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Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

Silly McSilly Face said:
It does require a plan because for example, the NHS has repurposed itself to rely on imported already qualified doctors. So much so that the BMA have cited in their recent strike action the fact that there are not enough training places for graduates from medical school. Reversing that situation would require a plan and take years to implement.
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Yes, certain scenarios will take time to unwind.
What I'm saying is any plan is possible as you have full power over the control mechanism.
 
ricky2tricky4city said:
Yes, certain scenarios will take time to unwind.
What I'm saying is any plan is possible as you have full power over the control mechanism.
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Sorry, yes, absolutely and let me be clear, one of the big reasons why I personally voted to leave the EU wasn't because I thought we would sale off into sunlit uplands but precisely because what we would be left with is absolute clarity over who to blame if things are a sh*tshow (our own elected politicians) and the power to do something about it if we are not happy. And that is true democracy, warts and all!
 
K.D.D.D.D.Soc said:
My brother in law (a staunch Tory) and has retired to Littlehampton is committed to vote Reform at any election due to their stand on immigration, the only not white people I've ever seen when we visit are the staff in local Indian and Chinese restaurants. He doesn't see the irony that he's Irish and been a tax dodger all his working life.
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Of course he'll vote reform if he lives in Littlehampton. Such a lovely place, with the maddest population.
 
Silly McSilly Face said:
I don't think its a jealousy thing i think it's an anger thing and that people are scared. They see boatloads of strange men rocking up from very different backgrounds and cultures and they know we don't know who these people are and they know they're working with criminal gangs and they know you cannot tell who is a legitimate refugee and who is a foreign criminal or terrorist. Some of these people actually claim asylum here BECAUSE they've been convicted of murder or rape in their home country and they face the death penalty and under the law as it currently stands that actually makes them a legitimate refugee and means we are unable to return them. And because they haven't been convicted of anything here we release them onto the streets. These cases actually happen and regularly. It is the anger and fear. People dont feel like their government and their authorities are keeping them safe.
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I was replying to your post that suggested people thought 'I'm struggling and they're getting stuff handed to them'

Anyway ..moving on.
You do appear to know a lot about these people/individuals. Enough to pass judgement on them.
What access do you have?
 
Gutter Boy said:
Brexit did give the UK government that power again. Both governments since have been too neo-liberal to use it though
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Particularly the current government. I just don't get the sh*t show half-way house view of "we accept we can't rejoin the EU but we will seek closer alignment"

Right so what you're saying is you'll have none of the advantages but many of the disadvantages, for example, aligning with rules you have had no influence in making without all of the market access that makes doing so worthwhile? Absolute worst of all worlds and it is the summation of the wet flannel approach to politics that Starmer adopts "oh,.i'm not sure what side of the fence i should be on, in think I'll just sit on it until it breaks and I fall into a massive cow pat"

I was always of the view that you are either a full-fat EU member or you're hard out. And by hard out I mean you act in your own self interest at all times. The Starmer government have actually landed on a situation where they've successfully negotiated enhanced market access to the EU, a trade deal with the US that undercuts the terms the yanks handed out to the EU and a trade deal with India. Coupled with our newly ratified membership of CPTPP we are in a unique position to become a bit of a tiger economy, the "Singapore on the Thames" that people speculated about when Brexit became a reality.

A 5% difference in tariffs in US trade positions coupled with tariff free trade between UK and EU means we could effectively set up a situation where it would be preferential for European companies to export and import goods with America via the UK.

I just don't think this current government have the instincts or desire to push ahead with this obvious opportunity as their sensibilities are europhile and technocratic.
 
ricky2tricky4city said:
You do appear to know a lot about these people/individuals. Enough to pass judgement on them.
What access do you have?
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I don't have the access I once had but as part of my remit I oversee the controls over the opening of basic bank accounts for asylum seekers and the anti financial crime enhanced background checks we conduct as part of the government scheme (we are mandated to open and maintain these accounts)
 
news.sky.com

Sir Keir Starmer promises small boat migrants will be 'detained and sent back'

The prime minister is facing mounting pressure to show results on tackling Channel crossings and ending the use of asylum hotels, with small-scale protests outside the hotels continuing.
news.sky.com news.sky.com

Right now its Farage setting the political narrative. He speaks and Starmer follows. Unfortunately for Labour I think Starmer is a technocrat without the imagination and communication skills to shift the momentum and the narrative.
 
Silly McSilly Face said:
news.sky.com

Sir Keir Starmer promises small boat migrants will be 'detained and sent back'

The prime minister is facing mounting pressure to show results on tackling Channel crossings and ending the use of asylum hotels, with small-scale protests outside the hotels continuing.
news.sky.com news.sky.com

Right now its Farage setting the political narrative. He speaks and Starmer follows. Unfortunately for Labour I think Starmer is a technocrat without the imagination and communication skills to shift the momentum and the narrative.
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Starmer is a bozo with about as much political flair as a Fillet of Fish
 
I keep hearing about respecting the fears of the people. The fears need to be based on some reality. If it's ultimately down to men being predators but we are less worried about the white British ones than the others then we have a deep rooted problem with racism in our society. Mostly not direct. But it's a poison as the hate is now so apparent. The way we are looked at. The comments. The news. Society is at a precipice and something horrid is gonna happen.

The people who have created this environment don't actually care about young girls though. Tommy. Nigel. Whoever else. That's the main issue here. They care about demonising non whites.
 
LutonSpurs said:
I keep hearing about respecting the fears of the people. The fears need to be based on some reality. If it's ultimately down to men being predators but we are less worried about the white British ones than the others then we have a deep rooted problem with racism in our society. Mostly not direct. But it's a poison as the hate is now so apparent. The way we are looked at. The comments. The news. Society is at a precipice and something horrid is gonna happen.

The people who have created this environment don't actually care about young girls though. Tommy. Nigel. Whoever else. That's the main issue here. They care about demonising non whites.
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The government should be educating people, they have accepted the false premise and responded to it. That was the mistake.

When they were asked what they were going to do about immigration, the only correct and moral answer, is to encourage it, and emigration, the movement and pollination of ideas is essential to the growth of the species.
 
LutonSpurs said:
I keep hearing about respecting the fears of the people. The fears need to be based on some reality. If it's ultimately down to men being predators but we are less worried about the white British ones than the others then we have a deep rooted problem with racism in our society. Mostly not direct. But it's a poison as the hate is now so apparent. The way we are looked at. The comments. The news. Society is at a precipice and something horrid is gonna happen.

The people who have created this environment don't actually care about young girls though. Tommy. Nigel. Whoever else. That's the main issue here. They care about demonising non whites.
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This is why I don't agree with the "you lot think you are more intelligent than" line that gets peddled.

There are genuine people out there who are concerned who are being lost to the political abyss and the extreme right and that needs to be engaged, but that doesn't also mean you stand by and allow lies and frankly nonsense to go uncalled. Alot of people out there are using the current climate as an excuse to roll out their extreme bigotry, you can see it an absolute mile off, so yeh, for those we need to engage, more effort needed, for those that don't want to be engaged, just want to travel the country bashing peoples heads because of their skin colour.........na you are still a cnut
 
Baleforce said:
The government should be educating people, they have accepted the false premise and responded to it. That was the mistake.

When they were asked what they were going to do about immigration, the only correct and moral answer, is to encourage it, and emigration, the movement and pollination of ideas is essential to the growth of the species.
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People don't want that, though. And they're sick of being "educated".
 
Baleforce said:
The government should be educating people, they have accepted the false premise and responded to it. That was the mistake.

When they were asked what they were going to do about immigration, the only correct and moral answer, is to encourage it, and emigration, the movement and pollination of ideas is essential to the growth of the species.
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Educate for sure, too many want to make a Martyr of Lucy Connolly and call for Trump to come and save us, ignoring that the blokes a rapist. We are beyond education now, people want to believe lies on social media more than they want to believe the truth.
 
LutonSpurs said:
I keep hearing about respecting the fears of the people. The fears need to be based on some reality. If it's ultimately down to men being predators but we are less worried about the white British ones than the others then we have a deep rooted problem with racism in our society. Mostly not direct. But it's a poison as the hate is now so apparent. The way we are looked at. The comments. The news. Society is at a precipice and something horrid is gonna happen.

The people who have created this environment don't actually care about young girls though. Tommy. Nigel. Whoever else. That's the main issue here. They care about demonising non whites.
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The fears aren't based on reality? These protests started because an asylum seeker approached two 14 year old girls and tried to assault them saying if they were back home they'd make good wives. This was in broad daylight in the midst of a busy area. The 999 recording from the woman includes here shouting continually "get away from those girls". Is that a figment of their imagination?
 
ricky2tricky4city said:
Probably since Year 8 at school.
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There's a difference between actual education and having to endure the snotty mansplaining of why 1/2 1 million immigrants a year is good for us all while wages and living standards are suppressed, they can barely keep a lid on inflation, you can't see a doctor or a dentist, school class sizes are creeping upwards, sewers are overflowing and our greenbelts are being concreted over to build houses....
 
Silly McSilly Face said:
There's a difference between actual education and having to endure the snotty mansplaining of why 1/2 1 million immigrants a year is good for us all while wages and living standards are suppressed, they can barely keep a lid on inflation, you can't see a doctor or a dentist, school class sizes are creeping upwards, sewers are overflowing and our greenbelts are being concreted over to build houses....
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Illegal Immigrants
 
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