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The Case for the Attacking play

billyiddo said:
I highly doubt we're in the market for a 10

Up to 2 wingers and a CF most likely. A shame we're starting the season short in so many positions given the net spend and reported investment to aid our business that means we should have a sizeable budget still remaining.

Confident we'll get a couple more in though - just closer to the end of the window than we'd like.
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I'm not really disappointed. We've just had so much too do because we've let it stagnate over the course of many years. I actually think we've done rather well this window to significantly improve the quality of the squad and the starting eleven. Anymore than what we have done so far has to be seen as a bonus rather than a expectation.
 
Looks like Ndiaye in, Richi out

So in Kudus, Savio and Ndiaye we will have 3 of the top dribblers in the league/europe. So gone from a ball carry heavy side, to a dribble heavy side with a lot of vertical passing.

Need to ensure we have a system to isolate those players against opposition
 
So we now have

LW - Marmoush, Tel
RW - Savio, Kudus, Ndiaye
CAM - Xavi, Maddison, Kulu


How we fitting them all in once they are all fit and ready to go? Tel's got to be off surely?
 
Raziel said:
Looks like Ndiaye in, Richi out

So in Kudus, Savio and Ndiaye we will have 3 of the top dribblers in the league/europe. So gone from a ball carry heavy side, to a dribble heavy side with a lot of vertical passing.

Need to ensure we have a system to isolate those players against opposition
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Yeah....it's called good passing.

A long way to go.
 
Yiddo said:
So we now have

LW - Marmoush, Tel
RW - Savio, Kudus, Ndiaye
CAM - Xavi, Maddison, Kulu


How we fitting them all in once they are all fit and ready to go? Tel's got to be off surely?
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Marmoush will be playing CF as much as anything, unless Solanke in fully over his injury woes.

Xavi won’t be ready to play again until next March, Maddison has suffered a succession of injuries and heaven knows when Kulusevski will actually be able to start a game after being unable to even kick a football for over a year.

Kudus is going to need a while to regain sharpness after 8 months out, Savio clearly needs his fitness managing.

So I suspect Tel will be here until at least January to provide cover.
 
Yiddo said:
So we now have

LW - Marmoush, Tel
RW - Savio, Kudus, Ndiaye
CAM - Xavi, Maddison, Kulu


How we fitting them all in once they are all fit and ready to go? Tel's got to be off surely?
Click to expand...

I don't think Marmoush has been signed to play LW
 
Raziel said:
Looks like Ndiaye in, Richi out

So in Kudus, Savio and Ndiaye we will have 3 of the top dribblers in the league/europe. So gone from a ball carry heavy side, to a dribble heavy side with a lot of vertical passing.

Need to ensure we have a system to isolate those players against opposition
Click to expand...
gray was overlapping porro plenty in the last game
 
MartyFunkhouser said:
The issue comes and I think Billy touched on it earlier that we are going to need to see almost career best seasons from alot of players if we are going to score enough goals this season
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Best seasons

Maddison - 12 in league, 18 all comps
Kudus - 8 in PL, 14 all comps (actually did 11 in league for Ajax)
Savio - 9 in league, 11 all comps
Deki - 7 in PL, 10 all comps (did 8 in PL once as well)
Marmoush - 15 in league, 20 in all comps
Solanke - 19 in PL, 21 in all comps (actually did 29 in championship)
Xavi - 19 in league, 22 in all comps (best was in PSV, also did 10/11 in Germany)
Tel - 7 in league, 10 in all comps

That's 8 players proven to be able to do double figures in all comps, 3 at 15+

I think the goal scoring problem (in terms of player capability) is overstated, yes we don't have Kane and Son, but there is a lot of options to go around.

The system needs to create those chances in multiple areas, so that we can spread it around, not just one route to goal
 
Raziel said:
Best seasons

Maddison - 12 in league, 18 all comps
Kudus - 8 in PL, 14 all comps (actually did 11 in league for Ajax)
Savio - 9 in league, 11 all comps
Deki - 7 in PL, 10 all comps (did 8 in PL once as well)
Marmoush - 15 in league, 20 in all comps
Solanke - 19 in PL, 21 in all comps (actually did 29 in championship)
Xavi - 19 in league, 22 in all comps (best was in PSV, also did 10/11 in Germany)
Tel - 7 in league, 10 in all comps

That's 8 players proven to be able to do double figures in all comps, 3 at 15+

I think the goal scoring problem (in terms of player capability) is overstated, yes we don't have Kane and Son, but there is a lot of options to go around.

The system needs to create those chances in multiple areas, so that we can spread it around, not just one route to goal
Click to expand...
Of course but respectfully Deki and Xavi are not going to have much impact this season.

Its likely a combination of Savio, Marmoush, Kudus and or Solanke.

I agree on a system maybe yielding goals absolutely but IMO on paper we look short.
 
robp135 said:
Pretty informative show about DeZerbi tactics.

podcasts.apple.com

Can De Zerbi’s tactics actually work at Spurs?

Podcast Episode · The View From The Lane: The Athletic FC's Spurs show · September 10 · 47m
podcasts.apple.com podcasts.apple.com
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didn't find it that insightful, basically came across as -> troupe/narrative, then some kind of "well not sure"

Apply to "can RDZ adjust", "will RDZ last more than 18 months", "is Spurs capable of playing RDZ ball", last example they basically stated the narrative and then almost reluctantly admitted no one had seen Spurs best 11 yet.

The only thing I think is worth digging into in some detail is the concept of

- Current meta in EPL is pretty much "upscale Pulis ball", simple/brutal/physical
- RDZ is much more complicated in model

Is the complication worth the risk, i.e. harder to implement, but does it have a higher upside?
 
Raziel said:
Best seasons

Maddison - 12 in league, 18 all comps
Kudus - 8 in PL, 14 all comps (actually did 11 in league for Ajax)
Savio - 9 in league, 11 all comps
Deki - 7 in PL, 10 all comps (did 8 in PL once as well)
Marmoush - 15 in league, 20 in all comps
Solanke - 19 in PL, 21 in all comps (actually did 29 in championship)
Xavi - 19 in league, 22 in all comps (best was in PSV, also did 10/11 in Germany)
Tel - 7 in league, 10 in all comps


That's 8 players proven to be able to do double figures in all comps, 3 at 15+

I think the goal scoring problem (in terms of player capability) is overstated, yes we don't have Kane and Son, but there is a lot of options to go around.

The system needs to create those chances in multiple areas, so that we can spread it around, not just one route to goal
Click to expand...

Now lets look at PL

Maddison 12
Kudus 8
Savinho 2
Kulu 7
Marmoush 4
Solanke 19
Xavi 2
Tel 4
(Edit : might as well chuck Mudryk in with his 5)


So 2 double digit league seasons from our attackers. Solanke hasn't looked close to replicating that season since and Maddison on a recovery journey from injury.

You'd expect Marmoush to rack up a decent amount of goals, 10-15, but i wouldn't bet on any of the others beating those numbers, maybe Savinho can get 5 or 6 as a regular starter.

I don't think it's actually possible to overstate the issue with the lack of goal scorers in our squad currently.
 
billyiddo said:
Now lets look at PL

Maddison 12
Kudus 8
Savinho 2
Kulu 7
Marmoush 4
Solanke 19
Xavi 2
Tel 4
(Edit : might as well chuck Mudryk in with his 5)


So 2 double digit league seasons from our attackers. Solanke hasn't looked close to replicating that season since and Maddison on a recovery journey from injury.

You'd expect Marmoush to rack up a decent amount of goals, 10-15, but i wouldn't bet on any of the others beating those numbers, maybe Savinho can get 5 or 6 as a regular starter.

I don't think it's actually possible to overstate the issue with the lack of goal scorers in our squad currently.
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Ouch
 
billyiddo said:
Now lets look at PL

Maddison 12
Kudus 8
Savinho 2
Kulu 7
Marmoush 4
Solanke 19
Xavi 2
Tel 4
(Edit : might as well chuck Mudryk in with his 5)


So 2 double digit league seasons from our attackers. Solanke hasn't looked close to replicating that season since and Maddison on a recovery journey from injury.

You'd expect Marmoush to rack up a decent amount of goals, 10-15, but i wouldn't bet on any of the others beating those numbers, maybe Savinho can get 5 or 6 as a regular starter.

I don't think it's actually possible to overstate the issue with the lack of goal scorers in our squad currently.
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It is very scary.
I am personally invested in total belief that what RDZ is building will work. That is a healthy approach from the mental health perspective, however I agree, we should really be very concerned.
I think getting two or three at the weekend is actually very important.
 
Looking at those season bests irrespective of leagues :

Maddison - 12 in league 5 seasons ago
Kudus - 8 in PL 3 seasons ago(actually did 11 in league for Ajax) done 9 for Ajax, 11 was for FC Nordsjælland 7 seasons ago in Denmark.
Savio - 9 in league 3 seasons ago, in his career he has scored 14 league goals we've paid 75-85 million for him😂
Deki - 7 in PL, 10 all comps (did 8 in PL once as well)
Marmoush - 15 in league 3 seasons ago
Solanke - 19 in PL 3 seasons ago
Xavi - 19 in league 5 season ago
Tel - 7 in league 4 seasons ago
 
billyiddo said:
Now lets look at PL

Maddison 12
Kudus 8
Savinho 2
Kulu 7
Marmoush 4
Solanke 19
Xavi 2
Tel 4
(Edit : might as well chuck Mudryk in with his 5)


So 2 double digit league seasons from our attackers. Solanke hasn't looked close to replicating that season since and Maddison on a recovery journey from injury.

You'd expect Marmoush to rack up a decent amount of goals, 10-15, but i wouldn't bet on any of the others beating those numbers, maybe Savinho can get 5 or 6 as a regular starter.

I don't think it's actually possible to overstate the issue with the lack of goal scorers in our squad currently.
Click to expand...

Again, don't think it's as dire as it appears (not saying we couldn't do with a more proven goal scorer)

Richi has been able to score double figure in this side whenever he played at least 28 games, Solanke's best season for us was 9 in 27, which says fitness/availability might be the bigger issue. I think Marmoush is an upgrade on both, so agree 15-ish if he can stay fit.

Kudus/Maddison/Deki are all kind of "5 goals a season" type of players (taking account availability again, Maddison more but we won't get full season out of him).

The real question is Savio, we are depending on him to push either his goal numbers up, or put in big assist numbers.

My view remains, with 8 players capable, the coach has to figure it out
 
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