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Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

I get where you are coming from & well done for voting. I live in a country where voting is compulsory don't vote get fined. Maybe the UK should introduce it there. To be fair to my sister she always votes Labor & would have again if that was an option. She just couldn't vote for a bin & hates racists

It was a brick choice, binface is very much a candidate who isn’t standing to win. I didn’t vote binface because I genuinely thought “this guy will be great for us!” Maybe he would have been 😂 who knows.

I’m the same as your sister, I also hate racists, so let’s not empower them. The best way to do this is just vote for anyone else. There was a lot of independents, some of them just had about doing things like fixing potholes - great, very much needed, so vote for that person because it shows you don’t support racists and actually maybe you get a pothole fixed, bonus!

Sometimes we have to boil it down to basics and for me I’d rather people point and laugh at me for voting for a bloke dressed as a bin, than I would people look at me and know I didn’t try and stop or speak up against the racists. I’m sure when the next by election rolls round in a few months that other parties will stand again, and hopefully by that point your sister has better options or at the very least someone has fired Farage into the sun.
 
It was a brick choice, binface is very much a candidate who isn’t standing to win. I didn’t vote binface because I genuinely thought “this guy will be great for us!” Maybe he would have been 😂 who knows.

I’m the same as your sister, I also hate racists, so let’s not empower them. The best way to do this is just vote for anyone else. There was a lot of independents, some of them just had about doing things like fixing potholes - great, very much needed, so vote for that person because it shows you don’t support racists and actually maybe you get a pothole fixed, bonus!

Sometimes we have to boil it down to basics and for me I’d rather people point and laugh at me for voting for a bloke dressed as a bin, than I would people look at me and know I didn’t try and stop or speak up against the racists. I’m sure when the next by election rolls round in a few months that other parties will stand again, and hopefully by that point your sister has better options or at the very least someone has fired Farage into the sun.

I'd rather people point and laugh at me for voting for a bin than have them think I'm OK with a racist representing me.
It really shouldn't be any deeper than that.
 
My sister & all of her family live in St Oysth none voted because it was a choice between a bin & a racist. If labour the conservatives or even a good local independent had stood they would have voted. if the two major parties couldn't be bothered why would the constituents

So they had a clear alternative to a racist but that wasn’t enough to get them out to vote?
 
My sister has various obstacles to vote the biggest one being she is blind but she votes at every election except this one. her choice was a bin or a racist.so I respect her decision. if you were in her shoes you might have made the same decision.

Indeed I may have, fair point.

In my situation though I would have absolutely gone out to vote against the racist parties like bnp, the UKIPs and reform and I have done at every opportunity.
 
It probably boils down to how engaged in politics you are.

People can understandably find it a turnoff, but there's no shame in ignorance, it can be a positive these days.

On the flipside...People do concern themselves with far too much and that will always come with endless opinions (like this one;)), and resultant political polarisation.

The caveat is, Farage could be the thin end of the wedge...and you've missed your opportunity to have a say.
 
Call the likes of Reform racist as much as you want, but, like Trump’s two victories, I see the rise of Reform and populist movements like Trump’s as a failure on the part of Labour, the Conservatives and the Democrats to come up with a credible plan for dealing with immigration.

I also think it’s unfair to label every single person who votes for Reform or Trump as a racist. I have family members who have switched between Labour and the Conservatives throughout their lives, and they’ve simply had enough. They’ve told me that, if Labour don’t get their S H I T together, they’ll be voting Reform at the next general election.

You can disagree with their choice, but dismissing all of those voters as racists completely misses why some people are turning to populist parties in the first place.
 
Call the likes of Reform racist as much as you want, but, like Trump’s two victories, I see the rise of Reform and populist movements like Trump’s as a failure on the part of Labour, the Conservatives and the Democrats to come up with a credible plan for dealing with immigration.

I also think it’s unfair to label every single person who votes for Reform or Trump as a racist. I have family members who have switched between Labour and the Conservatives throughout their lives, and they’ve simply had enough. They’ve told me that, if Labour don’t get their S H I T together, they’ll be voting Reform at the next general election.

You can disagree with their choice, but dismissing all of those voters as racists completely misses why some people are turning to populist parties in the first place.

Who has done that?
 
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Call the likes of Reform racist as much as you want, but, like Trump’s two victories, I see the rise of Reform and populist movements like Trump’s as a failure on the part of Labour, the Conservatives and the Democrats to come up with a credible plan for dealing with immigration.

I also think it’s unfair to label every single person who votes for Reform or Trump as a racist. I have family members who have switched between Labour and the Conservatives throughout their lives, and they’ve simply had enough. They’ve told me that, if Labour don’t get their S H I T together, they’ll be voting Reform at the next general election.

You can disagree with their choice, but dismissing all of those voters as racists completely misses why some people are turning to populist parties in the first place.

A lot of people refer to them as racist as that’s what is at the core of a lot of it.

I think you’re right, I generalise and just refer to it as the racist vote and you’re quite correct it’s probably not fair on all of them. Problem for me is, they drive division and hate, they turn society against each other to hide what they’re doing. I’m sorry, but the party leader is taking 5million quid in bungs and ok, not everyone lives in Clacton, but he’s the party leader - if you vote reform, you’re still backing him. You’re still backing corruption and all sorts of flimflam he comes out with.

You’re correct, not all people that vote reform are racist, but all the racists vote reform.

Due to where I live I’ve seen so many interviews in the past few weeks in the build up to this by election, the amount of people who tell a story “oh, I can’t work anymore because of illness or injury, I’m a carer for my mum who also can’t work, and I can’t see a nurse or get a doctors appointment”… so who are you voting for? “Oh Nigel and Reform!” Yes, good, vote for the party who want to solve immigration by sending people back, privatise the NHS and cut benefits - that absolutely sounds like a way of giving your story a happy ending.

People who vote for Reform don’t always seem to know what they’re actually voting for, and in many cases I don’t think they care. I think a lot of them deep down know EXACTLY what they are and society in the last few years with the rise of reform hasn’t just let the mask slip, it’s taken it off and thrown it away.

People say immigration needs sorting, we absolutely need immigration protocols and policies, we absolutely can’t let everyone in forever without question, simply because no party can. I’m sorry though, this weak excuse of it being a protest vote is to me, gonads. They have shown absolutely zero capability to govern, they won lots of seats and then had to watch as a myriad of wrong uns slowly quit because it turns out they were a bunch of wife beating racists. People talk about how it needs sorting because in the most part they have been told by a bunch of millionaires that immigrants are to blame for them being poor, struggling to see doctors, and afford housing or get jobs. Meanwhile water companies for instance pay themselves millions of pounds as bonuses.

There are so many issues that are against everyday working people, and they’ve been convinced the blame lay with immigrants only. I think the protest vote is mostly one where Reform thank you for your vote then sit at home counting their money laughing at you for buying it. People actively voting for a one policy party who will absolutely make their lives worse, but that’s ok, at least they’ll turn immigrants away. Personally if it happens, I just wonder who they blame next once the immigrants can’t be a target anymore, and lives haven’t improved.
 
. I have family members who have switched between Labour and the Conservatives throughout their lives, and they’ve simply had enough. They’ve told me that, if Labour don’t get their brick together, they’ll be voting Reform at the next general election.
Completely nonsensical

You can disagree with their choice, but dismissing all of those voters as racists completely misses why some people are turning to populist parties in the first place.
Populist parties are generally telling you what you want to hear. Whether they can walk the walk or even run a government on some form of level footing is debatable at best. They are in it for themselves. Gaining your vote is just a vehicle to that end.

Which is all very different in many ways to traditional meaning of populism.
 
In fairness you cant blame Labour and Conservatives for highlighting issues that appear within their party. Thats always been a cop out.

No one believes all reform voters are racist, but I think its a fair assumption to make that if you are racist you are likely to plump for reform or restore.

I understand that the lack of action and success is pushing people towards them, no one would deny that either, but I find it incredible that people who support Reform never seem to call this stuff out either


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Who has done that?

That’s the insinuation, even if it’s not said outright. How can people vote for those monsters?! The conversation should also be “why do people feel they can no longer vote Labour or Tory?”. If I was selling popcorn and the guy down the road was selling dogbrick and more people were buying dogbrick, I’d want to know people weren’t buying my superior product rather than blaming people that vote for them.
 
A lot of people refer to them as racist as that’s what is at the core of a lot of it.

I think you’re right, I generalise and just refer to it as the racist vote and you’re quite correct it’s probably not fair on all of them. Problem for me is, they drive division and hate, they turn society against each other to hide what they’re doing. I’m sorry, but the party leader is taking 5million quid in bungs and ok, not everyone lives in Clacton, but he’s the party leader - if you vote reform, you’re still backing him. You’re still backing corruption and all sorts of flimflam he comes out with.

You’re correct, not all people that vote reform are racist, but all the racists vote reform.

Due to where I live I’ve seen so many interviews in the past few weeks in the build up to this by election, the amount of people who tell a story “oh, I can’t work anymore because of illness or injury, I’m a carer for my mum who also can’t work, and I can’t see a nurse or get a doctors appointment”… so who are you voting for? “Oh Nigel and Reform!” Yes, good, vote for the party who want to solve immigration by sending people back, privatise the NHS and cut benefits - that absolutely sounds like a way of giving your story a happy ending.

People who vote for Reform don’t always seem to know what they’re actually voting for, and in many cases I don’t think they care. I think a lot of them deep down know EXACTLY what they are and society in the last few years with the rise of reform hasn’t just let the mask slip, it’s taken it off and thrown it away.

People say immigration needs sorting, we absolutely need immigration protocols and policies, we absolutely can’t let everyone in forever without question, simply because no party can. I’m sorry though, this weak excuse of it being a protest vote is to me, gonads. They have shown absolutely zero capability to govern, they won lots of seats and then had to watch as a myriad of wrong uns slowly quit because it turns out they were a bunch of wife beating racists. People talk about how it needs sorting because in the most part they have been told by a bunch of millionaires that immigrants are to blame for them being poor, struggling to see doctors, and afford housing or get jobs. Meanwhile water companies for instance pay themselves millions of pounds as bonuses.

There are so many issues that are against everyday working people, and they’ve been convinced the blame lay with immigrants only. I think the protest vote is mostly one where Reform thank you for your vote then sit at home counting their money laughing at you for buying it. People actively voting for a one policy party who will absolutely make their lives worse, but that’s ok, at least they’ll turn immigrants away. Personally if it happens, I just wonder who they blame next once the immigrants can’t be a target anymore, and lives haven’t improved.

There is also a lack of consistency in thought process and standards. If you are going to hold Labour and the Conservatives to high standards (which you should) you should surely be using the same level of scrutiny with Reform, I just don't see that ever and there are always excuses made when they have a car crash of an interview or they come out with something nonsensical.

Like you say, people can rarely verbalise why they are voting for them, thats massively telling
 
Completely nonsensical


Populist parties are generally telling you what you want to hear. Whether they can walk the walk or even run a government on some form of level footing is debatable at best. They are in it for themselves. Gaining your vote is just a vehicle to that end.

Which is all very different in many ways to traditional meaning of populism.

Fine. Call it that if you want, that’s your right. It was the same when Trump won the election, how can people not vote for Kamala? Now she may have turned up to be a good president but she was a bloody terrible candidate.
 
That’s the insinuation, even if it’s not said outright. How can people vote for those monsters?! The conversation should also be “why do people feel they can no longer vote Labour or Tory?”. If I was selling popcorn and the guy down the road was selling dogbrick and more people were buying dogbrick, I’d want to know people weren’t buying my superior product rather than blaming people that vote for them.

I have asked several times on here why and what policies and what people would do to stop the boats etc and beyond an inflatable barrier no one can tell me, let alone tell me what policies that Reform offer that they love, there are rarely if any clear points.

Surely a party has to earn your vote also? I was sick and tired of Labour for years and didn't vote in two elections, I didn't just jump to a party I didn't trust
 
There is also a lack of consistency in thought process and standards. If you are going to hold Labour and the Conservatives to high standards (which you should) you should surely be using the same level of scrutiny with Reform, I just don't see that ever and there are always excuses made when they have a car crash of an interview or they come out with something nonsensical.

Like you say, people can rarely verbalise why they are voting for them, thats massively telling

Yep, and one thing I noticed recently is if you ask people what Farage has done for them here they can’t tell you - it’s all whataboutism, there’s never a positive for Farage himself.

Why do you vote for Farage? “Well who else is there”

Do you know he took a 5mill bung? “Oh they’re all at it though”

Whats he done locally? “Well, no less than anyone else”

Say SOMETHING positive about the man you keep wilfully electing. Also, your protest vote, why is it never for the greens? Lib Dem? An independent? Why not vote for someone like binface if you want to make a statement? Your protest NEEDS to be reform does it? This is why people it.
 
There is also a lack of consistency in thought process and standards. If you are going to hold Labour and the Conservatives to high standards (which you should) you should surely be using the same level of scrutiny with Reform, I just don't see that ever and there are always excuses made when they have a car crash of an interview or they come out with something nonsensical.

Like you say, people can rarely verbalise why they are voting for them, thats massively telling

As much noise as Reform, as well as the Greens are making they still had 0.8% & 0.6% of MP’s in the last election. Until they actually get a significant result in the general they are fringe parties.
 
Yep, and one thing I noticed recently is if you ask people what Farage has done for them here they can’t tell you - it’s all whataboutism, there’s never a positive for Farage himself.

Why do you vote for Farage? “Well who else is there”

Do you know he took a 5mill bung? “Oh they’re all at it though”

Whats he done locally? “Well, no less than anyone else”

Say SOMETHING positive about the man you keep wilfully electing. Also, your protest vote, why is it never for the greens? Lib Dem? An independent? Why not vote for someone like binface if you want to make a statement? Your protest NEEDS to be reform does it? This is why people it.

Rupert Lowe is such a tinkle stained racist that he doesn't even know who he hates anymore, his version of what made someone British was embarrassing.

I never see those who get tired of being called racist actually calling the racism out
 
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