundles of talent but needs to play for the team more, same with his defending today that was really poor, he massively left Porro out to dry having to defend both Semenyo and thei Bournemouth left back
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This is exactly what West Ham fans said about him, but according to the experts on here they were only saying that because he was leaving. His assists/goals is pretty weak for a player at his price point, he still has a lot of improvements to make if he is to be considered at the level some on here have decided he is.

He is exciting, and has a skill set we don't have otherwise but his decision making can be poor. I'm sure Frank will get to work in that area...
 
braineclipse said:
Johnson on the left isn't a problem in itself imo.

What you say about only having one player in midfield and attack capable of receiving the ball (under pressure and then doing something useful/progressive) definitely is. Shut that player down, shut us down. Same as when we only had Maddison that was good at that.
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True. Having only one or two players capable of making a difference isn't good. We have been here before pre the Kulu and Bentancur transfers. We really need Kulu back. Maybe with Simons he is capable of taking some of the pressures off.
 
afsoc4life said:
True. Having only one or two players capable of making a difference isn't good. We have been here before pre the Kulu and Bentancur transfers. We really need Kulu back. Maybe with Simons he is capable of taking some of the pressures off.
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To me we have several players in the squad now who are very good in those situations (Kudus, Maddison and Simons). And several others who do well, but more depending on the situation perhaps (Kulusevski, Bergvall, Solanke, maybe Gray and Odobert).

But having only one of those on the pitch at any given time will make us vulnerable to a well executed plan like against Bournemouth.
 
braineclipse said:
Johnson on the left isn't a problem in itself imo.

What you say about only having one player in midfield and attack capable of receiving the ball (under pressure and then doing something useful/progressive) definitely is. Shut that player down, shut us down. Same as when we only had Maddison that was good at that.
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It’s a problem if you like seeing your inverted winger create anything.
 
Benny_Lad said:
It’s a problem if you like seeing your inverted winger create anything.
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Get a technical creative 10 in there to get the ball into the space between the lines to then feed Johnson in a game like that and he's a real threat imo.

But him receiving the ball under pressure facing the wrong way just isn't going to bring any joy. This was the case against Burnley and City too, but we had other ways of creating as a team.
 
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