ricky2tricky4city
Colin Calderwood
So I take it that you're going to be nicer to the scousers and their team?
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Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)
- Thread starter SpurMeUp
- Start date
thfcsteff
Teddy Sheringham
I know.
The main thing though is that the people need to know the world supports them against the mullahs. They need some serious signals to make the push to banish their theocratic nightmare. And given the west’s history in fudging with them -whether it be regime changes in the 50s, installing bastards who are friends and then fudging them all off and leaving them to deal with a theocratic rule- the chances of the people feeling that support is extremely slim.
thfcsteff
Teddy Sheringham
The society is, yes.
The general public are, yes.
But every act of aggression strengthens the mullah’s hold on rule. Tragically.
SpurMeUp
Tommy Harmer
Poor Jeremy Hunt. The perfect Tory for a party that no longer exists
Good headline in the Guardian. Hunt will probably get a top job alongside Boris. He's the sort of politician Boris will need - sensible, rational. It is quite strange what has happened to politics in the last 5 years. The norms have been eroded. After 50 years of stable 2 party politics are we seeing a revolutionary change, or just a blip?
Good headline in the Guardian. Hunt will probably get a top job alongside Boris. He's the sort of politician Boris will need - sensible, rational. It is quite strange what has happened to politics in the last 5 years. The norms have been eroded. After 50 years of stable 2 party politics are we seeing a revolutionary change, or just a blip?
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Dude genuinely, before we think about cutting tax for those of us that earn over 50k we need to look at reversing the savage cuts inflicted by the Tories.
I don't want taxes to go up, but I don't think it's the right time for a tax cut either, think about the state of the country now, the divisions that are part of society are largely due to the skewed distribution of those that have too much and those that have too little.
Earning 50k-80k does not mean you are well off at all (especially in London) but it is a lot more then those that struggle to get by, while working hard. So no Boris can't bribe me with a tax cut.
Fund public services properly, produce a incremental raised tax system for those earning 150k to 100million. Then I'm for a cut to middle class tax.
Gilzeantoscore
Simon Davies
Your post relies on two fairly hefty assumptions there.
- That cutting tax rates reduces revenue. Recent evidence and plenty of solid theory suggests that's not the case - especially at the more "discretionary" end of the taxation range
- That spending more is always a beneficial choice. Now I agree that spending more on absolute essentials for those who absolutely require them is a generally good thing to do. What I don't agree with is the popular narrative that cuts = bad. The emotional tie to spending on the NHS, for example, makes necessary cost savings next to impossible which damages our ability to spend more where it's needed.
If those earning less wish to create a divide out of spite and petty jealousy, stealing from the successful and handing it out to the spiteful is not the right answer. Where there is disparity in opportunity, I can understand frustration (whilst not divide), but I cannot by any means understand, condone or reward resentment of success.
Earning pretty much any wage means you're better off than many somewhere - government handouts in this country would make one reasonably wealthy from a worldwide viewpoint. We can't simply tax more until everyone is equally poor - if we do then the Corbyns have won!
How much do you think increasing the tax rate in that region would increase tax revenue? My estimate is £0. I won't be exactly right, but I bet I won't be far off.
At £110k it pretty much works out neutral to arrange one's finances in a manner so as to reduce liability to tax (advisor fees, setup costs, transaction fees etc.), so for those earning £150k+ it's a no-brainer. Problem being that they won't just avoid the tax on the bits over £150k, they'll do it for all of it. So many would end up paying significantly less tax.
Politicians offering and providing tax cuts are to be lauded and should be given every opportunity to do so as we can give. Very few are able to stand up against the socialist ratchet, and without them we would quickly spiral into punitive and damaging rates of taxation
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Grays_1890
Tommy Harmer
The questioning of Hunts sister who died when he was 2 was pretty out of line I thought
nayimfromthehalfwayline
Andy Thompson
Tory leadership rivals Boris Johnson and Jeremy Hunt have unveiled pledges on immigration and education.
Frontrunner Mr Johnson has promised to deliver an Australian-style points-based immigration system if he becomes prime minister.
And Foreign Secretary Mr Hunt said he would cancel the tuition fee debts of young entrepreneurs who start businesses and employ people.
The winner of the contest will take over from Theresa May on 24 July.
In the Conservative Party digital hustings, broadcast on the party's Facebook page and on Twitter on Wednesday evening, Mr Johnson said he was "open to talent, open to immigration" but he said it "should be controlled".
He called for an Australian-style-points-based system, considering factors including whether an immigrant has a firm job offer before arrival and their ability to speak English.
Mr Johnson said he would also block the ability to claim benefits immediately when someone arrives in the UK.
"We must be much more open to high-skilled immigration such as scientists, but we must also assure the public that, as we leave the EU, we have control over the number of unskilled immigrants coming into the country," he said.
This would restore public faith and democratic control in the immigration system, while being "tougher on those who abuse our hospitality", he added.
The Immigration and Social Security Co-ordination (EU Withdrawal) Bill is currently at report stage and contains plans to end the existing automatic preference for EU citizens.
However, the bill does not set out what the new immigration system will look like from 2021, and a consultation to shape this is not due to report back to Parliament until the end of this year.
Madeleine Sumption from the Migration Observatory says Australia has used its points system in order to "create a very liberal system to push up the number of migrants".
She explained a point system similar to Australia's "would have the effect of being a little bit more open to high-skilled migration from outside the EU and more restrictive to low-skilled migration from inside the EU."
'Turbo-charge our economy'
Under Mr Hunt's new proposal, anyone who creates a new business which employs more than 10 people for five years would have their university tuition fee debts written off.
Mr Hunt, who has stressed his background as an entrepreneur, said he wanted to give young people the confidence to go into business for themselves.
"If we are to turbo-charge our economy and take advantage of Brexit, we need to back the young entrepreneurs who take risks and create jobs," he said.
"I started my own business, I still use the lessons that experience taught me - focus, drive and the art of negotiation - every single day.
"I want more young people to have the confidence to take the decision to start their own business, so we create wealth and start thriving as a country again."
The current Prime Minister Theresa May has refused to promise unconditional support for her successor's Brexit plan.
When asked if she would back whatever Brexit outcome her successor was able to achieve - including a no-deal Brexit - she said that amounted to inviting her to say she would agree with "whatever happens in future".
The Institute for Fiscal Studies has estimated that Mr Hunt's proposals, including a corporation tax cut and an increase in defence spending, would cost a total of between £37-£68bn.
It concluded the foreign secretary's plans would leave no scope to relieve the pressure on other spending departments without tax rises or risking higher borrowing.
The IFS also analysed Mr Johnson's tax plan, which includes increasing the £50,000 threshold for the higher rate of income tax, and concluded it would cost "many billions" and benefit the wealthy most.
Meanwhile, Mr Hunt spoke for the first time about the death of his sister in a "terrible accident" when he was only two years old.
"I was too young to ever remember it but I do know it affected my parents," he told ITV's Peston.
"I wouldn't claim this is something that had a big emotional effect on me personally."
Each candidate is vying for the votes of the 160,000 or so Conservative Party members who will vote for the next party leader and therefore prime minister.
The rivals used the digital hustings to set out some of their plans:
On Brexit
Mr Hunt said if the UK gets to October without the prospect of a deal, "we will leave without a deal".
Mr Johnson also repeated his pledge to get the UK out of the EU on 31 October, but he thinks the chances of a no-deal Brexit happening are a "million to one".
However, in an interview with Conservative Home, Mr Johnson said every member of his cabinet would have to be "reconciled" with the policy of leaving on 31 October - with or without a deal.
On an election
Mr Hunt said it was essential the Conservatives had delivered Brexit before a general election, otherwise the party "will be thrashed".
Asked about proroguing Parliament, Mr Johnson said: "It would be absolutely crazy for any of us to think of going to the country and calling a general election before we get Brexit done."
When pushed, he added: "I'm not attracted to archaic devices like proroguing."
On trade rules
Mr Hunt dismissed rival Mr Johnson's claims that a mechanism known as GATT 24 could be used to prevent tariffs if there was a no-deal Brexit.
He said: "I think we've got to knock this GATT 24 thing on the head. You can only get an agreement not to introduce tariffs if both sides agree to that."
On EU citizens' rights
Mr Hunt said he would give full citizens' rights to the three million EU nationals living in the UK, even if the UK left without a deal.
Mr Johnson said he was "absolutely in favour" of protecting the rights of EU citizens in the UK.
Infrastructure
The foreign secretary said he would back both the third runway at Heathrow and the HS2 high-speed rail link.
Mr Johnson said it had to be recognised that there was "huge pressure" on the South East, so more infrastructure was needed.
Healthcare
Mr Johnson said the NHS would be "free to everybody at the point of use" under his premiership.
He ruled out a pay-for-access NHS, even as a result of a post-Brexit trade deal with the US.
Westminster's public spending watchdog, the public accounts committee, said NHS recruitment and school funding must be the first priorities of the new prime minister, warning that Brexit had been overshadowing other issues.
Committee chairwoman Meg Hillier said education funding was a "crisis" and described NHS staffing shortages as "unsustainable".
Frontrunner Mr Johnson has promised to deliver an Australian-style points-based immigration system if he becomes prime minister.
And Foreign Secretary Mr Hunt said he would cancel the tuition fee debts of young entrepreneurs who start businesses and employ people.
The winner of the contest will take over from Theresa May on 24 July.
In the Conservative Party digital hustings, broadcast on the party's Facebook page and on Twitter on Wednesday evening, Mr Johnson said he was "open to talent, open to immigration" but he said it "should be controlled".
He called for an Australian-style-points-based system, considering factors including whether an immigrant has a firm job offer before arrival and their ability to speak English.
Mr Johnson said he would also block the ability to claim benefits immediately when someone arrives in the UK.
"We must be much more open to high-skilled immigration such as scientists, but we must also assure the public that, as we leave the EU, we have control over the number of unskilled immigrants coming into the country," he said.
This would restore public faith and democratic control in the immigration system, while being "tougher on those who abuse our hospitality", he added.
The Immigration and Social Security Co-ordination (EU Withdrawal) Bill is currently at report stage and contains plans to end the existing automatic preference for EU citizens.
However, the bill does not set out what the new immigration system will look like from 2021, and a consultation to shape this is not due to report back to Parliament until the end of this year.
Madeleine Sumption from the Migration Observatory says Australia has used its points system in order to "create a very liberal system to push up the number of migrants".
She explained a point system similar to Australia's "would have the effect of being a little bit more open to high-skilled migration from outside the EU and more restrictive to low-skilled migration from inside the EU."
'Turbo-charge our economy'
Under Mr Hunt's new proposal, anyone who creates a new business which employs more than 10 people for five years would have their university tuition fee debts written off.
Mr Hunt, who has stressed his background as an entrepreneur, said he wanted to give young people the confidence to go into business for themselves.
"If we are to turbo-charge our economy and take advantage of Brexit, we need to back the young entrepreneurs who take risks and create jobs," he said.
"I started my own business, I still use the lessons that experience taught me - focus, drive and the art of negotiation - every single day.
"I want more young people to have the confidence to take the decision to start their own business, so we create wealth and start thriving as a country again."
The current Prime Minister Theresa May has refused to promise unconditional support for her successor's Brexit plan.
When asked if she would back whatever Brexit outcome her successor was able to achieve - including a no-deal Brexit - she said that amounted to inviting her to say she would agree with "whatever happens in future".
The Institute for Fiscal Studies has estimated that Mr Hunt's proposals, including a corporation tax cut and an increase in defence spending, would cost a total of between £37-£68bn.
It concluded the foreign secretary's plans would leave no scope to relieve the pressure on other spending departments without tax rises or risking higher borrowing.
The IFS also analysed Mr Johnson's tax plan, which includes increasing the £50,000 threshold for the higher rate of income tax, and concluded it would cost "many billions" and benefit the wealthy most.
Meanwhile, Mr Hunt spoke for the first time about the death of his sister in a "terrible accident" when he was only two years old.
"I was too young to ever remember it but I do know it affected my parents," he told ITV's Peston.
"I wouldn't claim this is something that had a big emotional effect on me personally."
Each candidate is vying for the votes of the 160,000 or so Conservative Party members who will vote for the next party leader and therefore prime minister.
The rivals used the digital hustings to set out some of their plans:
On Brexit
Mr Hunt said if the UK gets to October without the prospect of a deal, "we will leave without a deal".
Mr Johnson also repeated his pledge to get the UK out of the EU on 31 October, but he thinks the chances of a no-deal Brexit happening are a "million to one".
However, in an interview with Conservative Home, Mr Johnson said every member of his cabinet would have to be "reconciled" with the policy of leaving on 31 October - with or without a deal.
On an election
Mr Hunt said it was essential the Conservatives had delivered Brexit before a general election, otherwise the party "will be thrashed".
Asked about proroguing Parliament, Mr Johnson said: "It would be absolutely crazy for any of us to think of going to the country and calling a general election before we get Brexit done."
When pushed, he added: "I'm not attracted to archaic devices like proroguing."
On trade rules
Mr Hunt dismissed rival Mr Johnson's claims that a mechanism known as GATT 24 could be used to prevent tariffs if there was a no-deal Brexit.
He said: "I think we've got to knock this GATT 24 thing on the head. You can only get an agreement not to introduce tariffs if both sides agree to that."
On EU citizens' rights
Mr Hunt said he would give full citizens' rights to the three million EU nationals living in the UK, even if the UK left without a deal.
Mr Johnson said he was "absolutely in favour" of protecting the rights of EU citizens in the UK.
Infrastructure
The foreign secretary said he would back both the third runway at Heathrow and the HS2 high-speed rail link.
Mr Johnson said it had to be recognised that there was "huge pressure" on the South East, so more infrastructure was needed.
Healthcare
Mr Johnson said the NHS would be "free to everybody at the point of use" under his premiership.
He ruled out a pay-for-access NHS, even as a result of a post-Brexit trade deal with the US.
Westminster's public spending watchdog, the public accounts committee, said NHS recruitment and school funding must be the first priorities of the new prime minister, warning that Brexit had been overshadowing other issues.
Committee chairwoman Meg Hillier said education funding was a "crisis" and described NHS staffing shortages as "unsustainable".
Did you read behind the paywall? I can pm a copy if you're interested (although 25p is fairly cheap for an article).
Edit:
Oh, nearly forgot. Yeah but £500 a month though.
Edit:
Oh, nearly forgot. Yeah but £500 a month though.
milo
Jack L. Jones
I haven't yet
glasgowspur
Chris Jones
Grays_1890
Tommy Harmer
Haha Sorry terrible English.
I agree with that, I also think small incremental increases for higher earners over the 50% would be a good idea, together with the closing of tax loop holes and prevention of offshoring in tax havens, would help provide a fairer society... Providing it's not going to be spunked up the wall in a war with Iran or something.
glasgowspur
Chris Jones
milo
Jack L. Jones
Read it now. Not much of a surprise, they've covered Tweedy's PR quite a bit and the signs are there.
Gilzeantoscore
Simon Davies
brick, next the fudging Tories will asking British workers to pay their school fees for Eton and Harrow.
Grays_1890
Tommy Harmer
The old back turning went down well yesterday....not.