Daniel Levy - Former Chairman

[Bullet]

https://twitter.com/x/status/323542541049929728

 

[Bishop]

Yeah, I would hope that they think and recognise the extraordinary achievement up until 2019, and then I would understand why they’d feel there hasn’t been as much of a sure hand since then. I don’t think it’s about fairness or recognition, it’s just about who is right to take it forward. I think DL was exceptional when the task was about making us as competitive as possible while building world class infrastructure, and doing it all in a sustainable way. I just never saw how that then translated to the next phase - getting us as competitive as Liverpool and Arsenal. There is no reason why we can’t be building towards that.

I remember a story around the time he let a Commercial Director go. It was along the lines of her feeling that the targets set were crazy high, unrealistic etc. And I think that’s how he got things done in business, he’d have crazy exacting standards, but he never asked anyone to work harder or achieve more than he would in his role. He walked the walk, and was capable of executing to an extraordinary level himself. So he expected that of others.

And I think he probably expected to be able to apply that similar playbook to the football side. In terms of expecting someone to achieve extraordinary things with fewer resources. As if it was just about pushing harder, trying to extract more. And it clearly doesn’t work like that on the football side. It’s about chemistry, the right sort of alchemy coming together. And letting Poch go was where my trust in DL to take us forward broke down for me. Because he actually had the guy that brought us an extraordinary achievement, and consistency, with fewer resources. And then he saw the results slide, so in DL’s mind I can see where he thinks he has to make a change. But I don’t think he ever got why Poch was successful in the first place. And we went on a 4 year journey of thrashing around trying to recover from that bad decision I think.

I’m just not sure with DL in charge we would have ever leveraged our increased resources in the right way. I just think he was wired differently, and it made him suited to a prior phase of our club, not the one we would be moving into if we truly wanted to compete. It requires more risk taking, it requires not just trying to squeeze everything from limited resources. Or every negotiation. It requires more flexibility and a belief in a sporting ideal. Not a rigid view of expected results. I think that’s what did for him in the end, so I understand why the Lewis’s made the move.

This was way more succulent than I've ever described it but this really hit the tickle my balls with a feather in terms of my disgruntlement with the regime. Excellent post.

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

Listening to Simon Jordan on Talksport here. I think it’s interesting perspective because he clearly knows DL.

He is certain that this is about the eventual sale of the club. Which makes sense.

My question is - what is the calculation for the Lewis’s, around how much MORE value can be added to the club if we were to ‘win more often.’ And how much would they have to spend to get us into that position, and would it be worth their while?

That’s what I’m trying to work out. Is there actually alignment between what we as fans want. And what the Lewis’s want? They could sell now, and they will have already made a huge amount. Do they actually want to take it further, because it’s in their interest to extract a higher price? Or do they actually want to get out now, and the denials about the availability are posturing as the start of a negotiation.

Simon Jordan firmly believes it’s clearly Joe Lewis driving this, so that’s my other question. Does he care enough about Tottenham? Do the kids genuinely have a different view as they’ll inherit it soon anyway? Jordan thinks there will be no major change.

 

[Baleforce]

Listening to Simon Jordan on Talksport here. I think it’s interesting perspective because he clearly knows DL.

He is certain that this is about the eventual sale of the club. Which makes sense.

My question is - what is the calculation for the Lewis’s, around how much MORE value can be added to the club if we were to ‘win more often.’ And how much would they have to spend to get us into that position, and would it be worth their while?

That’s what I’m trying to work out. Is there actually alignment between what we as fans want. And what the Lewis’s want? They could sell now, and they will have already made a huge amount. Do they actually want to take it further, because it’s in their interest to extract a higher price? Or do they actually want to get out now, and the denials about the availability are posturing as the start of a negotiation.

Simon Jordan firmly believes it’s clearly Joe Lewis driving this, so that’s my other question. Does he care enough about Tottenham? Do the kids genuinely have a different view as they’ll inherit it soon anyway? Jordan thinks there will be no major change.

We are worth more before any huge success, as anyone able to afford us would be doing so for nefarious reasons, and therefore would want to be able to claim they generated the success.

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

Per Forbes, United and Real Madrid are $6bn+ valued, Liverpool and City are at $5bn+, Spurs and Arsenal are at $3bn+.

So is there a calculation that the Lewis’s can make, around more investment to get us to a $5bn+ valuation? How long will that take? Is the juice worth the squeeze for them? Do they have the stomach for the risk?

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

We are worth more before any huge success, as anyone able to afford us would be doing so for nefarious reasons, and therefore would want to be able to claim they generated the success.

I see what you’re saying, but let’s say we ended up winning 3 of the next 5 PL titles, and go deep in the CL most of those years (assuming we maintain our great commercial revenue growth) are you saying we would not be worth more?

I think if a nation state wanted to buy us to sportswash, the legitimacy of owning winners would be more valuable than the legitimacy of bringing success.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Per Forbes, United and Real Madrid are $6bn+ valued, Liverpool and City are at $5bn+, Spurs and Arsenal are at $3bn+.

So is there a calculation that the Lewis’s can make, around more investment to get us to a $5bn+ valuation? How long will that take? Is the juice worth the squeeze for them? Do they have the stomach for the risk?

They don’t have the cash for the risk

 

[Baleforce]

I see what you’re saying, but let’s say we ended up winning 3 of the next 5 PL titles, and go deep in the CL most of those years (assuming we maintain our great commercial revenue growth) are you saying we would not be worth more?

I think if a nation state wanted to buy us to sportswash, the legitimacy of owning winners would be more valuable than the legitimacy of bringing success.

I see what you are saying.

But, if that was the case, why hasn’t it happened already, the money is out there.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

I see what you are saying.

But, if that was the case, why hasn’t it happened already, the money is out there.

The money isn’t there
They are mega rich but in football terms cash poor

 

[DTA]

Crap sound edit, standards have slipped already.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Listening to Simon Jordan on Talksport here. I think it’s interesting perspective because he clearly knows DL.

He is certain that this is about the eventual sale of the club. Which makes sense.

My question is - what is the calculation for the Lewis’s, around how much MORE value can be added to the club if we were to ‘win more often.’ And how much would they have to spend to get us into that position, and would it be worth their while?

That’s what I’m trying to work out. Is there actually alignment between what we as fans want. And what the Lewis’s want? They could sell now, and they will have already made a huge amount. Do they actually want to take it further, because it’s in their interest to extract a higher price? Or do they actually want to get out now, and the denials about the availability are posturing as the start of a negotiation.

Simon Jordan firmly believes it’s clearly Joe Lewis driving this, so that’s my other question. Does he care enough about Tottenham? Do the kids genuinely have a different view as they’ll inherit it soon anyway? Jordan thinks there will be no major change.

I'm not sure that adds that much value. I think the main remaining value to be eeked out is by finishing the infrastructure projects - the hotel, the Goods Yard/Depot/Printworks houses (500 units), and most elusively the Northumberland Park Victoria Line platforms. Those combined could maybe add say another £0.5b to the value (selling the former two would perhaps pay off a big chunk of our debts).

But I don't think on pitch success would do relatively that much, unless it's across a decade or more.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

I'm not sure that adds that much value. I think the main remaining value to be eeked out is by finishing the infrastructure projects - the hotel, the Goods Yard/Depot/Printworks houses (500 units), and most elusively the Northumberland Park Victoria Line platforms. Those combined could maybe add say another £0.5b to the value (selling the former two would perhaps pay off a big chunk of our debts).

But I don't think on pitch success would do relatively that much, unless it's across a decade or more.

Well you could say how has someone come up with that value anyway
The club loses money
Has a huge debt
It’s assets depreciate and are not fixed (players)
And the stardom and training ground etc as assets also have an up keep cost

 

[Baleforce]

The money isn’t there
They are mega rich but in football terms cash poor

That Qatari's have hundreds of billions, Abu Dhabi a couple of trillion, they've only spent back of the sofa money on City so far.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

That Qatari's have hundreds of billions, Abu Dhabi a couple of trillion, they've only spent back of the sofa money on City so far.

Of course
But they don’t own us

 

[DTA]

I'm not sure that adds that much value. I think the main remaining value to be eeked out is by finishing the infrastructure projects - the hotel, the Goods Yard/Depot/Printworks houses (500 units), and most elusively the Northumberland Park Victoria Line platforms. Those combined could maybe add say another £0.5b to the value (selling the former two would perhaps pay off a big chunk of our debts).

But I don't think on pitch success would do relatively that much, unless it's across a decade or more.

Also what would it take to make us champions? A billion on top of what we normally spend (that’s not that outrageous because didn’t Chelsea spend that recently?) and there is no guarantee with that either as I doubt Chelsea will win the league this year.

So you spend a billion, in the hope you make 1.5 back - and as it’s just a hope I’m not sure people with serious money would consider that an astute imvestment

 

[Baleforce]

Of course
But they don’t own us

My point was, if there was reputation washing benefit to buying the finished article, it would have happened already, United and Juve back in the day, Barca, Madrid, nothing is out of reach when you have that much money.

Being the architect of success is a key part of the value.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Also what would it take to make us champions? A billion on top of what we normally spend (that’s not that outrageous because didn’t Chelsea spend that recently?) and there is no guarantee with that either as I doubt Chelsea will win the league this year.

So you spend a billion, in the hope you make 1.5 back - and as it’s just a hope I’m not sure people with serious money would consider that an astute imvestment

It’s just so speculative
Your buying humans for a start

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

My point was, if there was reputation washing benefit to buying the finished article, it would have happened already, United and Juve back in the day, Barca, Madrid, nothing is out of reach when you have that much money.

Being the architect of success is a key part of the value.

Surely the reason it hadn’t happened already was because of DL?

I agree the money is out there. I also agree the Lewis’s don’t have the cash to invest for sustained success to get us into the 5bn+ valuation range. I think they have enough to invest to ensure we don’t fall too far behind, but that’s about it. Maybe Viv Lewis is willing to take a little more risk with the money than Daniel was, but again as people who know these people have said, it was Daniel managing Joe’s investment. What Daniel did, he did under Joe’s guidance and with Joe’s constraints. If it was going to be massively different now, it would have been different many years ago.

My lukewarm take: the removal of DL is about being able to sell the club. DL had an idea of what type of owner would be acceptable in order to be a custodian of the club’s long term interests (see his comments to Simon Jordan about how the newer owners today have different interests, nation states) and he cared deeply about Tottenham’s role in the community. Offering the interview to Neville and his comment about being more respected once he’s gone play into this.

I think the Lewis’s think they can get the most money from a nation state, where as DL would have preferred owners like FSG. What we’re seeing now, denials about the club being for sale, it’s all posturing to drive the price as high as possible. The Lewis’s don’t have the money to invest to get us into that 5bn range, it’s would take too long and it’s too much of a risk even if they did want to do it. They’ll sell, not too far into the future. There’s no point spending the time or the energy dragging it out too far into the future when the bulk of the profit they will realise from their investment can be taken in the nearer term.

 

[DTA]

Surely the reason it hadn’t happened already was because of DL?

I agree the money is out there. I also agree the Lewis’s don’t have the cash to invest for sustained success to get us into the 5bn+ valuation range. I think they have enough to invest to ensure we don’t fall too far behind, but that’s about it. Maybe Viv Lewis is willing to take a little more risk with the money than Daniel was, but again as people who know these people have said, it was Daniel managing Joe’s investment. What Daniel did, he did under Joe’s guidance and with Joe’s constraints. If it was going to be massively different now, it would have been different many years ago.

My lukewarm take: the removal of DL is about being able to sell the club. DL had an idea of what type of owner would be acceptable in order to be a custodian of the club’s long term interests (see his comments to Simon Jordan about how the newer owners today have different interests, nation states) and he cared deeply about Tottenham’s role in the community. Offering the interview to Neville and his comment about being more respected once he’s gone play into this.

I think the Lewis’s think they can get the most money from a nation state, where as DL would have preferred owners like FSG. What we’re seeing now, denials about the club being for sale, it’s all posturing to drive the price as high as possible. The Lewis’s don’t have the money to invest to get us into that 5bn range, it’s would take too long and it’s too much of a risk even if they did want to do it. They’ll sell, not too far into the future. There’s no point spending the time or the energy dragging it out too far into the future when the bulk of the profit they will realise from their investment can be taken in the nearer term.

You see my take is different from yours. I believe Levy would have sold (at a great price) to anyone that he thinks would make spurs better/ more successful including nation states.
But he wouldn’t to anyone like the Texans (taxmans) at Utd who would suck the club dry. I think Lewis would absolutely sell to the likes of them if they were the highest bidder.

levy saw spurs as a legacy… lewis sees us just as profit

 

[Gutter Boy]

Also what would it take to make us champions? A billion on top of what we normally spend (that’s not that outrageous because didn’t Chelsea spend that recently?) and there is no guarantee with that either as I doubt Chelsea will win the league this year.

So you spend a billion, in the hope you make 1.5 back - and as it’s just a hope I’m not sure people with serious money would consider that an astute imvestment

I'd just bribe VAR £20m for the title; much easier.