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Richarlison

Grays_1890 said:
I was wary of him but TBH his energy on Sunday if nothing else changed things up for us Sunday, maybe frenetic, maybe abit all over the place but at least it gave their defenders work to do, Kane was all abit one paced.

I think its going to work out just fine as long as people respect his role and don't try and compare his scoring stats to those of his time at Everton because its clear his role is going to be much different
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As long as players work hard and and play for the team, I won't be worried at all. That's what Conte had to fix when he first took over as the players weren't running hard under Nuno. Seeing it with United this season, they are fine to pick up their paychecks with no application at all during matches. Richarlison looks like a hard worker, someone who plays for the team. I think we've lost a bit of that with Kane and Son chasing individual honors... not to say that's inherently bad, they're both driven and hungry but I wish they were more unselfish especially with each other. Totally agree with your post, Richarlison definitely brought something to the team when he came on.
 
papaspur said:
As long as players work hard and and play for the team, I won't be worried at all. That's what Conte had to fix when he first took over as the players weren't running hard under Nuno. Seeing it with United this season, they are fine to pick up their paychecks with no application at all during matches. Richarlison looks like a hard worker, someone who plays for the team. I think we've lost a bit of that with Kane and Son chasing individual honors... not to say that's inherently bad, they're both driven and hungry but I wish they were more unselfish especially with each other. Totally agree with your post, Richarlison definitely brought something to the team when he came on.
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Yeah, if they weren't so selfish they'd probably have the record for the most assists between two players... oh wait...
 
DubSpur said:
Yeah, if they weren't so selfish they'd probably have the record for the most assists between two players... oh wait...
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Why so snarky? My point is that they've lost that a bit lately. I don't think anyone here is going to say Kane or Son are not important players for us. I know this is one example so slightly cherry-picking here, but in the Southampton game, Kane was wide-open on the right side of their box with Son trying to dribble through half their defense from the left. Son decides to shoot into the crowd of defenders.
I did say it's not always a bad thing for them to take shots on themselves because they're proven goal scorers and can make something from nothing, but there are moments when one could easily set up the other for a more clear-cut chance. Maybe I didn't articulate myself well enough but that's what's important to me: exploiting as much chaos as possible. Maybe I'm too harsh on Son like his father :D
 
papaspur said:
Why so snarky? My point is that they've lost that a bit lately. I don't think anyone here is going to say Kane or Son are not important players for us. I know this is one example so slightly cherry-picking here, but in the Southampton game, Kane was wide-open on the right side of their box with Son trying to dribble through half their defense from the left. Son decides to shoot into the crowd of defenders.
I did say it's not always a bad thing for them to take shots on themselves because they're proven goal scorers and can make something from nothing, but there are moments when one could easily set up the other for a more clear-cut chance. Maybe I didn't articulate myself well enough but that's what's important to me: exploiting as much chaos as possible. Maybe I'm too harsh on Son like his father :D
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It's a bit boring that everytime they have a bad game it's the same thing with the comments on here about they should've been sold or they're part of the reason we haven't won anything or they only care about records etc.
They're not going to get it right every single time with when to pass and when to shoot, but they do more often than just about anyone else. And as for lost it a bit lately, go check their stats for the second half of last season for goal involvement.
 
DubSpur said:
It's a bit boring that everytime they have a bad game it's the same thing with the comments on here about they should've been sold or they're part of the reason we haven't won anything or they only care about records etc.
They're not going to get it right every single time with when to pass and when to shoot, but they do more often than just about anyone else. And as for lost it a bit lately, go check their stats for the second half of last season for goal involvement.
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It's about playing for the team, so even if they have 0 assists or goals (not saying that was the case) but put in good effort, I'm happy. I shouldn't have to preface every post saying how much I love Kane and Son, I just ask them to do more because they can. Son's own father says he's not world-class after he won the golden boot. TBH, seems like you're taking the strawman out for a stroll. We're in the Richarlison thread and the main point is that there's a viable option now to compete with Kane/Son.
I would love to see the stats for a half of a season, where can I find that? Their numbers of the whole of last season are obviously good... again, I never said they were bad.
 
papaspur said:
It's about playing for the team, so even if they have 0 assists or goals (not saying that was the case) but put in good effort, I'm happy. I shouldn't have to preface every post saying how much I love Kane and Son, I just ask them to do more because they can. Son's own father says he's not world-class after he won the golden boot. TBH, seems like you're taking the strawman out for a stroll. We're in the Richarlison thread and the main point is that there's a viable option now to compete with Kane/Son.
I would love to see the stats for a half of a season, where can I find that? Their numbers of the whole of last season are obviously good... again, I never said they were bad.
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They're our 2 best players that we've heavily relied on for years. So when they don't have s good game spurs usually don't. So they get a lot of the blame.
We're now trying to get players that can take up some of the slack. We saw it against soton.
 
papaspur said:
It's about playing for the team, so even if they have 0 assists or goals (not saying that was the case) but put in good effort, I'm happy. I shouldn't have to preface every post saying how much I love Kane and Son, I just ask them to do more because they can. Son's own father says he's not world-class after he won the golden boot. TBH, seems like you're taking the strawman out for a stroll. We're in the Richarlison thread and the main point is that there's a viable option now to compete with Kane/Son.
I would love to see the stats for a half of a season, where can I find that? Their numbers of the whole of last season are obviously good... again, I never said they were bad.
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What strawman? You've stated that they've "lost that a bit lately", they haven't. Their stats, you only need to check 1 and 2 in these lists ;)
https://www.planetfootball.com/quic...rers-goalscorers-goals-2022-son-kane-ronaldo/
https://www.planetfootball.com/quic...-most-10-players-2022-kane-son-ronaldo-salah/

They play for the team as much if not more than anyone and as I said it's a bit boring that every time they have a poor game there is something thrown at them.
Kane has been our best player for almost 10 years now and at times I really don't think our fans deserve him.

As for Richarlison, I totally agree, it's great to have another option which should hopefully see Kane and Son get rested or taken off without a huge drop in quality.
 
Looking at the start and confidence Jesus got at Arse, I feel bad for Richy that he has to fight for a place, with the top class players we have up front. Hope he doesn't get demotivated and can be a team player. His attitude looks great, great if he keeps it up.
 
Lilbaz said:
They're our 2 best players that we've heavily relied on for years. So when they don't have s good game spurs usually don't. So they get a lot of the blame.
We're now trying to get players that can take up some of the slack. We saw it against soton.
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Its a team game, you win as a team, you lose as a team.
We got to a CL final without harry kane, we thumped Southampton last week with son and kane being under par.
There’s also been periods when one or the other has been out with injuries and we have coped.
But there's also been loads of times they've bailed us out, it is what it and thankfully we now have a manager and squad who can make the most of it and them.
I fear for us more after conte than i do after harry and son, and thats how it should be.
 
IulianSteaua said:
Looking at the start and confidence Jesus got at Arse, I feel bad for Richy that he has to fight for a place, with the top class players we have up front. Hope he doesn't get demotivated and can be a team player. His attitude looks great, great if he keeps it up.
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I don't, I think he will thrive on it, he's a fighter and will relish it.
He's not sitting on the bench mopping, he will be giving his all and challenging kane for his place. Thats a tall order not convinced he will do it but the competition can only make us better.
 
IulianSteaua said:
Looking at the start and confidence Jesus got at Arse, I feel bad for Richy that he has to fight for a place, with the top class players we have up front. Hope he doesn't get demotivated and can be a team player. His attitude looks great, great if he keeps it up.
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Jesus had a great start at city too
Didn’t help him
Although arsenal are different as they have no alternative
He will be a good signing for them and as good as they could get. I’d be surprised if he didn’t hit 20 plus goals for them

Rucharlison is whole different league of player. It’s well worth reading up on his back story to understand what he has come through to get where he has. His mentality is arguably unbreakable
 
LemonadeMoney said:
Kane or Son sitting on the bench for the odd game could have the same effect.
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Yes, the competition from him and kulu will hopefully help focus minds.
Kane and son have had it easy in many ways because there's never been any direct competition for their places, in no way their fault, but it must have an effect.
 
metalgear said:
I hope Conte just rotates the three of them regularly to keep opponents on their toes.

Sent from my SM-T865 using Fapatalk
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This; there's no point in spending big money to enlarge the squad if there is minimal rotation. I also don't want rotation for rotation sakes, but if a game is won by, say the 70th minute, then for the purposes of saving legs, getting players more used to our systems and feeling included, there should be subs including for Kane and Son.
 
DubSpur said:
What strawman? You've stated that they've "lost that a bit lately", they haven't. Their stats, you only need to check 1 and 2 in these lists ;)
https://www.planetfootball.com/quic...rers-goalscorers-goals-2022-son-kane-ronaldo/
https://www.planetfootball.com/quic...-most-10-players-2022-kane-son-ronaldo-salah/

They play for the team as much if not more than anyone and as I said it's a bit boring that every time they have a poor game there is something thrown at them.
Kane has been our best player for almost 10 years now and at times I really don't think our fans deserve him.

As for Richarlison, I totally agree, it's great to have another option which should hopefully see Kane and Son get rested or taken off without a huge drop in quality.
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Thanks for that, obviously their stats for the whole season were really good but those were the only ones I could find. My "lost that a bit lately" comment was a bit premature, felt like it dropped off slightly even though Son was white-hot at the end of last season. Seemed to me that the connection between the two wasn't as robust the past 5 matches or so.

https://www.infogol.net/en/player/harry-kane/4959
https://www.infogol.net/en/player/son-heung-min/2528

Just going from xG, you can say Son had a phenomenal season. Kane, on the other hand, didn't do badly but he scored fewer times than Son from a much greater number of shots.
Thing is, all the goals don't have to come from them, we have other providers now like Kulu and our WBs should be helping out in this department too. Anyway, it's going to be a busy season and the impact of playing CL matches again means we have to rotate.

glorygloryeze said:
This; there's no point in spending big money to enlarge the squad if there is minimal rotation. I also don't want rotation for rotation sakes, but if a game is won by, say the 70th minute, then for the purposes of saving legs, getting players more used to our systems and feeling included, there should be subs including for Kane and Son.
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Exactly this, with an already-cramped schedule pre-WC and the prospect of having to travel to our away CL games means the teams that have the strongest squads will benefit the most for this unique season IMO.
 
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