Tim Sherwood Testimonial OMT Spurs v Aston Villa 11th April

[metalgear]

everyone will attack us in the space behind the wing backs.
i just hope we keep up with the pace of the game, our last game looked really slow - players were slow, no pace on the ball, no quick thinking evident.

 

[scaramanga]

i cannot believe that....why would he not want to win every remaining game of the season. We have an easy run in, you never know maybe Utd or Arsanal will drop some points

if Poch has given up on this season already then its not a good sign at all. At least the boss has to fight to the very end, if not why the will the players ever bother to.

I'm pretty sure this season was written off before it started (other than a couple of nice cup runs) as preparation for next season. It just happens we've done far better than expected to be where we are now.

 

[NLS]

Had we beaten Burnley we would be five points behind Emirates Marketing Project... If we beat them at home that could narrow it to two. If they lose at Man U and if we beat Villa and all of a sudden we could be 1 point above above them with 5 other games to consider.....

However we hardly created a chance against a team likely to be relegated. There is still no real leader in the team and with Emirates Marketing Project's goal difference we have to be 8 points better than them in the last seven games.. No chance.

That makes Saturday's game fairly pointless. In fact it might be best if we lose every game for the rest of the season and Swansea go on a run and 'beat' us to 7th place for the Europa spot.. Mind you with a week to prepare for both the Man U and Burnley games it didn't do us any good so I don't know what I bloody want and I'm fed up!

COYS.

 

[indianspur]

I'm pretty sure this season was written off before it started (other than a couple of nice cup runs) as preparation for next season. It just happens we've done far better than expected to be where we are now.

i agree with all that, but to get ourselves into a position where we are not far off from a top 4 place makes it strange to just give up with 8 games to go.

Finish the season strongly and take the good form into the start of the next. The spine of our side, the younger players, the teams future, need to maintain a winning attitude/mentality

 

[DTA]

There's no way our last match was Poch maximising the chances of us winning.

I'm more than happy for him to be preparing for next season now - especially as he didn't get a proper preseason last summer.

If he is not putting the team in the best position to win, then he has the wrong mentality, and you know that.

 

[shaney]

I back pouch, but if he is being so unprofessional as to not (in his mind ) maximize the chances of winning all our remaining games, especially with champs league still possible (if unlikely) he should be sacked.

Luckily I don't believe your narrative, but good that you got your excuses in early.

Agreed. I have never heard anything as ludicrous as a manager "not" trying to win games when he is still in with a chance of making the top 4 and champions league (however small that chance may be). Of course it just gives an easy excuse to those supporting him blindly for when we lose or play crap like last week.

Like you, however, I dont think thats the case. I would find it hard to believe that Poch would do that. Its more a case of we play poorly very often, regardless of what players he picks and what formation he plays, apart from Kane and Eriksen papering over the cracks. That tells me something.

 

[Gutter Boy]

i agree with all that, but to get ourselves into a position where we are not far off from a top 4 place makes it strange to just give up with 8 games to go.

Finish the season strongly and take the good form into the start of the next. The spine of our side, the younger players, the teams future, need to maintain a winning attitude/mentality

I don't think CL would be any good for us next season. We'd just get battered (if we even get through the qualifiers).

We'd be better making it the year after, when the likes of Eriksen, Kane and Bentaleb have matured to the level that Rafa, Modric, King and Bale had got to when we last played it in.

Basically I think our team is too young for it, and I'd rather we had a proper go at winning the EL next season as a step towards competing for (and not just in) the CL.

 

[Gutter Boy]

I think Sherwood will 'go for it' which will play in to our hands and result in a comfortable victory

Yeah. I expect him to do one of his really insane things like play Agbonlahor and Nzogbia as their CMs

 

[braineclipse]

I'm pretty sure this season was written off before it started (other than a couple of nice cup runs) as preparation for next season. It just happens we've done far better than expected to be where we are now.

Disagree. There may have been an understanding that Pochettino would not be judged strictly on results this season and that long term development would be the focus. But I don't think this season was written off at all. We're a handful of points off our target, writing off the season any earlier would be silly.

At this point our best/only shot at getting 4th would probably have to be City imploding. Not likely, and I'm not holding my breath. Wouldn't mind focusing on building for next season now, but somehow Paulinho as our #10 doesn't seem like building for next season so I don't think that was what happened against Burnley.

Wouldn't mind seeing a couple of youngsters get a chance towards the end of the season, but perhaps just a touch premature at this point.

 

[The_Midlands_Yid]

I have to agree (can't believe i will actually say this) but getting to the CL would be almost pointless. We just are not ready yet and wouldn't make it through the group. Give us one more season to learn and develop and then i think we will look more like a good prospect. As for the Villa game ...regardless we should fight and get 3 points. 5th place is very attainable and that position would be a great way for POCH to finish his first season and push on for the next.

 

[Rorschach]

I don't think CL would be any good for us next season. We'd just get battered (if we even get through the qualifiers).

We'd be better making it the year after, when the likes of Eriksen, Kane and Bentaleb have matured to the level that Rafa, Modric, King and Bale had got to when we last played it in.

Basically I think our team is too young for it, and I'd rather we had a proper go at winning the EL next season as a step towards competing for (and not just in) the CL.

Do you really believe that? I can think of a few reason including money, prestige, retaining players, buying better players, etc. I get that we might not do well but who is to say that will be the case. Maybe even the experience alone will help bring the players on.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Do you really believe that? I can think of a few reason including money, prestige, retaining players, buying better players, etc. I get that we might not do well but who is to say that will be the case. Maybe even the experience alone will help bring the players on.

It would be like giving an 8 year old £1000. They'd spend it all on ice cream and make themselves very sick. Better to get £1000 when you are 21 and have more of a sense of what to do with it.

Essentially we need sustainable growth, not a (minor) lottery win. Better to grow organically and through incremental steps, than to jump straight in the deep end and drown.

My big hope for next season is that we'll win the EL.

 

[Gutter Boy]

I have to agree (can't believe i will actually say this) but getting to the CL would be almost pointless. We just are not ready yet and wouldn't make it through the group. Give us one more season to learn and develop and then i think we will look more like a good prospect. As for the Villa game ...regardless we should fight and get 3 points. 5th place is very attainable and that position would be a great way for POCH to finish his first season and push on for the next.

My understanding (assuming Liverpool or Arsenal win the cup) is

5th = no qualifying rounds
6th = 1 qualifying round
7th = 2 qualifying rounds

So the incentive to finish ahead of Southampton and Liverpool is up-to 4 less games in the late summer.

 

[scaramanga]

If he is not putting the team in the best position to win, then he has the wrong mentality, and you know that.

That's a very short term approach.

What if the best thing for a strong run at 4th next season is playing "sub-optimal" players like at the weekend?

It may be we want to maximise transfer fees, that Poch wants to see how they fare outside of training, or maybe even that it's simply an example to the others that training well gets rewarded. It could also be any of a thousand other reasons why not going all out against Burnley is better for our longer term prospects.

I could very easily rephrase your statement as "Not putting the team in the best position to succeed next season shows the wrong mentality"

 

[jaysea67]

My understanding (assuming Liverpool or Arsenal win the cup) is

5th = no qualifying rounds
6th = 1 qualifying round
7th = 2 qualifying rounds

So the incentive to finish ahead of Southampton and Liverpool is up-to 4 less games in the late summer.

The stages at which teams enter the EL has changed for next season. England will have 2 teams starting at the group stage, no team starting in the play-offs and 1 team starting in the 3rd qualifying round.

The FA Cup winners and the highest place league finishers will get direct entry to the group stage. If the FA Cup winners spot is not used, because the winners qualify for CL, then the two highest league places start in the group stage. The lowest placed qualifier from the league (since the League Cup winners spot won't be used) will enter at the 3rd qualifying round and would have four matches to reach the group stage.

 

[indianspur]

I don't think CL would be any good for us next season. We'd just get battered (if we even get through the qualifiers).

We'd be better making it the year after, when the likes of Eriksen, Kane and Bentaleb have matured to the level that Rafa, Modric, King and Bale had got to when we last played it in.

Basically I think our team is too young for it, and I'd rather we had a proper go at winning the EL next season as a step towards competing for (and not just in) the CL.

nah, thats just silly. Even if we got battered, who cares because it would be a learning experience for the players. Kane, Bentaleb, Lloris, all the players, they want CL, its the top of the top, its where everyone wants to be.There is no perfect timing for these things, you have to grab the opportunity if and when it presents itself.

Its like how Kane, Mason, Bentaleb have performed this season. They have been thrown into the deep end, the PL which is one of the toughest leagues in the world, and they havent drowned, they have shown they can compete and flourish and im sure they and others we manage to attract on the back of qualifying for the CL would again go up a level and do well.

The extra income would be helpful, the prestige of being in the best competition would raise our profile again, no Thurs night EL games will be beneficial to our PL campaign, there is absolute no downside to qualifying for the CL next season

 

[shaney]

It would be like giving an 8 year old £1000. They'd spend it all on ice cream and make themselves very sick. Better to get £1000 when you are 21 and have more of a sense of what to do with it.

Essentially we need sustainable growth, not a (minor) lottery win. Better to grow organically and through incremental steps, than to jump straight in the deep end and drown.

My big hope for next season is that we'll win the EL.

I find it quite laughable that some people think we are in a position to "pick and choose" when we try and get top 4. The European Cup / Champions League was totally out of our reach for decades, yet here we are in a position to at least fight for a place in it, however unlikely it may be. People think we will magically be in a stronger position next season, ignoring the fact that 2 of our 3 best players will highly likely be leaving "because" we are not in the top 4, and so the dreaded cycle continues. Then the new players we buy need time to settle (for how long GHod only knows, considering some of our recent signings still look brick 2 years on), all the while that the clubs who DO make it into the champions league this year will strengthen again with the money making the top 4 even harder to fight for next year.

Even talking about trying to win the poisonous EL, a competition that has handicapped us for years and which is designed to keep teams like us OUT of the champions league just shows me the typical Spurs loser mentality.

 

[Rorschach]

It would be like giving an 8 year old £1000. They'd spend it all on ice cream and make themselves very sick. Better to get £1000 when you are 21 and have more of a sense of what to do with it.

Essentially we need sustainable growth, not a (minor) lottery win. Better to grow organically and through incremental steps, than to jump straight in the deep end and drown.

My big hope for next season is that we'll win the EL.

Hmm... weird analogy which I'm not sure where to take, but the sustainable growth can happen too, no? Is it not already happening now with the stadium and youth setup. I can't see that changing because of CL qualification. We've been in knocking on the door of CL for years now so I'd say this is the next logical step. I want back in and I only see upsides.

 

[Pirate55]

The CL is the holy grail for us at the moment. Prestige, finance, ability to attract and retain players make it absolutely key. If we were offered it now, I would bite your hand off. It is the only thing that matters to a club like ours. Any chance we get, we have to go for it full tilt. All this bollox about preferring it next season or the season after is just nonsense.

We need to go out to win every game until the rest of the season and see where it takes us. To play Paulinho in a team with no discernable formation and then make lamentable subs was crazy. One point against Burnley was no good for us at this stage of the season. We should have gone all out for 3 even if it cost us a defeat. To dare is to do.

Completely unacceptable performance from the players and the coach. We need to up our game. No more turgid displays please.

 

[braineclipse]

That's a very short term approach.

What if the best thing for a strong run at 4th next season is playing "sub-optimal" players like at the weekend?

It may be we want to maximise transfer fees, that Poch wants to see how they fare outside of training, or maybe even that it's simply an example to the others that training well gets rewarded. It could also be any of a thousand other reasons why not going all out against Burnley is better for our longer term prospects.

I could very easily rephrase your statement as "Not putting the team in the best position to succeed next season shows the wrong mentality"

I agree to an extent at least.

If you look at teams that develop top players they often do so accepting at least some short term cost in terms of performance. Look at Barca, surely they could be a bit stronger at least some seasons, if they replaced one or two of their developing youngsters with established signings from elsewhere. In the past I think we would have been stronger with Corluka over Walker in Walker's first season back, but long term developing Walker was the right move.

We have the 'youngest team in Europe (tm)' and we'll hopefully and most likely see a benefit as these youngsters develop into better and more mature players.

However I don't think that guides Poch's team selections quite to the extent you seem to be saying scara.

nah, thats just silly. Even if we got battered, who cares because it would be a learning experience for the players. Kane, Bentaleb, Lloris, all the players, they want CL, its the top of the top, its where everyone wants to be.There is no perfect timing for these things, you have to grab the opportunity if and when it presents itself.

Its like how Kane, Mason, Bentaleb have performed this season. They have been thrown into the deep end, the PL which is one of the toughest leagues in the world, and they havent drowned, they have shown they can compete and flourish and im sure they and others we manage to attract on the back of qualifying for the CL would again go up a level and do well.

The extra income would be helpful, the prestige of being in the best competition would raise our profile again, no Thurs night EL games will be beneficial to our PL campaign, there is absolute no downside to qualifying for the CL next season

Agreed. Nothing like short term success to breed long term success. At some point at least the two have to walk hand in hand and getting short term success is never a bad thing.

Look at Liverpool, sure you could say that they weren't ready for CL football this season. But had Rodgers performed like he did this season or in his first season in the second season the pressure on him now would be much greater, I'm guessing they would be without one or two of their promising young players signed last summer, and they would overall be in a much weaker situation I think. Unless it's somehow a given that no CL this season would mean CL next season, which I don't think it is.