Politics, politics, politics

[milo]

https://twitter.com/x/status/755521994402258945

 

[milo]

How many of out other firms have been sold off over the last decade or so, nothing new in what Preston is going on about and its pointless him having a dig at May when this has been going on for years.

Blah blah blah ( nothing new). Sounds like a lot of sour grapes from Preston who sounds like he is another remainer who is just rabbiting on.

And as far as i know this deal has been going on since before the vote so they have still done it and saved themselves some money. Are you saying ( They are buying up UK assets on the cheap because the pound has fallen) is the main reason they are taking over something that will make them a lot of money? because if you are i can not agree.

I was just querying your claim that this was a positive post-Brexit sign. I can understand why it is being spun as such but I do not see any substance to it.

 

[parklane1]

I was just querying your claim that this was a positive post-Brexit sign. I can understand why it is being spun as such but I do not see any substance to it.

The fact is a lot of the scare stories being put out about job losses ( and to be honest you put a lot of them up) before the vote were hyped up a lot. Now we have a firm who is promising to double the number of the workforce and you say there is no substance about it. You could not make it up.

 

[Gilzeantoscore]

They have. Repeatedly. For the last 240 years.



For further reading, you could look at General Equilibrium, but I highly recommend I, Pencil - it's an enlightening read.



Never thought I'd see you on the side of a Bush. I don't care what he calls it, he's not an economist and he's not a very successful president either.


It's been explained again and again, please see above.


Wouldn't it be called "Trickle up" if that was the case?


Yes they are. I'm not quite sure why you're trying to pigeon-hole my economic principles into one small branch there. My opinions on economics are varied - in places shared with "trickle down economics" in others not. I guess it's easier to invent an enemy when you give it a name.


I don't know how many generations of voting you've looked at, but the young are always voting to the left. Even I thought communism was a good idea before I was in senior school.

I'm probably misquoting here, but a good truism is "If you’re not a socialist before you’re twenty-five, you have no heart; if you are a socialist after twenty-five, you have no head." I'll try and dig it out in French as it's far more descriptive.

You're right Bush isn't an economist, but he is a right winger and even he saw it for what it was....voodoo. As for that quote about being a socialist when young...that is something that only right wingers say...funny that. As to how wealth it meant to magically trickle down to the lower orders, no, nobody has adequately explained how the invisible hand mechanism works. That's why it's called voodoo. Also try to explain how neo-liberalism is tied to the evangelical movement and how it reinforces right wing views of social Darwinism. This is all mainstream thought held by adherents of this discredited economic notion. I thought, as an atheist, (like me) you'd like to be reminded of your religious right wing nut job fellow travellers.

 

[milo]

The fact is a lot of the scare stories being put out about job losses ( and to be honest you put a lot of them up) before the vote were hyped up a lot. Now we have a firm who is promising to double the number of the workforce and you say there is no substance about it. You could not make it up.

I will park the scare stories comment for the moment.

I hope that the extra investment and jobs materialise but we have heard these kind of words before when a foreign takeover is happening only for it be different once the sale is complete. I would assume that this is one of the reasons why Theresa May was setting out her reasons for favouring trying to block big foreign takeover just last week.

I think it is worth looking at the comments of one of Arms founders Hermann Hauser

“Arm is the proudest achievement of my life and it is the biggest player in the UK tech sector. The future of Arm could have been determined by the UK management team. Now it will be determined in Japan."

“SoftBank is a reasonable acquirer, but this is sadly one of the unintended consequences of Brexit. The fall in sterling has made this very cheap, and while I suspect they were considering it for a long time, they have acted now because the opportunity is there.

“It’s a sad loss of independence. Britain is becoming a smaller and smaller player in the tech sector. But on what grounds would you intervene? Internationally it’s not sustainable.”

 

[parklane1]

I will park the scare stories comment for the moment.

I hope that the extra investment and jobs materialise but we have heard these kind of words before when a foreign takeover is happening only for it be different once the sale is complete. I would assume that this is one of the reasons why Theresa May was setting out her reasons for favouring trying to block big foreign takeover just last week.

I think it is worth looking at the comments of one of Arms founders Hermann Hauser

“Arm is the proudest achievement of my life and it is the biggest player in the UK tech sector. The future of Arm could have been determined by the UK management team. Now it will be determined in Japan."

“SoftBank is a reasonable acquirer, but this is sadly one of the unintended consequences of Brexit. The fall in sterling has made this very cheap, and while I suspect they were considering it for a long time, they have acted now because the opportunity is there.

“It’s a sad loss of independence. Britain is becoming a smaller and smaller player in the tech sector. But on what grounds would you intervene? Internationally it’s not sustainable.”

I understand all those points and do not necessarily disagree with them, however your earlier post said ( but I do not see any substance to it) which at best is misleading and at worst refusing to accept the positives in the deal.

 

[milo]

I understand all those points and do not necessarily disagree with them, however your earlier post said ( but I do not see any substance to it) which at best is misleading and at worst refusing to accept the positives in the deal.

I think that it is too early to say what the positives are (or if there will be any) but I will be delighted if the new owners are true to their word and do invest substantially and create new jobs.

 

[parklane1]

I think that it is too early to say what the positives are (or if there will be any) but I will be delighted if the new owners are true to their word and do invest substantially and create new jobs.

Fair point and i can understand that, just as it was to early to say what the negatives WOULD be before the vote.

 

[SpurMeUp]

Fantastic thread. Communist before 25, right wing after sadly describes me to some degree. I'm not a Conservative voter, and likely never will, but my views are now an amalgam. Believing the state should be lean, free enterprise is good, but we should take the good things from communism. Free high quality educated for all, and various social provisions that create a feeling and reality of society. I lived in Cuba for sometime and saw both the good and bad of communism. Its too simple to polarise right wing - left wing. Both have merits and we should learn from both. Sadly we're still involved in tribal politics, despite the population moving on and demanding something fresh.

 

[SpurMeUp]

@milo thanks for posting these stories. Well written and fascinating. @parklane1 there is no doubt there is a lot of bad blood from media commentators who, like me really, can't let Brexit go. But even you must admit there are many absurdities (or ironies?) post Brexit.

• A vote for UK independence results in our one crown jewel Tech company sold to the Japs. Great start to UK self-control!
• May stands on protecting UK assets, then stands by and watches one of the greatest assets sold. But at least the Conservatives have a veneer of competence.
• Brexit was predominately voted for by those who had less money, yet prices will rise with a lower pound effecting the poor most.
• People vote for Brexit while having plans to move to the continent and setup a business.
• People vote against an un-elected EU government (sic) and end up with an un-elected UK PM.
• That Boris says we want the best possible trade relations with Europe, after getting the nation to vote to leave the customs union.

I'm sure there are others.

 

[glorygloryeze]

@milo thanks for posting these stories. Well written and fascinating. @parklane1 there is no doubt there is a lot of bad blood from media commentators who, like me really, can't let Brexit go. But even you must admit there are many absurdities (or ironies?) post Brexit.

• A vote for UK independence results in our one crown jewel Tech company sold to the Japs. Great start to UK self-control!
• May stands on protecting UK assets, then stands by and watches one of the greatest assets sold. But at least the Conservatives have a veneer of competence.

Let's wait and see shall we? If a Polish company had been taken over by one of the UK's finest in the last week, would it be hailed as "the UK PLC is on the March"? There was always going to be some point when the pound fluctuated, it happened due to Brexit and they bought. These things happen...well by the sound of things ARM was going to be given a buy-out offer at some point.

• Brexit was predominately voted for by those who had less money, yet prices will rise with a lower pound effecting the poor most.

• Again, let's see shall we..

• People vote for Brexit while having plans to move to the continent and setup a business.

• Patriotic and yet business-minded. I'm sure we know many such like people...

• People vote against an un-elected EU government (sic) and end up with an un-elected UK PM.

• Lol! What's the maximum time Theresa May will last before she MUST face a public vote? Will this come before we have a vote on whether we want Juncker and the like in the EU Commission being in their roles? Please don't humour me by mentioning MEPs...

• That we say we want the best possible trade relations with Europe, after voting to leave the customs union.

• Voting to leave puts doesn't automatically mean the UK can't get good trade relations with Europe.

 

[glorygloryeze]

Fantastic thread. Communist before 25, right wing after sadly describes me to some degree. I'm not a Conservative voter, and likely never will, but my views are now an amalgam. Believing the state should be lean, free enterprise is good, but we should take the good things from communism. Free high quality educated for all, and various social provisions that create a feeling and reality of society. I lived in Cuba for sometime and saw both the good and bad of communism. Its too simple to polarise right wing - left wing. Both have merits and we should learn from both. Sadly we're still involved in tribal politics, despite the population moving on and demanding something fresh.

I agree with a lot of this; there is a lot of shades of grey in-between and in fact at the extremities there are a lot of parallels: i remeber one rapper saying "3 rights make a left"..so so true imo.

It helps the powers that be imo to keep things binary; the grey-in-between bits are far too subtle and hence less digestible to the large masses (and also the messages are less controllable)

 

[scaramanga]

Naughty, naughty Corbynistas.....

My favourite bit is the comments section full of Conservatives who have taken them for £25 to go and spend it on wine.

 

[Gutter Boy]

@milo thanks for posting these stories. Well written and fascinating. @parklane1 there is no doubt there is a lot of bad blood from media commentators who, like me really, can't let Brexit go. But even you must admit there are many absurdities (or ironies?) post Brexit.

• A vote for UK independence results in our one crown jewel Tech company sold to the Japs. Great start to UK self-control!
• May stands on protecting UK assets, then stands by and watches one of the greatest assets sold. But at least the Conservatives have a veneer of competence.
• Brexit was predominately voted for by those who had less money, yet prices will rise with a lower pound effecting the poor most.
• People vote for Brexit while having plans to move to the continent and setup a business.
• People vote against an un-elected EU government (sic) and end up with an un-elected UK PM.
• That Boris says we want the best possible trade relations with Europe, after getting the nation to vote to leave the customs union.

I'm sure there are others.

The UK has never had an elected PM. That would be like a president. We all elect a local MP based on their party's manifestos. The party with the most MPs forms a government and selects a leader as the primus inter pares. All that's happened is we've swapped Witney's MP for Maidenhead's.

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

The UK has never had an elected PM. That would be like a president. We all elect a local MP based on their party's manifestos. The party with the most MPs forms a government and selects a leader as the primus inter pares. All that's happened is we've swapped Witney's MP for Maidenhead's.

Yep I did not vote tory though I think they are every so marginally the better of the two main parties, well more than marginally when a nutter like Corbyn is in charge at Labour, but people vote for a party not the leader. Before I started scribbling all over the ballot paper I used to decide which party I agreed with on most issues and then voted for that party.


In other news despite the indy trying to bring up Brexit at every opportunity, Chinese decide to invest in Britain http://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...tion-despite-brexit-uncertainty-a7148441.html

wait whaaaaaattttt I thought no one would touch these diseased racist little Island if we decided to trade with the world instead of a corrupt and failing form of government in the EU.

 

[parklane1]

[QUOTE="Danishfurniturelover, post: 830293, member: 378"


In other news despite the indy trying to bring up Brexit at every opportunity, Chinese decide to invest in Britain http://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...tion-despite-brexit-uncertainty-a7148441.html

wait whaaaaaattttt I thought no one would touch these diseased racist little Island if we decided to trade with the world instead of a corrupt and failing form of government in the EU.[/QUOTE]


But,but,but we are doomed i tell thee doomed.

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

IMF chief Christine Lagarde is to stand trial for corruption. Of course she is innocent until proved guilty, but I am not sure why people always reference the IMF, it is not this great organisation that gets everything right, she was actually finance minister in France for the period of time when she is accused of the crime, and we all know how great the French are with their finances.

 

[AuroRaman]

Has there been any mention of Canadian PM Justin Trudeau so far in this thread? He seems too good to be true as a politician, especially one in such a position of power.

 

[scaramanga]

Has there been any mention of Canadian PM Justin Trudeau so far in this thread? He seems too good to be true as a politician, especially one in such a position of power.

I'm fairly sure most of us could run a country of about 20k moose famers and a pile of snow without much hassle. Especially if it were a country whose main claim to fame is that everyone there is a bit nice.

 

[Hotshot-Tottenham]

[QUOTE="Sexagenarianlover, post: 830293, member: 378"


In other news despite the indy trying to bring up Brexit at every opportunity, Chinese decide to invest in Britain http://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...tion-despite-brexit-uncertainty-a7148441.html

wait whaaaaaattttt I thought no one would touch these diseased racist little Island if we decided to trade with the world instead of a corrupt and failing form of government in the EU.

But,but,but we are doomed i tell thee doomed.[/QUOTE]

We can all play tit for tat.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36864273

It's not all good. It's not all bad. Like most things, the truth is probably somewhere in between.

People are allowed to differ.