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Tim Sherwood…gone \o/

Discussion in 'Classic Threads' started by Gutter Boy, 16 Dec 2013.

?

Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?

Poll closed 10 May 2014.
  1. Yes

    14.4%
  2. No

    85.6%
  1. Yermiyahu

    Yermiyahu Scott Parker

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    Everybody knows this is nowhere.



    This 100%. Some of the vitriol shown to Tim Sherwood on this board has made me despair .Please gents, lets give the new guy a couple of Seasons before we put him on trial.
     
  2. Robspur12

    Robspur12 Paul Stalteri

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  3. Millsy_Yiddo

    Millsy_Yiddo Naybet

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    Re: Tim Sherwood…not treated with the respect a headmaster is.

    What does that first sentence even mean? You're going to have to explain further I'm afraid.

    Obviously everyone has a roll, and if it works it works, I'm not questioning that. My point was that Lloris bailing out the defence is not the same as Sandro bailing us out in midfield. Which is what you said originally.

    edit: It wasn't us that had that discussion btw.
     
  4. Yermiyahu

    Yermiyahu Scott Parker

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    Don't let rational thought get in the way of the hatred. IMHO he wasn't right for the job, but he did his best and got us a European place, something that throughout the 90's we were desperate for.
     
  5. scaramanga

    scaramanga Mel Hopkins Staff Member

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    Re: Tim Sherwood…not treated with the respect a headmaster is.

    The first sentence means that in most formations if the striker is failing the team won't score (much at all). If the DM is failing teams will walk through you. If the sweeper keeper is failing then the opposition will probably score.

    The cost of keeping possession further up the pitch is to have a high line. If you can afford talented, quick defenders to go with that, great. If, like us, you have to choose between one and the other there's really not much difference between talented and slow defenders (Dawson) and not so talented fast defenders (Walker) - both have their costs and benefits.
     
  6. Robspur12

    Robspur12 Paul Stalteri

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    Re: Tim Sherwood…not treated with the respect a headmaster is.

    I thought the purpose of the sweeper keeper was to be a last resort to add another layer to mop up the occasional mistake by the defence. In our case it seemed to be the main line of defence because the 4 players in front of him were constantly being caught out. So what happened was the sweeper keeper would anticipate a mistake over commit himself and it would end up looking like lloris was ****. Which is clearly not the case. TBF this was a problem for Sherwood as well as AVB.
     
  7. Jordinho

    Jordinho John Cameron Staff Member

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    Next season
    A whooping 1 point better.

    [table="width: 500"]
    [tr]
    [td][/td]
    [td]AVB[/td]
    [td]Sherwood[/td]
    [/tr]
    [tr]
    [td]Palace
    Swansea
    Arsenal
    Norwich
    Cardiff
    Chelsea
    West Ham
    Aston Villa
    Hull
    Everton
    Saudi Sportswashing Outpost
    Emirates Marketing Project
    Man Utd
    Fulham
    Sunderland
    Liverpool[/td]
    [td]3
    3
    0
    3
    3
    1
    0
    3
    3
    1
    0
    0
    1
    3
    3
    0
    [/td]
    [td]3
    3
    0
    0
    3
    0
    0
    3
    1
    3
    3
    0
    3
    3
    3
    0
    [/td]
    [/tr]
    [tr]
    [td][/td]
    [td]27[/td]
    [td]28[/td]
    [/tr]
    [/table]
     
  8. Robspur12

    Robspur12 Paul Stalteri

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    However done with more goals and without the fortuitous penalties of course which made AVB's record look far better than it was to those watching the teams.
     
  9. Millsy_Yiddo

    Millsy_Yiddo Naybet

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    Re: Tim Sherwood…not treated with the respect a headmaster is.

    But you can see the difference in risk though right? Your DM has a bad game there is much less a risk of you losing a game than there is if your sweeper keeper does.

    I would argue that if you can't afford talented, quick defenders then you shouldn't be playing a high line (depending on the opposition), but I think that's been done to death by now.
     
  10. harr1984

    harr1984 Steffen Iversen

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    Thats only sixteen teams, Im guessing the others Sherwood played twice? There are only three games out of those 16 that AVB bettered Sherwood and all three Sherwood had the away fixtures for....
     
  11. scaramanga

    scaramanga Mel Hopkins Staff Member

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    Re: Tim Sherwood…not treated with the respect a headmaster is.

    Not really, no.

    A traditional keeper is the last line of resort - a sweeper keeper will inevitable be used far more as they (by design) patrol nearly half the pitch when in possession, that's sort of the point of having one.

    And I don't think it looks like Lloris is **** when he makes a mistake to anyone other than the knuckle draggers at the Mirror and people like Redknapp/Dalglish (maybe some West Ham fans too). Anyone with any level of understanding of football outside of how it's been played on this skill-ridden island would know that.
     
  12. scaramanga

    scaramanga Mel Hopkins Staff Member

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    Do we get to count fortuitous missed penalties? Opponents missing when it's easier to score?
     
  13. indospurs

    indospurs Clint Dempsey

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    Not much to compare between AvB and Tim. Thanks anyway, perhaps not the most scintillating footy, but did much better than I think people would credit him for when he was announced to take over. Only have the three useless wet spam games to see how crap it did go. 4-0 to liverpoo wasn't too bad, just bad enough.

    I think he's learnt a lot this season, i'd be interested to see if he does alright elsewhere with a not so good squad.
     
  14. BrainOfLevy

    BrainOfLevy Michael Carrick

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    Such utter nonsense being spoken about in here RE AVB's tactics. :-#
     
  15. Kingdawson

    Kingdawson Banned

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    like?
     
  16. Gutter Boy

    Gutter Boy Tim Sherwood

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    The new guy won't come with the same baggage. Even Bergkamp (as FdB's assistant) would be welcomed with open arms.

    Let's see how their respective careers go from here. AVB is already doing very well at another CL club. I'd be very willing to bet that Timmeh's career follows a similar path to Paul Ince's.
     
  17. SpurMeUp

    SpurMeUp Andy Thompson

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    Re: Tim Sherwood…not treated with the respect a headmaster is.

    That's interesting. Thanks for taking the time.

    I agree with a more secure approach. Keeping it tight at the back first and then developing the attack second. No one has won anything when they leak lots of goals. But - Liverpool and City have shown a different way. I agree we don't have the players to succeed with a more attacking approach as city have used, and under TS we didn't quite get the balance right leaving ourselves open to better attacking teams. But against small teams the Mourinho/ AVB approach is less successful. See Chelsea. Excellent against top teams. Shyte against smaller teams. Its about getting the balance between attack and controlling the game right, and adapting to each game. Liverpool so nearly got it right and city did, while chelsea were too conservative, so you can see why TS has favoured a more adventurous approach. It is proven.

    Its not just that players don't run around enough, its that they don't know where to run, and aren't drilled effectively. Ultimately that was AVBs responsibility. If you're expending energy on closing down, you have less in the tank to run for the pass. A good manager makes it work however, and get the balance right.

    I think we had become stale when AVB left. I think the problem was he tried to be more adventurous - as we were not scoring enough since day one of the season. But it was out of his comfort zone, and instead of scoring we shipped goals. In short AVB didn't know how to get us setup to break down teams effectively, or did not have the time to get that side right. His philosophy is based on Mourinho's style and similar problems exist at chelsea, but they have more creative players and can simply buy spark to unlock teams. Imo Rodgers has got it right and TS is also right to get us being more proactive in attack.

    Motivation is less important than confidence, belief and clear instruction. I don't think AVB was able to give much of these kinds of things to the players when it mattered and that's why he lost his job.
     
    Last edited: 13 May 2014
  18. jts1882

    jts1882 Vedran Corluka

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    Yes, the AVB's better results against Norwich, Chelsea and Hull had home advantage. Likewise TS's better result against Everton had home advantage.

    The two results where TS did substantially better were the wins at Saudi Sportswashing Outpost and Man United after a home loss and draw, respectively, so overall he did do slightly better. He deserves credit for bring bringing back Adebayor and giving some young players a chance.

    The question has to be did he do sufficiently better to deserve the full-time job, as let's face it, we all know he was caretaker manager in all but name? Did we see signs that there would be a significant improvement long-term or can most of the difference be attributed to their different handling of Adebayor?
     
  19. Bullet

    Bullet Steffen Freund

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    Re: Tim Sherwood…not treated with the respect a headmaster is.

    Spot on. AVB's system was not working and could never take us where we want to be with the players at our disposal this year.

    Similarly Sherwood's system was not working and could never take us where we want to be.

    Hopefully the new guy's system will not be so blatantly flawed, so there will be some small crumb of possibility that we can get where we want to be.

    That is why I became so disenchanted with Spurs this season, you lot are arguing about Sherwood's behaviour etc but the key point is that neither manager had a system that could possibly work given the players we have.
     
  20. Kingdawson

    Kingdawson Banned

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    This guy lives in a planet by himself.
     

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