http://www.theguardian.com/football/2013/sep/19/fa-english-football-feeder-clubs?
What would happen to Swindon?
What would happen to Swindon?
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Feeder Clubs to be allowed?
- Thread starter onlyme
- Start date
chancer
Gudni Bergsson
I really hate the sound of this. Sounds like it would compromise the identity of the smaller clubs.
The problems it's trying to address is the dearth or English players and the chaos of the loan system. Well, FFP sounds like a pretty good way to fix both of those. I'd also favour a direct change in the loan system rather than trying to fix that problem indirectly. Fundamentally compromising the independence of small clubs seems like an excessive step if those other options are there.
The problems it's trying to address is the dearth or English players and the chaos of the loan system. Well, FFP sounds like a pretty good way to fix both of those. I'd also favour a direct change in the loan system rather than trying to fix that problem indirectly. Fundamentally compromising the independence of small clubs seems like an excessive step if those other options are there.
Danners9
Luke Young
I don't like the idea of smaller clubs becoming glorified reserve teams.
I don't mind a bit of loaning to give experience, it's a win-win situation for all - although the loan system as a whole needs modifying. Chelsea have over 20 players on loan, for example. There should be a cap on squad members and how many can be loaned, the other players have to be either incorporated into the club's own system or just not bought for the sake of buying.
I don't mind a bit of loaning to give experience, it's a win-win situation for all - although the loan system as a whole needs modifying. Chelsea have over 20 players on loan, for example. There should be a cap on squad members and how many can be loaned, the other players have to be either incorporated into the club's own system or just not bought for the sake of buying.
jamonserrano
John Scales
So players of a PL team will be allowed to go out on-loan only to the feeder club?
braineclipse
Willie Hall
I think that's a very unlikely outcome.
Lost Mango
Allan Nielsen
And it wouldn't solve any of the supposed problem as all the big clubs would do is stuff their feeder club full of the talented foreign youngsters that they are currently hovering up.
Interesting comment from Poyet last night that Spain had a similar issue 15 years ago or so and now look at them.
And as Strachan said it is up to the players to want to prove themselves. The issue isn't the foreign players, the issue is that the english players expect it on a plate and don't work hard enough to progress in comparison to the foreigners. And then they have the Daily Mail-esque response/rant about bleedin' foreigners taking our jobs and stopping us progressing. Go out on loan or move clubs, take a pay cut and work hard if you really want to make it to the very top.
Our kids aren't good enough because our younger year coaching is shockingly bad and our kids generally have a sucky attitude.
Interesting comment from Poyet last night that Spain had a similar issue 15 years ago or so and now look at them.
And as Strachan said it is up to the players to want to prove themselves. The issue isn't the foreign players, the issue is that the english players expect it on a plate and don't work hard enough to progress in comparison to the foreigners. And then they have the Daily Mail-esque response/rant about bleedin' foreigners taking our jobs and stopping us progressing. Go out on loan or move clubs, take a pay cut and work hard if you really want to make it to the very top.
Our kids aren't good enough because our younger year coaching is shockingly bad and our kids generally have a sucky attitude.
braineclipse
Willie Hall
I don't like the attitude argument, it gets brought up in Norway from time to time too.
You produce top athletes in a wide range of sports quite regularly. What's different with football? Is the attitude of general youngsters really that different between your country and say Germany, Belgium, Holland or Denmark? I don't think so...
The coaching and overall strategy is much more of an issue for your youth development in my humble opinion. Most reports are similar.
Also worth noting that in addition to Spain we've also seen a massive turnaround in another footballing nation in Germany. The changes made both in approach and results in those nations indicate to me that there are systematic things that can be done and that are currently holding you back whereas others are flourishing.
Feeder clubs may or may not help to some degree, I'm not sure either way tbh. It alone won't solve the problem though, of that I'm quite sure.
Lost Mango
Allan Nielsen
I agree that coaching is the key.
But I also think there is a major difference between football and almost every other sport in the UK in that there is much more money available at a much lower level. The top atheletes, cricketers, tennis players, even rugby players still have to work exceptionally hard to break even in the first place let alone make a living out of it. The Bostocks and Parrots get signed up on relatively liveable salaries early on to get them to sign for the big clubs and I think that impacts on a significant number of them mentally. They think they have it made and a lot of them don't push on. For every Beckham or Bale who put in the extra shifts there are countless young english players who don't and turn up at their loan clubs (by all accounts) thinking they are the dog's ******** and don't put in the shifts there either.
Coaching needs to be revolutionised for sure. All I'm saying is I think the lack of desire and drive is a bigger issue for a significant proportion of young players than foreign competition.
jts1882
Dean Richards
The feeder club doesn't seem to solve any of the main problems.
The block is breaking into first teams. We've recently used loans to PL clubs as a successful route (e.g. Walker, Rose, Townsend). A feeder club wouldn't help here as there is a substantial gap between the lower divisions and top third in the PL.
Much as I like how Walker, Rose and Townsend have come through, I think we should ban loans to the PL. It allows clubs to hoover up the talent, like Chelsea and their 25 loans. More damagingly it distorts the league competition. For instance, Chelsea get to play Everton without Lukaku, whereas he gets to play against the rest. Likewise against Liverpool with and without Moses. What are the chances Lukaku or Moses score critical goals against Chelsea's rivals this season?
I'm not against feeder clubs for younger players as a replacement for U18 and U21 competitions. But it would be best if clubs paired with local clubs. This would encourage supporters of PL clubs to go and watch the young players, say us going to Barnet or Orient, which might suit people with young children. The smaller clubs would benefit from better players (at least more skilful), better crowds, more financial security, etc. We could see development of dual support of a PL and FL side from both directions, with PL supporters getting affinity for another local club and supporters of the smaller clubs getting an interest in their local PL clubs (by following players) instead of becoming PL gloryhunters.
The block is breaking into first teams. We've recently used loans to PL clubs as a successful route (e.g. Walker, Rose, Townsend). A feeder club wouldn't help here as there is a substantial gap between the lower divisions and top third in the PL.
Much as I like how Walker, Rose and Townsend have come through, I think we should ban loans to the PL. It allows clubs to hoover up the talent, like Chelsea and their 25 loans. More damagingly it distorts the league competition. For instance, Chelsea get to play Everton without Lukaku, whereas he gets to play against the rest. Likewise against Liverpool with and without Moses. What are the chances Lukaku or Moses score critical goals against Chelsea's rivals this season?
I'm not against feeder clubs for younger players as a replacement for U18 and U21 competitions. But it would be best if clubs paired with local clubs. This would encourage supporters of PL clubs to go and watch the young players, say us going to Barnet or Orient, which might suit people with young children. The smaller clubs would benefit from better players (at least more skilful), better crowds, more financial security, etc. We could see development of dual support of a PL and FL side from both directions, with PL supporters getting affinity for another local club and supporters of the smaller clubs getting an interest in their local PL clubs (by following players) instead of becoming PL gloryhunters.
Right now there's a limit on season long loans between two clubs. That might be what they want to change.
It could also just be a way to avoid genuine B-teams in the league system, as that would kill off a lot of smaller clubs. The top clubs have the majority of the most promising youth, but they can't give them game time. It would be beneficial to send them to a club where you know they'll get to play AND they don't resort to hoofball.
Gutter Boy
Tim Sherwood
I thought we were already circumventing this by selling players to Swindon with a £1 buy-back option (Massimo Luongo)?
Must have missed this, thought he went for £400k? Or do you mean we can buy him back for £400,001? Is there any evidence of this? I must admit it sounds like a very Spurs/Levy thing to do...