***OMT - Tottenham Hotspur Football Club vs AFC Bournemouth***

[Mikey10]

I heard a rumour that de Zerbi endorses fascists and wife beaters and is an arrogant prick who will force his own sacking by throwing his toys out of the pram when it doesn't go his way, like Conte did. Allegedly.

I feel one of Thomas Frank's main attributes (in the eyes of the board) is that he is a cool customer that will accept problems and not go crying to the press or throwing his toys out to ensure he is sacked, i.e. he will sit and grind his way through game after game after game after game and the board likes that far more than a big tantrum thrower.

Listened to the Tottenham Way podcast today with the Spurs journalists Tom Allnut (from The Times) and Tom Barclay (from The Sun). The take there was that TF is fully backed by Ventketesham and he will be here for the long haul.

 

[kb 1984]

...indeed, and this is why I think we need to deal with Lange as a matter of urgency.

what exactly has he done wrong that we have to deal with him as a matter of urgency. The transfer window has just opened & he might be negotiating with clubs but what sack him. you might prefer wheeler dealer i don't

 

[thfcsteff]

what exactly has he done wrong that we have to deal with him as a matter of urgency. The transfer window has just opened & he might be negotiating with clubs but what sack him. you might prefer wheeler dealer i don't

No, I don't care for Paratici either TBH. Maybe you're right on Lange, I've just never really liked him or his apparent direction TBH.

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

I would always be guarded about employing a manager from a club where it is all about the structure and continuity. Clubs like Brighton, Brentford, Bournemouth - clubs who have properly invested in their data and scouting and know exactly who they will replace each player, coach and manager with when they get poached. I would want to see managers from those clubs go and do well elsewhere before employing them at a club like Spurs.

THFC are the opposite of the Brighton/Bournemouth/Brentford type clubs . We lurch from one manager to the next, getting them a few players they want to play for manager A's system, then having not really backed him we sack him and appoint manager B, with a completely different philosophy making a whole bunch of players signed for manager A redundant. We then repeat that cycle over and over with no continuity in mind at all.

One of the reasons that Marco Silva was my favourite to succeed Ange, out of the not particularly inspiring list of managers that would be prepared to join our brick show of a club, is because he isn't one of those managers. He has good management experience and a lot of his experience is in managing clubs who aren't nearly as well run and forward thinking as the likes of Bournemouth, Brighton and Brentford when it comes to data and scouting and recruitment. He isn't wedded to a single system, seeming to be able to construct a team out of what he has, being happy to play young players, and also seemingly having good input into players who can come in and improve them who are nowhere near the top end of the market. He ticks a bunch of the boxes that it seems our club valued in their manager search last summer - PL experience, able to keep one of the less fashionable clubs in the PL, not particularly vociferous and demanding of the board wanting new players all of the time, will work with what he's got/given. He might actually have half a chance of doing OK at Spurs if given our rag tag of a squad and given a bigger budget than he is used to for improvements.

Somebody like that would be a good stop gap to keep us in the PL and perhaps even around the lower european spots while a proper restructuring DoF like Rangnick came in to change the whole football structure at the club.

Another manager that might work here is somebody like Roberto De Zerbi. Did well at Shakhtar and Brighton and is now doing well at Marseille, getting them 2nd place last year and has them in 3rd this year - while being a manager that plays an attacking style of football. I suspect he would be a bit too demanding of our board and owners though.

This is the best articulation I’ve ever seen about why Spurs should hire Marco Silva. To the point I’d be excited to see what he could do. I think there’s some hilarity in the idea of Spurs thinking they have the sophisticated scouting set up like a Brighton but are actually a basket case like Chelsea without the recent haul of trophies!

 

[Raziel]

Listened to the Tottenham Way podcast today with the Spurs journalists Tom Allnut (from The Times) and Tom Barclay (from The Sun). The take there was that TF is fully backed by Ventketesham and he will be here for the long haul.

And that's scary because the other noise out of the club is (with Dragusin and others), we are actively cutting the squad in anticipation of a season with no Europe next season, these asshats have given up on this season already to back this guy?

 

[Raziel]

This is the best articulation I’ve ever seen about why Spurs should hire Marco Silva. To the point I’d be excited to see what he could do. I think there’s some hilarity in the idea of Spurs thinking they have the sophisticated scouting set up like a Brighton but are actually a basket case like Chelsea without the recent haul of trophies!

We don't need the systems of Brentford or Brighton, we don't want to become those clubs, but we should also realize managers/players from clubs like that represent a risk, so yes, someone more proven in chaos is probably better.

Spurs can't compete at the top of the food chain but we also don't need to hover up every kid before they are found, we can spend 30M-40M on somewhat proven potential (Brighton/Brentford have to buy in the sub 10-15M for most of their buys).

I don't buy that these smaller clubs have some magic sauce that City/Liverpool/Madrid/Spurs as missing, it's just having a strategy for what point you pick them up, is it a profile aligned to a type of system and what's the plan to develop them?

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

We don't need the systems of Brentford or Brighton, we don't want to become those clubs, but we should also realize managers/players from clubs like that represent a risk, so yes, someone more proven in chaos is probably better.

Spurs can't compete at the top of the food chain but we also don't need to hover up every kid before they are found, we can spend 30M-40M on somewhat proven potential (Brighton/Brentford have to buy in the sub 10-15M for most of their buys).

I don't buy that these smaller clubs have some magic sauce that City/Liverpool/Madrid/Spurs as missing, it's just having a strategy for what point you pick them up, is it a profile aligned to a type of system and what's the plan to develop them?

Completely agree.

I actually think we need a strategy unique to us. It’s not something that works for Brentford or Brighton. It’s also not something that would work for United or Liverpool. I don’t know exactly what it should be, but it should be uniquely us. I think we were close to it with Poch. It was culture. We needed some additional quality to take the final leap. But it was to fit that quality into a culture that set us apart.

We need to build something else now. I think it needs to be somewhat tactically advanced, but it also needs to be predicated on what the younger, malleable players that we are able to attract would excel within.

 

[Muttley]

And that's scary because the other noise out of the club is (with Dragusin and others), we are actively cutting the squad in anticipation of a season with no Europe next season, these asshats have given up on this season already to back this guy?

I don't see it that way at all. I think we're just creating space for better players perhaps knowing that we didn't buy that well in the first place. You can easily see Spurs reducing to the 3 main centre halves plus Palhinha and Davies as the 4th and 5th this season. Then we go back to 5 next season with Vuskovic and Takai resuming duties. Perhaps Dorrington is retained this season as well now he's back from Aberdeen.

I don't see the numerical reduction thing yet. I do see a squad that was stacked that needed players out to get new ones in. I also perhaps now see that the time has come where a couple of our younger players will need to be given a first team squad number. Vuskovic probably heads that list.

 

[Bishop]

We don't need the systems of Brentford or Brighton, we don't want to become those clubs, but we should also realize managers/players from clubs like that represent a risk, so yes, someone more proven in chaos is probably better.

Spurs can't compete at the top of the food chain but we also don't need to hover up every kid before they are found, we can spend 30M-40M on somewhat proven potential (Brighton/Brentford have to buy in the sub 10-15M for most of their buys).

I don't buy that these smaller clubs have some magic sauce that City/Liverpool/Madrid/Spurs as missing, it's just having a strategy for what point you pick them up, is it a profile aligned to a type of system and what's the plan to develop them?

One of these clubs is not like the others.

Why you are including Spurs in that bracket I have no idea. We are at best in the same bracket as Dortmund, Athletico, Leipzig, Monaco and Marseille and even that I say is a bit of a stretch. We aren't exactly a par with Athletico let's be real.

So yes we do need a better more cognet model than the one we have followed for the last 20 years and it does involve implementing systems similar to the clubs I mentioned above. All who also pretty much run on the same Brentford, Bournemouth and Brighton model, just heightened.

 

[harr1984]

Listened to the Tottenham Way podcast today with the Spurs journalists Tom Allnut (from The Times) and Tom Barclay (from The Sun). The take there was that TF is fully backed by Ventketesham and he will be here for the long haul.

By our standards, the long haul probably means until the end of the season ....

 

[Raziel]

One of these clubs is not like the others.

Why you are including Spurs in that bracket I have no idea. We are at best in the same bracket as Dortmund, Athletico, Leipzig, Monaco and Marseille and even that I say is a bit of a stretch. We aren't exactly a par with Athletico let's be real.

So yes we do need a better more cognet model than the one we have followed for the last 20 years and it does involve implementing systems similar to the clubs I mentioned above. All who also pretty much run on the same Brentford, Bournemouth and Brighton model, just heightened.

Disagree mate, Brentford & Bournemouth & Brighton don't give a fudge if they finish 7th or 12th, it all works in their model, therefore they can win 3 in 12, they could afford to play RKM for 20 games without him scoring, they can afford to give youth 2 seasons to develop. That's the part that doesn't translate to us.

The other clubs you mention have a huge advantage, they typically operate in a league where there is a top 2, and then the rest is pretty much dross, so again, you can have a mediocre season and still finish in CL contention or at worse Europa, a mediocre season.

Do I agree we need some coherency in strategy and exactly what is our place in football? absolutely. However I don't think you get there by copying people who haven't achieved what you want to be. And if you look at the clubs that we want to be (those you say we are not one of), none of them are following those clubs and Id on't it's because they don't have their brick together. And even Athletico is a fudging basket case with transfers, their only thread of consistency in the manager.

 

[Mikey10]

By our standards, the long haul probably means until the end of the season ....

Yeah - no idea whether they’re right, but it was an interesting discussion.

Their view (and I’m paraphrasing) is that VV has been given ultimate control on the footballing side; he has a very strong relationship with TF; he believes from his experience at Arsenal that clubs may need to go through a rough period with a manager if long term change is to be implemented; and he realises that TF has been operating without his best players, and with a squad that needs change.

 

[Bishop]

Disagree mate, Brentford & Bournemouth & Brighton don't give a fudge if they finish 7th or 12th, it all works in their model, therefore they can win 3 in 12, they could afford to play RKM for 20 games without him scoring, they can afford to give youth 2 seasons to develop. That's the part that doesn't translate to us.

The other clubs you mention have a huge advantage, they typically operate in a league where there is a top 2, and then the rest is pretty much dross, so again, you can have a mediocre season and still finish in CL contention or at worse Europa, a mediocre season.

Do I agree we need some coherency in strategy and exactly what is our place in football? absolutely. However I don't think you get there by copying people who haven't achieved what you want to be. And if you look at the clubs that we want to be (those you say we are not one of), none of them are following those clubs and Id on't it's because they don't have their brick together. And even Athletico is a fudging basket case with transfers, their only thread of consistency in the manager.

Whilst I don't believe we are the same level as the three Bs, there are elements to their models that can be used and as I said the clubs whom I do think we are on a par with do essentially use similar models.

What I like about Athletico is that they don't give a fudge. If a transfer doesn't work they sell and go again. They aren't locked into some idea that they need to somehow make it work. They just player trade until they get the player they actually need, but that's because what is important to them is winning until we have the same attitude it really doesn't matter what model we follow, we always half arse it.

 

[glasgowspur]

Surprised it's not been mentioned, Semenyo goal while having little influence on our or Brightons season could have changed the title race if he had went to city.
Still don't understand why city allowed it drag out.

 

[Yiddo]

In all honesty we haven’t even been that bad the last 2/3 games and if we had taken some of the chances we had in those games we could have got a win rather than a draw or a loss and we would be sitting in the top 6.

 

[Finney Is Back]

One of these clubs is not like the others.

Why you are including Spurs in that bracket I have no idea. We are at best in the same bracket as Dortmund, Athletico, Leipzig, Monaco and Marseille and even that I say is a bit of a stretch. We aren't exactly a par with Athletico let's be real.

So yes we do need a better more cognet model than the one we have followed for the last 20 years and it does involve implementing systems similar to the clubs I mentioned above. All who also pretty much run on the same Brentford, Bournemouth and Brighton model, just heightened.

We are like those clubs minus the scouting.

 

[Finney Is Back]

Surprised it's not been mentioned, Semenyo goal while having little influence on our or Brightons season could have changed the title race if he had went to city.
Still don't understand why city allowed it drag out.

Because they couldn't do anything about it. Bournemouth owned the player and decided the exact point that they sold him.

 

[Baleforce]

In all honesty we haven’t even been that bad the last 2/3 games and if we had taken some of the chances we had in those games we could have got a win rather than a draw or a loss and we would be sitting in the top 6.

We were the better side in every game and the stats were in our favour.

Cut the mistakes and we will be a really effective side.

 

[harr1984]

We were the better side in every game and the stats were in our favour.

Cut the mistakes and we will be a really effective side.

We have definitely been better past couple of games albeit a low bar. My hope is that we recruit a couple of nice additions and we can kick on a little second half of the season - even if just baby steps....

 

[Yiddo]

We have definitely been better past couple of games albeit a low bar. My hope is that we recruit a couple of nice additions and we can kick on a little second half of the season - even if just baby steps....

I’d be happy with a win against Arsenal to hopefully put a dent in their title hopes and i hope we avoid relegation.