Thomas Frank - Head Coach

[Mikey10]

I can't stop thinking about the dire situation at the club and this morning I had a thought whilst lying in bed....

After Semenyo's goal there has been talk again about Frank not concerned about shots from outside the box as the Xg is low...

The Xg probably is low if attackers are closed down as instead of driving straight through the ball with power , the ball has to be 'curled' round the oncoming defender to a much smaller target and also travels much slower... This would allow the keeper to reach it etc....

As we seem to be proving, the Xg from uncontested shots from outside the area is a lot higher.. Why has Frank not considered this?

Yesterday’s View From the Lane had Jay Harris (who used to be the Brentford correspondent for The Athletic) talking about how shots from outside the box (particularly when Raya was their keeper) were an issue when TF was there.

 

[Mikey10]

You cannot see it's just a harmless prank? Wow.

It was more that it’s so obvious and unfunny that I couldn’t understand why anyone would waste any time creating it. I suppose that’s why (bar here) I’ve not been on any social media for knocking on 15 years. That kind of thing does nothing for me.

 

[Lemonade Money]

I can't stop thinking about the dire situation at the club and this morning I had a thought whilst lying in bed....

After Semenyo's goal there has been talk again about Frank not concerned about shots from outside the box as the Xg is low...

The Xg probably is low if attackers are closed down as instead of driving straight through the ball with power , the ball has to be 'curled' round the oncoming defender to a much smaller target and also travels much slower... This would allow the keeper to reach it etc....

As we seem to be proving, the Xg from uncontested shots from outside the area is a lot higher.. Why has Frank not considered this?

I have lost a lot of faith in Frank's ability to manage our club and if I am correct in my above thoughts it is yet another example of his unsuitability...

The thought i had about Liz Hurley was much more pleasant....

COYS

TBF, we had quite a few long range shots early on.

 

[braineclipse]

I can't stop thinking about the dire situation at the club and this morning I had a thought whilst lying in bed....

After Semenyo's goal there has been talk again about Frank not concerned about shots from outside the box as the Xg is low...

The Xg probably is low if attackers are closed down as instead of driving straight through the ball with power , the ball has to be 'curled' round the oncoming defender to a much smaller target and also travels much slower... This would allow the keeper to reach it etc....

As we seem to be proving, the Xg from uncontested shots from outside the area is a lot higher.. Why has Frank not considered this?

I have lost a lot of faith in Frank's ability to manage our club and if I am correct in my above thoughts it is yet another example of his unsuitability...

The thought i had about Liz Hurley was much more pleasant....

COYS

Good post.

I'm certainly not against data in football or a data driven approach. I have some experience/knowledge about statistics and know enough to know a bit about how frequently statistics are misinterpreted or used to support conclusion that aren't actually supported by those stats - even by really smart people.

I don't think it's implausible that people in football are struggling to parse and actually wisely use the huge amount of stats now available to them.

If this is true for Frank and his coaching team I don't know. But that pattern of relatively uncontested long shots are a concern.

I think a similar thing is true for crosses. Typically seen as a lower probability type of chance creation. But the difference between a cross where the crosser has time and space to pick and execute their cross is big. The difference between getting around and putting the ball in between the defenders and goalie compared to a more hopeful punt. The difference between a cross when defenders are unsettled, moving, bit of chaos in the box and one where the defenders are all settled and expecting it.

Both the goals resulting from crosses against Bournemouth were imo examples of factors leading to those being higher probability crosses than some others.

 

[mudshark]

It was more that it’s so obvious and unfunny that I couldn’t understand why anyone would waste any time creating it. I suppose that’s why (bar here) I’ve not been on any social media for knocking on 15 years. That kind of thing does nothing for me.

It's the sort of reductio ad absurdum that should force people to confront how ridiculous the whole Cupgate story was, in a similar way that the writers of Till Death Us Do Part sought to ridicule Garnett's bigotry so that intelligent people watching would see that...

Oh.

 

[braineclipse]

And what "circumstances" are these? A history of perpetual underacheivement? A single trophy in 17 years? Expecting champagne football with a crate of Lidl players? Or one where the opposing manager starts his half time talk when 2-0 down with: "Lads... it's Tottenham!!"

I guess that's one way of putting it. Not what I thought of.

We're a club in a relatively strong financial position. Below some teams we want to compete with (and that will always be a challenge to overcome), but more money than most PL clubs, way more than most other "big league" clubs.

We have a fairly exciting squad with a lot of good talented young players. And imo some really good players who are already ready made. We do also unfortunately have a squad that's lacking in balance, even if everyone were somehow fit. We have a squad that hasn't been put in place with any cohesive overall strategy/identity. The squad is a bit of a mess, but imo only a bit of a mess, far from a complete mess.

Overall there's a lack of identity at the club. We have a (fairly demanding) fan base that does value attacking and attractive football rather highly. A fan base that gets quite easily bored and is less accepting of boring football than most.

We imo don't need a rebuild of the squad. But we're screaming out from someone who can make this lot with some singings into a cohesive unit, with an identity and a strong plan on what to work towards. With our aims being high, the demands for being able to control games and attack to get there. If we can now play as underdogs in most games that won't last if we're ever going to reach our aims. Improve and we'll soon enough be a team that others play as underdogs against. For that reason and fan expectations, club "DNA" I think we're more likely to succeed with someone playing a fairly attacking and attractive style. That person will also be more likely to be given time when results aren't there.

The circumstances are essentially perfect for a Pochettino type, as he was when he came here, not saying he's the right guy now. Someone who has experience instilling and coaching a fairly attacking style, with a clear and strong philosophy/approach (that fits the club DNA) and experience working through a bit of chaos and turmoil.

Obviously the more experience he has doing a similar job elsewhere and doing well the better. Player/youth development and integration another key characteristic.

 

[Finney Is Back]

I'm not sure my observation tracks nearly on to the phases of the game.

We did press high (not super high aggressive, man to man) for periods. To put it like this, how often did we get turnovers, win possession or throw ins, build momentum to attack ourselves from that. Compared to how often Bournemouth just passed their way through that and into our own half. To me that high press, when we did it, was mostly ineffective.

Whereas when Bournemouth properly pressed us we rather often struggled to get out.

I guess our press was more of a "force them to go long" type press. And they did do that at times. But too often for my liking that first line of pressure was just bypassed and they rather easily progressed the ball. May just be mt impression.

I thought we did it for the first 15 minutes and Bournemouth didn't really get through it at all.

 

[braineclipse]

I thought we did it for the first 15 minutes and Bournemouth didn't really get through it at all.

Yes, good point and shold have mentioned that. For that opening spell we did that well.

Changing between a high press and more mid/low block, not pressing high in a halfway kind of way was something we were rather good at in the early stages of the season. Maybe partly players missing, form and being a bit exhausted.

 

[Mabspurs]

I guess that's one way of putting it. Not what I thought of.

We're a club in a relatively strong financial position. Below some teams we want to compete with (and that will always be a challenge to overcome), but more money than most PL clubs, way more than most other "big league" clubs.

We have always been in a relatively strong financial position except those few years while the stadium was being built. However it's not the financial position that is the issue but how much the board is willing to accept risk from increased buying and wages... up till now there has been no sign of any difference from the Levy years

We have a fairly exciting squad with a lot of good talented young players. And imo some really good players who are already ready made. We do also unfortunately have a squad that's lacking in balance, even if everyone were somehow fit. We have a squad that hasn't been put in place with any cohesive overall strategy/identity. The squad is a bit of a mess, but imo only a bit of a mess, far from a complete mess.

Seriously? you are excited by the current squad? We have a fairly exciting squad with a lot of good talented young players with good potential who are still nowhere close to being consistently exciting and productive; plus a senior element (at least those fit to play at the moment, with the exception of the two centre backs) who - on the whole - are anything but top 6 level

Overall there's a lack of identity at the club. We have a (fairly demanding) fan base that does value attacking and attractive football rather highly. A fan base that gets quite easily bored and is less accepting of boring football than most.

We have a fan base that more than fairly demanding .... I would say we have an irrational, if not delusional, fan base which harps about "history" when the likes of Forest and Leicester have won more than us in the past 30 years. The supposed values of "attacking and attractive" football have been used to mask this monstrous underachievement, as a sort of protective shield, when seeing our supposed rivals lift honour after honour over the past few decades.

We imo don't need a rebuild of the squad. But we're screaming out from someone who can make this lot with some singings into a cohesive unit, with an identity and a strong plan on what to work towards. With our aims being high, the demands for being able to control games and attack to get there. If we can now play as underdogs in most games that won't last if we're ever going to reach our aims. Improve and we'll soon enough be a team that others play as underdogs against. For that reason and fan expectations, club "DNA" I think we're more likely to succeed with someone playing a fairly attacking and attractive style. That person will also be more likely to be given time when results aren't there.

So you think a new coach will just breeze in and make a cohesive unit from a set of players that misplace a routine pass every three minutes? We will need to agree to disagree on that.

The circumstances are essentially perfect for a Pochettino type, as he was when he came here, not saying he's the right guy now. Someone who has experience instilling and coaching a fairly attacking style, with a clear and strong philosophy/approach (that fits the club DNA) and experience working through a bit of chaos and turmoil.

We just had a coach who ha(d) experience instilling and coaching a fairly very attacking style, (that fits the club DNA) and with a clear and strong philosophy/approach.... remember?

I would love nothing more than seeing some new messiah walz in and transform this imbalanced bunch of players - assembled without any clear philosophy (where I agree with you 200%) - and morph it miraculously into a team that plays exciting, attractive football without being powder puff at the back and in the process actually win games on a regular basis (something it has not really done since 2019). It's just that I think that is complete PolyAnna and the only way forward is a long hard slog where hopefully some promising young players start to use their experience to live up to their potential and, over several transfer windows, we replace those who clearly are not good enough to reach the lofty aims you describe.

 

[BrentwoodSpur]

He must be on this site

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