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The Centre Back thread

Re: Central defenders

Mumorn said:
We will sell vlad and Dawson. It's just vlad will be sold to bring fazio in. Dawson will leave on deadline day.

Fazio, Kaboul, Dier and Vertonghen is a good set of Centre halves.
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I'd rather keep Chiriches than Kaboul 2bh.
 
Re: Central defenders

jimmyb said:
It doesn't bode well if that is the level we are after. Smacks of limited ambition or desperation to sign anyone. At best, we would be standing still while others forge ahead.

At the moment, it all seems to be based on little more than that Fazio has stopped contract talks with Sevilla and that Spurs have been frustrated in their attempt to sign Musacchio. No quotes. No evidence. Just a speculative punt by a Spanish newspaper which has been picked up by so many other media sources that it has somehow snowballed into seeming like fact. At least.......that's what I'm hoping!
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i cant believe all the negativity about the potential signing of Fazio :eek:

so much for "trust Poch", "believe in Baldini", "get behind the club" :)
 
Re: Central defenders

NWND said:
Fazio is gonna be Fonte (stopper) to Vert's Lovren (sweeper) isn't he?
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Speaking of Lovren I think a lot of reactions would have been fairly similar about him had we been linked last summer. Was a good deal though for Southampton...

Anyone that's seen Fazio think there's a chance he's another one capable of doing more than he's shown so far?
 
Re: Central defenders

Mumorn said:
We will sell vlad and Dawson. It's just vlad will be sold to bring fazio in. Dawson will leave on deadline day.

Fazio, Kaboul, Dier and Vertonghen is a good set of Centre halves.
Click to expand...

I don't think it is.

Fazio is, by all accounts, a Dawson type of centre half. Good in the air but slow and immobile. Good in the air is good. But the rest of it is not what we need at all. Not the way Poch wants us to play. Kaboul is liable to be injured at any time and, anyway, isn't half the player he was before his knee injury. Dier is 20 years old and a rookie in the English game. We can't expect too much too soon from him. Vertonghen is the only one of the four who ticks all the boxes. And even he was poor last season

We have looked dodgy at the back throughout preseason and for the first couple of competitive games this season. Of course, that's in part down to rustiness and the players getting used to Poch's system. But let's not bury our heads in the sand. Our central defence was poor last season. It is not quick and mobile enough. We desperately needed to strengthen. But Dier and Fazio in exchange for Dawson and Chiriches is not strengthening. At best, it is standing still. Fazio, especially, seems like a pointless panic buy because we have failed to get any of our other targets.

I can see more heavy beatings ahead this season if we can't get anyone better in.
 
Re: Central defenders

indianspur said:
i cant believe all the negativity about the potential signing of Fazio :eek:

so much for "trust Poch", "believe in Baldini", "get behind the club" :)
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:lol:

There's a difference between being negative about one signing and being negative about pretty much everything about the club! ;)
 
Re: Central defenders

jimmyb said:
:lol:

There's a difference between being negative about one signing and being negative about pretty much everything about the club! ;)
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moi?? I think you are very wrong but you are entitled to think whatever you want.

however saying.... " It doesn't bode well if that is the level we are after. Smacks of limited ambition or desperation to sign anyone. At best, we would be standing still while others forge ahead." ....suggests that you dont have as much faith in Poch and Baldini as you make out you have. This is just one signing after all

also, it seems from your posts you are basing your opinion of Fazio on what others have said, not with your own experience of watching the player. How can you get so heated about a player you know very little about?
 
Re: Central defenders

the fact that Fazio sent a right hook into Diego Costa's belly region already makes him a hero to me. Fazio is very welcome at WHL =D>
 
Re: Central defenders

jimmyb said:
I don't think it is.

Fazio is, by all accounts, a Dawson type of centre half. Good in the air but slow and immobile. Good in the air is good. But the rest of it is not what we need at all. Not the way Poch wants us to play. Kaboul is liable to be injured at any time and, anyway, isn't half the player he was before his knee injury. Dier is 20 years old and a rookie in the English game. We can't expect too much too soon from him. Vertonghen is the only one of the four who ticks all the boxes. And even he was poor last season

We have looked dodgy at the back throughout preseason and for the first couple of competitive games this season. Of course, that's in part down to rustiness and the players getting used to Poch's system. But let's not bury our heads in the sand. Our central defence was poor last season. It is not quick and mobile enough. We desperately needed to strengthen. But Dier and Fazio in exchange for Dawson and Chiriches is not strengthening. At best, it is standing still. Fazio, especially, seems like a pointless panic buy because we have failed to get any of our other targets.

I can see more heavy beatings ahead this season if we can't get anyone better in.
Click to expand...

Fazio is not a Dawson type player. You don't get Dawson type players in Spanish football. If you want to compare people in English football to Fazio, it would be Demichelis or Coloccini at Saudi Sportswashing Machine. He is far better on the ball than Dawson. He isn't the most mobile and he's obviously second on the list behind Mussachio. I think in that respect fans are dissapointed, but Mussachio was being linked to Barca/Real Madrid and they appear to have gone for other targets, probably because of the complexity of the deal and the shared ownership making it a difficult transfer to do.

Fazio will be well known by Pochettino from his time in Spain. I can't see him being anything but a Poch target (not his no 1 which was Mussachio). Everything points to it being a Poch target. Spanish football target (not Italian = Baldini or cheap English = Levy/Pleat etc) and he's Argentinian. He's a good Levy deal in that its a simple, relatively inexpensive transfer with a release clause, but ultimately, he's a player that Poch probably wants and he captained Sevilla to a Europa League win and a decent league finish.

I'm also getting annoyed by this idea that Pochettino's defenders require to be really quick and mobile. No they don't. His defence at Espanyol did not feature quick centre-backs. His defence at Southampton featured positively slow centre-backs.

The most important thing for Pochettino in his centrebacks is apparently that they are good on the ball.

Pochettino believes in building a team defensive unit where the whole team defends as a unit. Therefore positioning and intelligence are the key ingredients. Not pace. Smalling is a fast, mobile centre-back. But he's a bit dumb. In that respect he wouldn't be a good choice for Poch's team. Jose Fonte was very similar in build and athleticism to Fazio. But Fazio is a better player.

Poch made Fonte and Lovren work and built a great defensive unit at Southampton.

Ultimately, your defensive quality is all about how you defend as a unit and a team, less about the individual defenders themselves (well they need to be intelligent, good team players and have good positioning).
 
Re: Central defenders

i do wonder if we are signing him as a back up for Vertonghen. Both are left sided centre halves

we might still be after another right sided centre half if both Dawson and Kaboul leave.

New centre back plus Vertonghen as first choice, with Dier and Fazio as back ups
 
Re: Central defenders

NWND said:
Fazio is not a Dawson type player. You don't get Dawson type players in Spanish football. If you want to compare people in English football to Fazio, it would be Demichelis or Coloccini at Saudi Sportswashing Machine. He is far better on the ball than Dawson. He isn't the most mobile and he's obviously second on the list behind Mussachio. I think in that respect fans are dissapointed, but Mussachio was being linked to Barca/Real Madrid and they appear to have gone for other targets, probably because of the complexity of the deal and the shared ownership making it a difficult transfer to do.

Fazio will be well known by Pochettino from his time in Spain. I can't see him being anything but a Poch target (not his no 1 which was Mussachio). Everything points to it being a Poch target. Spanish football target (not Italian = Baldini or cheap English = Levy/Pleat etc) and he's Argentinian. He's a good Levy deal in that its a simple, relatively inexpensive transfer with a release clause, but ultimately, he's a player that Poch probably wants and he captained Sevilla to a Europa League win and a decent league finish.

I'm also getting annoyed by this idea that Pochettino's defenders require to be really quick and mobile. No they don't. His defence at Espanyol did not feature quick centre-backs. His defence at Southampton featured positively slow centre-backs.

The most important thing for Pochettino in his centrebacks is apparently that they are good on the ball.

Pochettino believes in building a team defensive unit where the whole team defends as a unit. Therefore positioning and intelligence are the key ingredients. Not pace. Smalling is a fast, mobile centre-back. But he's a bit dumb. In that respect he wouldn't be a good choice for Poch's team. Jose Fonte was very similar in build and athleticism to Fazio. But Fazio is a better player.

Poch made Fonte and Lovren work and built a great defensive unit at Southampton.

Ultimately, your defensive quality is all about how you defend as a unit and a team, less about the individual defenders themselves (well they need to be intelligent, good team players and have good positioning).
Click to expand...

very good post
 
Re: Central defenders

NWND said:
Fazio is not a Dawson type player. You don't get Dawson type players in Spanish football. If you want to compare people in English football to Fazio, it would be Demichelis or Coloccini at Saudi Sportswashing Machine. He is far better on the ball than Dawson. He isn't the most mobile and he's obviously second on the list behind Mussachio. I think in that respect fans are dissapointed, but Mussachio was being linked to Barca/Real Madrid and they appear to have gone for other targets, probably because of the complexity of the deal and the shared ownership making it a difficult transfer to do.

Fazio will be well known by Pochettino from his time in Spain. I can't see him being anything but a Poch target (not his no 1 which was Mussachio). Everything points to it being a Poch target. Spanish football target (not Italian = Baldini or cheap English = Levy/Pleat etc) and he's Argentinian. He's a good Levy deal in that its a simple, relatively inexpensive transfer with a release clause, but ultimately, he's a player that Poch probably wants and he captained Sevilla to a Europa League win and a decent league finish.

I'm also getting annoyed by this idea that Pochettino's defenders require to be really quick and mobile. No they don't. His defence at Espanyol did not feature quick centre-backs. His defence at Southampton featured positively slow centre-backs.

The most important thing for Pochettino in his centrebacks is apparently that they are good on the ball.

Pochettino believes in building a team defensive unit where the whole team defends as a unit. Therefore positioning and intelligence are the key ingredients. Not pace. Smalling is a fast, mobile centre-back. But he's a bit dumb. In that respect he wouldn't be a good choice for Poch's team. Jose Fonte was very similar in build and athleticism to Fazio. But Fazio is a better player.

Poch made Fonte and Lovren work and built a great defensive unit at Southampton.

Ultimately, your defensive quality is all about how you defend as a unit and a team, less about the individual defenders themselves (well they need to be intelligent, good team players and have good positioning).
Click to expand...

Agree totally, good centreback read the game and don't just react.
 
Re: Central defenders

NWND said:
Fazio is not a Dawson type player. You don't get Dawson type players in Spanish football. If you want to compare people in English football to Fazio, it would be Demichelis or Coloccini at Saudi Sportswashing Machine. He is far better on the ball than Dawson. He isn't the most mobile and he's obviously second on the list behind Mussachio. I think in that respect fans are dissapointed, but Mussachio was being linked to Barca/Real Madrid and they appear to have gone for other targets, probably because of the complexity of the deal and the shared ownership making it a difficult transfer to do.

Fazio will be well known by Pochettino from his time in Spain. I can't see him being anything but a Poch target (not his no 1 which was Mussachio). Everything points to it being a Poch target. Spanish football target (not Italian = Baldini or cheap English = Levy/Pleat etc) and he's Argentinian. He's a good Levy deal in that its a simple, relatively inexpensive transfer with a release clause, but ultimately, he's a player that Poch probably wants and he captained Sevilla to a Europa League win and a decent league finish.

I'm also getting annoyed by this idea that Pochettino's defenders require to be really quick and mobile. No they don't. His defence at Espanyol did not feature quick centre-backs. His defence at Southampton featured positively slow centre-backs.

The most important thing for Pochettino in his centrebacks is apparently that they are good on the ball.

Pochettino believes in building a team defensive unit where the whole team defends as a unit. Therefore positioning and intelligence are the key ingredients. Not pace. Smalling is a fast, mobile centre-back. But he's a bit dumb. In that respect he wouldn't be a good choice for Poch's team. Jose Fonte was very similar in build and athleticism to Fazio. But Fazio is a better player.

Poch made Fonte and Lovren work and built a great defensive unit at Southampton.

Ultimately, your defensive quality is all about how you defend as a unit and a team, less about the individual defenders themselves (well they need to be intelligent, good team players and have good positioning).
Click to expand...

Very good post (apart from the Fazio opinions, I don't know if those are right or not).

One thing you do want from defenders in a high line is for them to be good one against one defensively, because when the pressing does fail that's what you end up with quite a bit. Pace plays a part in that, but only one part in many and it's not necessary. Several very good or even excellent defenders in high line systems have been relatively slow. Again though, I don't know if that's true with Fazio.
 
Re: Central defenders

braineclipse said:
Very good post (apart from the Fazio opinions, I don't know if those are right or not).

One thing you do want from defenders in a high line is for them to be good one against one defensively, because when the pressing does fail that's what you end up with quite a bit. Pace plays a part in that, but only one part in many and it's not necessary. Several very good or even excellent defenders in high line systems have been relatively slow. Again though, I don't know if that's true with Fazio.
Click to expand...

yesterday i posted this link about Fazio. Its a bit of analysis......http://www.squawka.com/news/squawka-scout-why-federico-fazio-would-be-a-good-signing-for-arsenal-or-liverpool/130689
 
Re: Central defenders

Seems like Fazio to Spurs is very close.


Hotspur Related @HotspurRelated

Sevilla manager Unai Emery has confirmed Fazio will not play versus Valencia as he's move to Spurs is imminent. #THFC


Hotspur Related @HotspurRelated

.@jmolivacope confirms Tottenham Hotspur have met Fazio's €10M release clause and the move is now imminent. #THFC


Hotspur Related @HotspurRelated

Sevilla manager: "Fazio has little or no chance to be with us tomorrow." #THFC


Hotspur Related @HotspurRelated

Sevilla manager: "Fazio's departure makes us happy for him." #THFC


Hotspur Related @HotspurRelated

Sevilla manager: The is effects of winning titles. We preferred him to stay." #THFC
 
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