Antonio Conte - officially NOT the coach of THFC

[NaijaSpurs]

A lot of you have super thick rose-tinted glasses when looking back at the end of the Poch regime

It was awful, 10 months of poor decisions and poor play.

You can read hundreds of pages about it here in the archive:
https://www.glory-glory.co.uk/community/threads/mauricio-pochettino-sacked.6336/page-1168

That Brighton game, Saudi Sportswashing Machine, Watford, page after page of moans about the awful diamond formation, his blind faith in certain players, lack of rotation e.g.

a game where the manager fudged the players completely, following game after game of random and poor tactical decisions, the players finally lost faith in the leadership of the team.

The only reason Poch appeals to me is that in my opinion we played our most entertaining football of the last 30 years under him including my favourite ever season (the last one at the Lane).

After the CL final Poch did warn of the need for a "painful rebuild" but Levy surprise, surprise failed to support that idea and we paid the consequences.

Moving on, in all honesty I will not get bent out of shape if we do not resign Poch. If that ship has sailed and the board feel we should not go back I have no problem with that.

I just want a manager who plays free flowing attacking, I want to be entertained.

 

[harr1984]

A lot of you have super thick rose-tinted glasses when looking back at the end of the Poch regime

It was awful, 10 months of poor decisions and poor play.

You can read hundreds of pages about it here in the archive:
https://www.glory-glory.co.uk/community/threads/mauricio-pochettino-sacked.6336/page-1168

That Brighton game, Saudi Sportswashing Machine, Watford, page after page of moans about the awful diamond formation, his blind faith in certain players, lack of rotation e.g.

a game where the manager fudged the players completely, following game after game of random and poor tactical decisions, the players finally lost faith in the leadership of the team.

It is funny that people like to claim the likes of Conte and before him Mourinho are out of date managers, football has moved on etc. Conte has been a manager for 17 years, Poch 15 years so they are very much in that same ‘cycle’.

If you don’t want Conte anymore then fine, but let’s find one of the new crop rather than bring back Poch. Yes will be great singing ‘He’s magic you know’ and he will represent the club splendidly, but the novelty will soon wear off. It was only a year ago that people were enthusiastically singing Contes name and now we are here. It will be no different with Poch, he has done nothing since leaving to show he is the answer and the club hasn’t changed in a significant way to suggest it would work any better with him either…..

 

[Diamond Lights]

been offline past few days what's the general gist after Forest? Beating a very poor Forest team doesn't change things for me, for the most part anyway.

• Sign the contract now, and we all get behind him
  
• if he's not signing the contract, why are we delaying getting someone new in?

I am greatly concerned though with our incomings (Porro, Destiny) not fitting the next manager's style...

 

[thfcsteff]

A lot of you have super thick rose-tinted glasses when looking back at the end of the Poch regime

It was awful, 10 months of poor decisions and poor play.

You can read hundreds of pages about it here in the archive:
https://www.glory-glory.co.uk/community/threads/mauricio-pochettino-sacked.6336/page-1168

That Brighton game, Saudi Sportswashing Machine, Watford, page after page of moans about the awful diamond formation, his blind faith in certain players, lack of rotation e.g.

a game where the manager fudged the players completely, following game after game of random and poor tactical decisions, the players finally lost faith in the leadership of the team.

Big injury issues, all eyes on getting the stadium finished, an extra 8 months at Wembley (nearly the whole season!). If ever there were circumstances for some poor performances...

 

[alekaras]

He's not staying.
Which is not a bad thing.
I also don't think Poch will return as too much of the previous garden furniture which gave him splinters in the first place remains (not Levy), and that Italian recliner is not prepared to support his weight!
De Zerbi would be fun, Gallardo a fun gamble, I am really warming to the idea of Thomas Frank, and IF we want to take the 'old winner ex/Chelsea' short-cut gamble for another two years, would be happy with Ancelotti.

When it comes to Frank, one also has to look at how Brentford are set up as a club. They have a highly data-driven, statistical analysis approach to football, and a philosophy that comes more from the club than the coach. They always look for a coach that will fit their model. So you take Frank out of the Brentford environment and put him somewhere else, you may have a very meh manager.

 

[Grays_1890]

When it comes to Frank, one also has to look at how Brentford are set up as a club. They have a highly data-driven, statistical analysis approach to football, and a philosophy that comes more from the club than the coach. They always look for a coach that will fit their model. So you take Frank out of the Brentford environment and you may have a very meh manager.

I agree to an extent but their model only really means that they get better players than the other clubs within their competition range which makes them a PL club when they probably should have the resources to a Championship side. Im sure if he was given better players he would or should be able to perform. That said he would not be my first choice, I like him and I think he is a top bloke but would like to see if he could do it somewhere else before we plunged in

 

[alekaras]

It is funny that people like to claim the likes of Conte and before him Mourinho are out of date managers, football has moved on etc. Conte has been a manager for 17 years, Poch 15 years so they are very much in that same ‘cycle’.

If you don’t want Conte anymore then fine, but let’s find one of the new crop rather than bring back Poch. Yes will be great singing ‘He’s magic you know’ and he will represent the club splendidly, but the novelty will soon wear off. It was only a year ago that people were enthusiastically singing Contes name and now we are here. It will be no different with Poch, he has done nothing since leaving to show he is the answer and the club hasn’t changed in a significant way to suggest it would work any better with him either…..

I don't think it matters how long someone had been managing. It's more about how they evolve over that time. Which is one of the reasons why I'm so keen on Gallardo, who is a manager that continuously adapts, not just from year to year, but from game to game.

 

[Grays_1890]

It is funny that people like to claim the likes of Conte and before him Mourinho are out of date managers, football has moved on etc. Conte has been a manager for 17 years, Poch 15 years so they are very much in that same ‘cycle’.

If you don’t want Conte anymore then fine, but let’s find one of the new crop rather than bring back Poch. Yes will be great singing ‘He’s magic you know’ and he will represent the club splendidly, but the novelty will soon wear off. It was only a year ago that people were enthusiastically singing Contes name and now we are here. It will be no different with Poch, he has done nothing since leaving to show he is the answer and the club hasn’t changed in a significant way to suggest it would work any better with him either…..

Poch managed Southampton and Spurs for the bulk of that time, Conte managed Siena to break in his chops but then Juve, Inter and a financially doped Chelsea, it would be seen as a huge failure if his record was not as it was TBH, not really a fair comparison. I would fully expect Poch to have a couple of league wins under his belt if he managed those three over a 7/8 year period. He might have done better if he had not turned down overtures from Man United and stayed loyal to us at his height with us

Jose, well no one can deny he was a top top top manager, but there is a reason his last two clubs read Spurs and Roma and not Real and PSG

 

[Dicko]

been offline past few days what's the general gist after Forest? Beating a very poor Forest team doesn't change things for me, for the most part anyway.

• Sign the contract now, and we all get behind him
  
• if he's not signing the contract, why are we delaying getting someone new in?

I am greatly concerned though with our incomings (Porro, Destiny) not fitting the next manager's style...

If he signs the contract extension now (says we are on the right track, Happy with Levy, need to keep improving etc.) then I think it would still be too late for some. I'd love to add a few more solid signings and see us start to gel properly under Conte but I fear it's too late now, Folks have already been discussing their preferred next manager, doing polls, reading articles on 'Who's next for Spurs etc.' before he has even been sacked! It would be difficult for some to go from discussing their shiny new thing to being told they have to carry on with what they already have.

 

[Lilbaz]

Poch managed Southampton and Spurs for the bulk of that time, Conte managed Siena to break in his chops but then Juve, Inter and a financially doped Chelsea, it would be seen as a huge failure if his record was not as it was TBH, not really a fair comparison. I would fully expect Poch to have a couple of league wins under his belt if he managed those three over a 7/8 year period. He might have done better if he had not turned down overtures from Man United and stayed loyal to us at his height with us

Jose, well no one can deny he was a top top top manager, but there is a reason his last two clubs read Spurs and Roma and not Real and PSG

Conte took bari from a relegation battle to winning the league. Siena he also promoted. Juve hadn't won the league in 9 years. Inter it was 11 years. Could poch have matched that? Possibly but it would be a tough ask.

 

[Finney Is Back]

If he signs the contract extension now (says we are on the right track, Happy with Levy, need to keep improving etc.) then I think it would still be too late for some. I'd love to add a few more solid signings and see us start to gel properly under Conte but I fear it's too late now, Folks have already been discussing their preferred next manager, doing polls, reading articles on 'Who's next for Spurs etc.' before he has even been sacked! It would be difficult for some to go from discussing their shiny new thing to being told they have to carry on with what they already have.

(at present) we are above our realistic expected league finish based on financial resources provided. Conte also overachieved in this respect last season.
It would be folly to choose to get rid of him after only 16 months when he is outperforming resources provided.

 

[alekaras]

(at present) we are above our realistic expected league finish based on financial resources provided. Conte also overachieved in this respect last season.
It would be folly to choose to get rid of him after only 16 months when he is outperforming resources provided.

If you look at it strictly from our position in the table, you may have a point. But table position doesn't always tell you how well a team is performing relative to how it should perform and is actually performing. There are some pretty elaborate statistical models that allow you to track this, but I will just post a simplified one from understat.com. This alone doesn't give you the whole picture, but if you add more data points I think it will probably validate it. We are 7th in xPts having played two more games than Brentford. I wouldn't call this outperforming. Brighton, Brentford, and Saudi Sportswashing Machine are outperforming. We're not.

 

[Grays_1890]

Conte took bari from a relegation battle to winning the league. Siena he also promoted. Juve hadn't won the league in 9 years. Inter it was 11 years. Could poch have matched that? Possibly but it would be a tough ask.

Who knows, thats the thing about the comparisons, no one really knows.

I doubt Conte would have taken a Southampton Job and Spurs job back then and do what Poch did either with alot let resources so it kinda works both ways.

Thats not to knock either, I don't think the two really need to be compared either if I am honest, despite me chiming in

 

[harr1984]

Poch managed Southampton and Spurs for the bulk of that time, Conte managed Siena to break in his chops but then Juve, Inter and a financially doped Chelsea, it would be seen as a huge failure if his record was not as it was TBH, not really a fair comparison. I would fully expect Poch to have a couple of league wins under his belt if he managed those three over a 7/8 year period. He might have done better if he had not turned down overtures from Man United and stayed loyal to us at his height with us

Jose, well no one can deny he was a top top top manager, but there is a reason his last two clubs read Spurs and Roma and not Real and PSG

My post wasn’t about who is a better manager - it was about Poch having coached during a similar period of time. But regardless, Jose has managed Real Madrid and proved himself there. Poch, well he did ok in a one team league, I don’t exactly see the top clubs falling over themselves to employ him since he’s become a free agent - but don’t tell me, it’s because he told them all he would only ever dream of managing Spurs again?

I look forward to Poch coming back and everytime a bad signing is made it will be the clubs fault and one he never wanted, and everytime he says something ridiculous in the press people on here who obviously know Poch personally will explain why he didn’t actually mean what he said, and go on to explain what he actually meant I have missed that to be fair.

If only Jose and Conte had that luxury when here eh…..

 

[Grays_1890]

My post wasn’t about who is a better manager - it was about Poch having coached during a similar period of time. But regardless, Jose has managed Real Madrid and proved himself there. Poch, well he did ok in a one team league, I don’t exactly see the top clubs falling over themselves to employ him since he’s become a free agent - but don’t tell me, it’s because he told them all he would only ever dream of managing Spurs again?

I look forward to Poch coming back and everytime a bad signing is made it will be the clubs fault and one he never wanted, and everytime he says something ridiculous in the press people on here who obviously know Poch personally will explain why he didn’t actually mean what he said, and go on to explain what he actually meant I have missed that to be fair.

If only Jose and Conte had that luxury when here eh…..

Thats obviously forgetting that nearly ever fan on here and elsewhere said he was good to go when the time came. I also remember vividly arguments about his miss use of players like Toby, Walker and Rose etc at some time or other so the idea everyone was 100% dreamy about Poch is not that accurate TBH, ironically I think its more Conte cut your wrists and pass the rope press conferences that make people dreamy for Poch again

People generally love to believe everything they read in the press and if you believe it Poch is still a highly considered manager, I mean if Potter can get the Chelsea job you can't really discount anything to happen.

 

[harr1984]

Thats obviously forgetting that nearly ever fan on here and elsewhere said he was good to go when the time came. I also remember vividly arguments about his miss use of players like Toby, Walker and Rose etc at some time or other so the idea everyone was 100% dreamy about Poch is not that accurate TBH

People generally love to believe everything they read in the press and if you believe it Poch is still a highly considered manager, I mean if Potter can get the Chelsea job you can't really discount anything to happen.

I agree there were a good few of us who loves Poch and also happy to criticise him, but there are a good few on here who literally thought the sun shone out of his backside.

I don’t doubt Poch is highly regarded, but at the very top table? He is nowhere near them IMO until he actually achieves things. He might well fancy coming here as it could be considered comfortable to him, never having the pressure of having to win trophies at all costs. Get top 4 is the aim, a trophy is considered a real bonus. But until he is at a super club and achieves what the other truly top managers have, I personally wouldn’t put him in that bracket. And for what it’s worth I wouldn’t be upset if he came back, but I don’t think it’s the right move…..

 

[Grays_1890]

I agree there were a good few of us who loves Poch and also happy to criticise him, but there are a good few on here who literally thought the sun shone out of his backside.

I don’t doubt Poch is highly regarded, but at the very top table? He is nowhere near them IMO until he actually achieves things. He might well fancy coming here as it could be considered comfortable to him, never having the pressure of having to win trophies at all costs. Get top 4 is the aim, a trophy is considered a real bonus. But until he is at a super club and achieves what the other truly top managers have, I personally wouldn’t put him in that bracket. And for what it’s worth I wouldn’t be upset if he came back, but I don’t think it’s the right move…..

Yeh I get all that, personally I think the whole super club thing is also slightly over player personally as many managers within that perceived level is right man right place right time. I mean Zidane did an amazing job at Real and I am not saying Poch should have but having Real as your first job because of your status as a player is a much better springboard to management than cutting your teeth at Seville or Sociedad and conversely despite his success at Real I think he would be a terrible fit for us and would not champion it in the slightest if that makes sense. I also think there is a slight safety zone once a manager does his first hard job and then goes to Chelsea ala Jose, no doubting his record, but after Porto there was no more clubs of that level he had to really scrap hard for his life again and fair play. But for that I think it was always a bad fit IMO

Thats why maybe I champion Poch more than I should for us because really we need a manager who is going to develop and work within the club we are, not the club we aim to be which is why I think the Jose appointment was a poor move and why I think Conte will be short lived.

If any of that makes sense haha

 

[Diamond Lights]

If he signs the contract extension now (says we are on the right track, Happy with Levy, need to keep improving etc.) then I think it would still be too late for some. I'd love to add a few more solid signings and see us start to gel properly under Conte but I fear it's too late now, Folks have already been discussing their preferred next manager, doing polls, reading articles on 'Who's next for Spurs etc.' before he has even been sacked! It would be difficult for some to go from discussing their shiny new thing to being told they have to carry on with what they already have.

mate i am top of the list as one of those people. Look at my posts in January i wanted him gone, and ultimately i still do. BUT, if he commits and stays, well then i'll back him regardless obviously. Even if my heart still yearns for Poch to return, if Conte commits then i'll back him.

It works both ways though, he can't blame the fans for not being happy if he's not willing to back the fans and club.

 

[parklane1]

A lot of you have super thick rose-tinted glasses when looking back at the end of the Poch regime

It was awful, 10 months of poor decisions and poor play.

You can read hundreds of pages about it here in the archive:
https://www.glory-glory.co.uk/community/threads/mauricio-pochettino-sacked.6336/page-1168

That Brighton game, Saudi Sportswashing Machine, Watford, page after page of moans about the awful diamond formation, his blind faith in certain players, lack of rotation e.g.

a game where the manager fudged the players completely, following game after game of random and poor tactical decisions, the players finally lost faith in the leadership of the team.

Glad they are those who can see that, good post.

It is funny that people like to claim the likes of Conte and before him Mourinho are out of date managers, football has moved on etc. Conte has been a manager for 17 years, Poch 15 years so they are very much in that same ‘cycle’.

If you don’t want Conte anymore then fine, but let’s find one of the new crop rather than bring back Poch. Yes will be great singing ‘He’s magic you know’ and he will represent the club splendidly, but the novelty will soon wear off. It was only a year ago that people were enthusiastically singing Contes name and now we are here. It will be no different with Poch, he has done nothing since leaving to show he is the answer and the club hasn’t changed in a significant way to suggest it would work any better with him either…..

This too.

 

[Mcfee]

(at present) we are above our realistic expected league finish based on financial resources provided. Conte also overachieved in this respect last season.
It would be folly to choose to get rid of him after only 16 months when he is outperforming resources provided.

I was one of Conte’s biggest cheerleaders but I’ve lost faith. Regardless of league position he appears to have lost his mojo, whether due to personal circumstances or whether he feels underwhelmed by the club or both. Something seems wrong from the outside and tbh I’m not bothered by his statements to the press but I thought last week v Milan was very close to a sacking performance. I’d be in favour of him seeing out the rest of the season but unless something changes I think we should end it there.