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The Youth Players/On-Loan Thread 2019/20
- Thread starter Glenda's Legs
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nayimfromthehalfwayline
Andy Thompson
https://www.motforum.com/article.php?page=38694
Angus Kinnear confirms Clarke to return to Spurs but question mark still hangs over Nketiah
26 Dec 2019 10:32pm, by YorkshireSquare
There has been much speculation about a couple of Leeds United’s loan signings over the past few months with both Jack Clarke and Eddie Nketiah getting limited game time so far this season. Clarke has only played three times for Leeds this season since his £9 million summer move to Spurs and subsequent loan back. Two starts in the League Cup and one substitute appearance in the Championship of only 19 minutes are the limit of the young wingers first team opportunities with fierce competition behind Helder Costa, Jack Harrison and Gjanni Alioski.
Ending the speculation on Clarke, Angus Kinnear used his programme notes from the Boxing Day game to inform that Jack Clarke would indeed be returning to Spurs, confirming a story broken by Phil Hay in the athletic earlier in the day. Thanking Clarke he said…
"We thank Jack Clarke for his services and wish him the best of luck in his career as Spurs have confirmed, due to the lack of playing time, he will be recalled in the January window.
The summer sale of Clarke divided opinion after his breakout 2018/19 season. A pretty impressive season for an emerging young player but it was clear that Leeds needed to sell to invest and Clarke was always the likely candidate to bring in the cash. Despite those impressive performances in his first season, Clarke had faded towards the end of his first season and Marcelo Bielsa has clearly not been impressed enough for Clarke to feature much this term. Clarke will undoubtedly go on to have a great career but is obviously not a player Marcelo Bielsa thinks Leeds need for the run-in."
Kinnear also spoke about Eddie Nketiah, though the question mark still hangs over the future of his loan deal. Nketiah’s opportunities have also been limited though he has made more of an impact than Clarke scoring five goals in two League Cup starts and fourteen substitute appearances in the Championship. A hot prospect, the loan signing of Nketiah was a big deal for Leeds and Arsenal will be keen to ensure the England U21 striker is getting the right development at Leeds. If they don’t think he is there are plenty of Championship clubs who would snap him up with Bristol City the rumoured destination. The Leeds Managing Director said…
"I appreciate much speculation still surrounds the immediate future of Eddie Nketiah and although Arsenal have the right to recall him in January, we still beleive he can make a huge impact over the remainder of the season at Leeds United. Accordingley, we are endeavouring to convince Eddie and the technical team at Arsenal that the coaching environment and profile of the playing opportunity at Throp Arch and Elland Road is still the best choice for his long-term development."
Angus Kinnear confirms Clarke to return to Spurs but question mark still hangs over Nketiah
26 Dec 2019 10:32pm, by YorkshireSquare
There has been much speculation about a couple of Leeds United’s loan signings over the past few months with both Jack Clarke and Eddie Nketiah getting limited game time so far this season. Clarke has only played three times for Leeds this season since his £9 million summer move to Spurs and subsequent loan back. Two starts in the League Cup and one substitute appearance in the Championship of only 19 minutes are the limit of the young wingers first team opportunities with fierce competition behind Helder Costa, Jack Harrison and Gjanni Alioski.
Ending the speculation on Clarke, Angus Kinnear used his programme notes from the Boxing Day game to inform that Jack Clarke would indeed be returning to Spurs, confirming a story broken by Phil Hay in the athletic earlier in the day. Thanking Clarke he said…
"We thank Jack Clarke for his services and wish him the best of luck in his career as Spurs have confirmed, due to the lack of playing time, he will be recalled in the January window.
The summer sale of Clarke divided opinion after his breakout 2018/19 season. A pretty impressive season for an emerging young player but it was clear that Leeds needed to sell to invest and Clarke was always the likely candidate to bring in the cash. Despite those impressive performances in his first season, Clarke had faded towards the end of his first season and Marcelo Bielsa has clearly not been impressed enough for Clarke to feature much this term. Clarke will undoubtedly go on to have a great career but is obviously not a player Marcelo Bielsa thinks Leeds need for the run-in."
Kinnear also spoke about Eddie Nketiah, though the question mark still hangs over the future of his loan deal. Nketiah’s opportunities have also been limited though he has made more of an impact than Clarke scoring five goals in two League Cup starts and fourteen substitute appearances in the Championship. A hot prospect, the loan signing of Nketiah was a big deal for Leeds and Arsenal will be keen to ensure the England U21 striker is getting the right development at Leeds. If they don’t think he is there are plenty of Championship clubs who would snap him up with Bristol City the rumoured destination. The Leeds Managing Director said…
"I appreciate much speculation still surrounds the immediate future of Eddie Nketiah and although Arsenal have the right to recall him in January, we still beleive he can make a huge impact over the remainder of the season at Leeds United. Accordingley, we are endeavouring to convince Eddie and the technical team at Arsenal that the coaching environment and profile of the playing opportunity at Throp Arch and Elland Road is still the best choice for his long-term development."
We could loan him back up there instead, then GB could pop back to do a weekly guest spot loan update?
Gazza Dazzla
Jimmy McCormick
Glenda's Legs
Jack Jull
spurspinter1
John Lacy
Is Foyth still young enough to be considered a youngster? Beause he could definitely do with a loan somewhere to figure out doing the basics right, perhaps focusing on not costing his team a goal every f*ing time he plays.
Edit - Agree with Windy on getting the young goalkeepers out to somewhere they'll get some experience under their belt.
Same goes for KWP and Skipp big time, both of them have enough to make a big difference and week in week out games in the championship could be the making of them.
Bedfordspurs
Gary Lineker
You cannot out a lad that starts for Argentina IMO... he would not like that unless there is a move a5 the end of it
I think his sexual orientation isn’t up for discussion currently, regardless of international status?
Bedfordspurs
Gary Lineker
Sandman
Mitchell Thomas
Personally I would still like to see us give CCV a chance with us. I doubt he would make as many mistakes as Foyth. Everytime that guy plays he causes a goal or a penalty.
milo
Jack L. Jones
I think that you're being harsh on Foyth. He's young and has been in and out of the team. I think that he has a lot of promise but just needs to improve his Spidey sense.
I'm not aware of CCV doing anything on his loans to suggest that he's ready for the PL. I can see the sense in Mourinho and the coaches getting a look next month though. I think we'll sell him.
Sandman
Mitchell Thomas
You are right in some ways with CCV. In the second half of last season with Swansea he was playing well. They wanted to sign him and I thought it was a good time to get him back. But we loaned him out yet again. Look at it from his point of view. Everytime he goes to a new club he has to get use to new coaches, systems and players. Seems he has done ok at Stoke. But is not pulling up any trees its true. But a lot of players who go on loan to lower leagues dont really impose themselves, then come back to their real club and push on.
As for Foyth. Well maybe I am being harsh. But the way he lost he ball yesterday in the middle of the park was pretty bad. And he caused us issues in the past. There were two situations yesterday where I think he could have given a penalty away by the opposition player did not push the action. What I am saying I suppose is that he makes me super nervous in possession.
nayimfromthehalfwayline
Andy Thompson
Pretty sure CCV is being brought in to sell. Derby were interested last I saw...
Foyth is an excellent player in the making, he really needs games though and Id consider a loan for him. Give him half a season playing every week and he'll return a new man IMHO.
nayimfromthehalfwayline
Andy Thompson
https://www.eadt.co.uk/sport/ipswich-town-exit-interview-anthony-georgiou-1-6443705
Exit Interview: The brightest of starts but no progression as Georgiou heads home after limited chances at Ipswich
PUBLISHED: 10:00 30 December 2019
Andy Warren
Anthony Georgiou has returned to Tottenham following the end of his loan at Ipswich Town. Andy Warren looks back at his brief time at Portman Road.
Be honest, had you heard of Anthony Georgiou when his loan move to Portman Road was announced on August 19?
After some frantic internet searching and the viewing of the Cypriot international playing for Tottenham's first team in a pre-season game with Roma, there was real excitement as to what he could offer.
In many ways he was exactly what Ipswich needed. Quick, attacking and an out-and-out left-winger. Could he play left-back, too? 'Imagine what he could do in tandem with Luke Garbutt' we thought.
He couldn't realistically have gotten off to a better start, either.
Georgiou was named on the bench just a day after making his move and, with Ipswich trailing 1-0 to AFC Wimbledon having toiled during a miserable first-half, stepped off the bench at the interval. He changed the game, with his trickery, width and drive towards goal opening the contest up and proving the catalyst for James Norwood and Kayden Jackson's late goals on a dramatic night under the Portman Road lights.
Sadly, though, that was as good as it got for the 22-year-old.
He leaves having never made a league start, doing so just twice in the FA Cup and once more in the EFL Trophy.
His 10 substitute appearances from the bench were packed with effort and promise but, sadly, the end product never quite reached the heights of his debut.
Garbutt's form and the switch to wing-backs didn't help his cause as the Blues' regular system changes made it difficult to imagine where Georgiou would fit in. He only made the bench as Lambert's youthful side edged past Peterborough on penalties in the trophy at the start of the month and, from that point onwards, it was clear his loan would not be extended when it expired at the end of the year.
Could things have been different had he been given greater opportunity during the early weeks of his loan? That's something we will never know.
The return to fitness of Freddie Sears and the possibilities the January transfer window brings, coupled with Georgiou's failure to fly following a promising start, means a break-up is probably best for all parties.
What went well
The previously-mentioned game with AFC Wimbledon is the perfect example of what the international winger can bring to a side.
He's an out-and-out winger with a positive first touch who looks to make something happen each and every time he gets on the ball.
He did it well on that occasion, beating his man and fizzing in low crosses to tease the Wimbledon defence and backed that up with another positive impact during his 20 minutes on the pitch at Bolton.
He looked like the man to change the game again when Rotherham camE and conquered Portman Road in October and was the focal point as the Blues came from behind in the FA Cup game with Lincoln as he was finally handed a first start.
Areas to improve
Consistency.
In total he played just 489 minutes in an Ipswich shirt and, while there were positives from most of his 13 appearances, they clearly weren't consistent enough to earn regular time on the field.
It's not unusual for wingers to find it hard to produce on a consistent basis, it's an issue which has plagued Gwion Edwards, Danny Rowe and (an admittedly out-of-position) Alan Judge this season too. But consistency is what can make or break players in that position.
While inconsistency is par for the course in an attacking sense, there were one or two occasions where he lost runners in the defensive third and that's something that could use a little work.
All in all, though, you have to feel Georgiou had little chance of gaining any kind of consistent momentum given he was feeding off scraps when it came to minutes.
What the future holds
Georgiou now returns to parent club Tottenham, now managed by Jose Mourinho, and of course finds himself a significant distance from the Premier League side's first-team.
He will presumably slide back into the Under 23 side in Premier League 2 but, now 22 himself, the clock is ticking in terms of his involvement there.
His senior involvement beyond his time at Portman Road consists of one unused substitute appearance for Spurs in the FA Cup at Newport two years ago, as well as 11 appearances for Levante's reserve side in the third division of Spanish football.
He has another 18 months on his contract at White Hart Lane but, like so many before him, it feels as if his career will truly begin once he's left the safety of Premier League academy football.
Exit Interview: The brightest of starts but no progression as Georgiou heads home after limited chances at Ipswich
PUBLISHED: 10:00 30 December 2019
Andy Warren
Anthony Georgiou has returned to Tottenham following the end of his loan at Ipswich Town. Andy Warren looks back at his brief time at Portman Road.
Be honest, had you heard of Anthony Georgiou when his loan move to Portman Road was announced on August 19?
After some frantic internet searching and the viewing of the Cypriot international playing for Tottenham's first team in a pre-season game with Roma, there was real excitement as to what he could offer.
In many ways he was exactly what Ipswich needed. Quick, attacking and an out-and-out left-winger. Could he play left-back, too? 'Imagine what he could do in tandem with Luke Garbutt' we thought.
He couldn't realistically have gotten off to a better start, either.
Georgiou was named on the bench just a day after making his move and, with Ipswich trailing 1-0 to AFC Wimbledon having toiled during a miserable first-half, stepped off the bench at the interval. He changed the game, with his trickery, width and drive towards goal opening the contest up and proving the catalyst for James Norwood and Kayden Jackson's late goals on a dramatic night under the Portman Road lights.
Sadly, though, that was as good as it got for the 22-year-old.
He leaves having never made a league start, doing so just twice in the FA Cup and once more in the EFL Trophy.
His 10 substitute appearances from the bench were packed with effort and promise but, sadly, the end product never quite reached the heights of his debut.
Garbutt's form and the switch to wing-backs didn't help his cause as the Blues' regular system changes made it difficult to imagine where Georgiou would fit in. He only made the bench as Lambert's youthful side edged past Peterborough on penalties in the trophy at the start of the month and, from that point onwards, it was clear his loan would not be extended when it expired at the end of the year.
Could things have been different had he been given greater opportunity during the early weeks of his loan? That's something we will never know.
The return to fitness of Freddie Sears and the possibilities the January transfer window brings, coupled with Georgiou's failure to fly following a promising start, means a break-up is probably best for all parties.
What went well
The previously-mentioned game with AFC Wimbledon is the perfect example of what the international winger can bring to a side.
He's an out-and-out winger with a positive first touch who looks to make something happen each and every time he gets on the ball.
He did it well on that occasion, beating his man and fizzing in low crosses to tease the Wimbledon defence and backed that up with another positive impact during his 20 minutes on the pitch at Bolton.
He looked like the man to change the game again when Rotherham camE and conquered Portman Road in October and was the focal point as the Blues came from behind in the FA Cup game with Lincoln as he was finally handed a first start.
Areas to improve
Consistency.
In total he played just 489 minutes in an Ipswich shirt and, while there were positives from most of his 13 appearances, they clearly weren't consistent enough to earn regular time on the field.
It's not unusual for wingers to find it hard to produce on a consistent basis, it's an issue which has plagued Gwion Edwards, Danny Rowe and (an admittedly out-of-position) Alan Judge this season too. But consistency is what can make or break players in that position.
While inconsistency is par for the course in an attacking sense, there were one or two occasions where he lost runners in the defensive third and that's something that could use a little work.
All in all, though, you have to feel Georgiou had little chance of gaining any kind of consistent momentum given he was feeding off scraps when it came to minutes.
What the future holds
Georgiou now returns to parent club Tottenham, now managed by Jose Mourinho, and of course finds himself a significant distance from the Premier League side's first-team.
He will presumably slide back into the Under 23 side in Premier League 2 but, now 22 himself, the clock is ticking in terms of his involvement there.
His senior involvement beyond his time at Portman Road consists of one unused substitute appearance for Spurs in the FA Cup at Newport two years ago, as well as 11 appearances for Levante's reserve side in the third division of Spanish football.
He has another 18 months on his contract at White Hart Lane but, like so many before him, it feels as if his career will truly begin once he's left the safety of Premier League academy football.
Finney Is Back
Barry Daines
I would be more than happy to loan CCV to Derby if they give us first refusal in the summer on their right back Jayden Bogle for a reasonable fee in return.
nayimfromthehalfwayline
Andy Thompson
https://www.itsroundanditswhite.co.uk/articles/dennis-cirkin-tottenham-defensive-problems
Can Dennis Cirkin help with Tottenham's defensive problems?
By Emmanuel Odey
Tuesday 31st December 2019
Jose Mourinho has done a decent job since taking over at Tottenham. The Portuguese manager returned the side to winning ways after Mauricio Pochettino failed to maintain the high standard he initially set at White Hart Lane. The Argentine's good work ensured that Spurs became a regular top-four team in the Premier League, even challenging for the title on occasion. But the team fell apart defensively this term. Three wins in 12 league games was the result - with just one clean sheet.
Used to the new-found success and expecting even more after reaching last season's Champions League final, Daniel Levy had a decision to make. Keep faith with a manager who has taken the club from being an annually average side to a regular top-four candidate? Or make a change to halt the downward spiral and save the club's season? In the end, Levy chose the latter and pulled the plug on Poch.
He took a gamble on Mourinho as the man to put Spurs back on the right track. It was a surprising decision to many who feel the 56-year-old is no longer all-that special. The serial winner had become a shadow of his former self after failing to replicate his success of years gone by in his most recent projects. Now commonly referred to as "the humble one", the former Chelsea gaffer has justified Levy's decision by restoring the club's hope of a top-four finish at the end of the campaign.
The team was 12 points adrift of the Champions League places place when he took over. But only a surprise draw at Norwich prevented the Lilywhites from overtaking Frank Lampard's Chelsea to fourth place (albeit temporarily). Going behind twice in the game only to fight back and earn a draw brought back memories of an all too familiar problem this season. In his eight league games in charge (and ten overall), Spurs has only kept one clean sheet. The lack of a proper left-back is rearing its ugly head.
Although Spurs boasts of some of the best centre-backs in the division, they've missed the contribution from their full-backs. Serge Aurier is a decent player, but Kieran Trippier offered so much more than the former Paris Saint-Germain does. It's difficult to understand why Pochettino sanctioned his sale to Atletico Madrid.
On the left side, Ben Davies has been battling with injury for most of the campaign while Danny Rose is struggling with fitness issues. Their absence has led to Jan Vertonghen having to operate on the left side of the back three. Without having the legs to bump up and down the left side of the pitch, it has led to instability.
Vertonghen's ineffectiveness in the position explains why he has been substituted in two of the club's last three games. In fact, he was pulled out at half time against Norwich. At a time when Mourinho should be thinking of reinforcing his midfield or forward line to overwhelm the opponent, he is usually bothered about his defence.
But there could be a solution in youngster Dennis Cirkin.
The club's academy prospect who has distinguished himself as a top talent while playing for the U18s and U19s can do a decent job if given the chance. The teenage left-back could provide necessary cover in the position and maybe grow to become Spurs' own Trent Alexander-Arnold. That will allow Vertonghen and Alderweireld to give their best at the heart of the defence. Davinson Sanchez will be on hand to give either of them rest when necessary.
In an age where youngsters are given the chance to make their mark and grow into the senior team, the 17-year-old should not be held back. His introduction will benefit all parties involved. His development will be fast-tracked, the team's results will likely improve and Mourinho can have one more thing to brag about: he gave Cirkin his big break.
Lampard demonstrated the forward-thinking that future managers must adopt when he brought in 19-year-old right-back Tariq Lamptey against Arsenal on Sunday. But he is not the only one. Ole Gunnar Solskjaer has played 19-year-old Brandon Williams in Manchester United's defence with regularity. And for anyone who thinks Cirkin is too young to fit into the senior team, Barcelona's Anssumane Fati is also 17. So is Inter's Sebastiano Esposito.
After almost a year out of work, Mourinho must adapt to the new way of thinking and include Cirkin in his team. That will be necessary not only to compete against the big guns but to put Tottenham ahead in the long run...
Can Dennis Cirkin help with Tottenham's defensive problems?
By Emmanuel Odey
Tuesday 31st December 2019
Jose Mourinho has done a decent job since taking over at Tottenham. The Portuguese manager returned the side to winning ways after Mauricio Pochettino failed to maintain the high standard he initially set at White Hart Lane. The Argentine's good work ensured that Spurs became a regular top-four team in the Premier League, even challenging for the title on occasion. But the team fell apart defensively this term. Three wins in 12 league games was the result - with just one clean sheet.
Used to the new-found success and expecting even more after reaching last season's Champions League final, Daniel Levy had a decision to make. Keep faith with a manager who has taken the club from being an annually average side to a regular top-four candidate? Or make a change to halt the downward spiral and save the club's season? In the end, Levy chose the latter and pulled the plug on Poch.
He took a gamble on Mourinho as the man to put Spurs back on the right track. It was a surprising decision to many who feel the 56-year-old is no longer all-that special. The serial winner had become a shadow of his former self after failing to replicate his success of years gone by in his most recent projects. Now commonly referred to as "the humble one", the former Chelsea gaffer has justified Levy's decision by restoring the club's hope of a top-four finish at the end of the campaign.
The team was 12 points adrift of the Champions League places place when he took over. But only a surprise draw at Norwich prevented the Lilywhites from overtaking Frank Lampard's Chelsea to fourth place (albeit temporarily). Going behind twice in the game only to fight back and earn a draw brought back memories of an all too familiar problem this season. In his eight league games in charge (and ten overall), Spurs has only kept one clean sheet. The lack of a proper left-back is rearing its ugly head.
Although Spurs boasts of some of the best centre-backs in the division, they've missed the contribution from their full-backs. Serge Aurier is a decent player, but Kieran Trippier offered so much more than the former Paris Saint-Germain does. It's difficult to understand why Pochettino sanctioned his sale to Atletico Madrid.
On the left side, Ben Davies has been battling with injury for most of the campaign while Danny Rose is struggling with fitness issues. Their absence has led to Jan Vertonghen having to operate on the left side of the back three. Without having the legs to bump up and down the left side of the pitch, it has led to instability.
Vertonghen's ineffectiveness in the position explains why he has been substituted in two of the club's last three games. In fact, he was pulled out at half time against Norwich. At a time when Mourinho should be thinking of reinforcing his midfield or forward line to overwhelm the opponent, he is usually bothered about his defence.
But there could be a solution in youngster Dennis Cirkin.
The club's academy prospect who has distinguished himself as a top talent while playing for the U18s and U19s can do a decent job if given the chance. The teenage left-back could provide necessary cover in the position and maybe grow to become Spurs' own Trent Alexander-Arnold. That will allow Vertonghen and Alderweireld to give their best at the heart of the defence. Davinson Sanchez will be on hand to give either of them rest when necessary.
In an age where youngsters are given the chance to make their mark and grow into the senior team, the 17-year-old should not be held back. His introduction will benefit all parties involved. His development will be fast-tracked, the team's results will likely improve and Mourinho can have one more thing to brag about: he gave Cirkin his big break.
Lampard demonstrated the forward-thinking that future managers must adopt when he brought in 19-year-old right-back Tariq Lamptey against Arsenal on Sunday. But he is not the only one. Ole Gunnar Solskjaer has played 19-year-old Brandon Williams in Manchester United's defence with regularity. And for anyone who thinks Cirkin is too young to fit into the senior team, Barcelona's Anssumane Fati is also 17. So is Inter's Sebastiano Esposito.
After almost a year out of work, Mourinho must adapt to the new way of thinking and include Cirkin in his team. That will be necessary not only to compete against the big guns but to put Tottenham ahead in the long run...
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