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Racism in football

milo said:
I agree. Do you think that it is particularly severe in Russia?
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It depends on which source you are reading. Western media will always make it worse than it actually is. If you speak to those who are studying there, they will tell you that the criminals are the main problem there, not the racists.
 
I have spent a considerable amount of time in Latvia close to Russia and the is a lot of racism there, they are far behind us in attitudes.
 
Spurs7891 said:
It depends on which source you are reading. Western media will always make it worse than it actually is. If you speak to those who are studying there, they will tell you that the criminals are the main problem there, not the racists.
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I'm asking for your opinion rather than about sources because you are always very quick to dismiss this. Do you think that Russia has a problem with racist behaviour from their football fans and do you think that the Russian football authorities treat any issues that do arise appropriately?
 
milo said:
I'm asking for your opinion rather than about sources because you are always very quick to dismiss this. Do you think that Russia has a problem with racist behaviour from their football fans and do you think that the Russian football authorities treat any issues that do arise appropriately?
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As I said, all the countries have racism problem, including Russia. But unlike Western countries like US, UK and France, Russia don't have much experience in dealing with racism especially regarding blacks. When you have countries like US and UK still struggling to overcome racism despite having black population for over 100 years, it is not surprising that countries which don't have many black population struggling to deal with it as well.
 
http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/34297056
2018 World Cup: Racism 'does not exist' in Russia
Racism "does not exist" in 2018 World Cup host nation Russia, says former national captain Alexei Smertin.

He claimed that racism was a recent import from overseas despite simultaneously explaining that incidents had happened in the past.

Smertin went on to dismiss behaviour that many might consider racist as "fun".

"Racism in Russia is like fashion. It comes from abroad, from different countries," he said.

"It was never, ever here before. Ten years ago, some fans may have given a banana to black guys - it was just for fun.

"I think the media is making the wrong image of Russia."


:eek:
 
Unbelievable, that is inexcusable from Smertin. Amazing how money corrupts. These are not the words of a man with a clean conscience.
 
Bullet said:
Unbelievable, that is inexcusable from Smertin. Amazing how money corrupts. These are not the words of a man with a clean conscience.
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the words of a man with as much tundra as he can shake a stick at and a cosy admin job for an energy company till the end of his days

either that or Putin has his family in a gulag
 
Bullet said:
Unbelievable, that is inexcusable from Smertin. Amazing how money corrupts. These are not the words of a man with a clean conscience.
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disagree. these are just the words of a man (and a society) who doesnt fully understand the nuances of racism.

most people in england have a good understanding of why racism is such a big issue. its understandable that in a homogenous society like russia, they may not understand this so well.

in england, other forms of persecution/discrimination (such as sexism) are not treated as seriously as racism. every culture has their own faults. i think in england, we are too quick to play the holier than thou card on issues of discrimination
 
scaramanga said:
Sounds like the kind of nonsense a woman would come out with
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mourinho has been accused of sexist comments recently (in the papers). imagine if this was racism instead. how big would the controversy be? in england, because of our cultural history, racism is a bigger issue than other forms of discrimination. thats why so many foreign people and players get caught out by this. because in their culture racism is simply just another form of discrimination.

i listened to that smertin interview, and its unfair to make judgements on him from that. his english is not good and he was unable to word his opinions as he wouldve liked. which he pointed out on numerous occasions whilst discussing issues on racism.
 
Neymar said:
mourinho has been accused of sexist comments recently (in the papers). imagine if this was racism instead. how big would the controversy be? in england, because of our cultural history, racism is a bigger issue than other forms of discrimination. thats why so many foreign people and players get caught out by this. because in their culture racism is simply just another form of discrimination.

i listened to that smertin interview, and its unfair to make judgements on him from that. his english is not good and he was unable to word his opinions as he wouldve liked. which he pointed out on numerous occasions whilst discussing issues on racism.
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Then it is his fault for engaging in such a sensitive topic if he's not comfortable. The fact is that he has been to the UK and played in either France or the UK for a period of 8 years, so should know just how sensitive a topic it is, and that any mention of giving bananas to a player is not going to go down well.

I'm shocked that this sort of comment has not been given far more prominence in the media. It is completely outrageous and in my mind goes to show just how ingrained racism is in Russia. Absolving them of any responsibility because they have not had to deal with racism themselves is stupid. They have the internet, they and their players have been involved in multinational tournaments before, they will have seen what happened in South Africa and in the US and it is simply not acceptable.

You say sexism is not being treated seriously here and I say gonad*s. The reason why the Eva story has been rumbling on is just proving that it is being taken seriously. Look at women's football, look at female athletes in general. Yes it is not where it should be, but things are being done about it.
 
Gazzasrightboot said:
Then it is his fault for engaging in such a sensitive topic if he's not comfortable. The fact is that he has been to the UK and played in either France or the UK for a period of 8 years, so should know just how sensitive a topic it is, and that any mention of giving bananas to a player is not going to go down well.
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disagree. he is well within his rights to discuss a topic such as this. he was trying to be very careful with his words, and made it clear that he wasnt able to illustrate his thoughts well. when the interviewer re-interpretted smertins words a few times, to which smertin said that the interviewer's interpretation was "much better", smertin's views do not sound anywhere near as controversial as the bbc have made out. the bbc should be embarrased with their standards of journalism in this case.

smertin is a public figure (relatively), and people like him need to speak out so society as a whole can progress together on controversial topics such as racism.
Gazzasrightboot said:
I'm shocked that this sort of comment has not been given far more prominence in the media. It is completely outrageous and in my mind goes to show just how ingrained racism is in Russia.
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its not been given more prominence, because its not really what smertin said.
Gazzasrightboot said:
Absolving them of any responsibility because they have not had to deal with racism themselves is stupid. They have the internet, they and their players have been involved in multinational tournaments before, they will have seen what happened in South Africa and in the US and it is simply not acceptable.
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we have the internet too. but for some reason we dont oppose all forms of abuse/discrimination with the same intensity. moral compasses are very complex things, and i think sometimes we (in england) are very ethnocentric in these matters. we seem to think we have a monopoly on ethics and morals.
Gazzasrightboot said:
You say sexism is not being treated seriously here and I say cobblers. The reason why the Eva story has been rumbling on is just proving that it is being taken seriously. Look at women's football, look at female athletes in general. Yes it is not where it should be, but things are being done about it.
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i accept that eva's story is bigger (than otherwise) because she is a woman. but the story is still largely revolving around the touchline spat and whether she should or should not have treated hazard. the accusations of sexist language by mourinho is a side thought. had this been a black physio accusing mourinho of racism, the issue would be a whole lot bigger imo.
 
Neymar said:
disagree. he is well within his rights to discuss a topic such as this. he was trying to be very careful with his words, and made it clear that he wasnt able to illustrate his thoughts well. when the interviewer re-interpretted smertins words a few times, to which smertin said that the interviewer's interpretation was "much better", smertin's views do not sound anywhere near as controversial as the bbc have made out. the bbc should be embarrased with their standards of journalism in this case.
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I think that is a very strange interpretation of the interview.

I would be interested in what other people think after listening to it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p032rj6z/player
 
from listening to the interview, imo smertin was trying to say that rather than a deep rooted culture of racism, a minority of fans in russia are using racist abuse as a vehicle to put off opposition players (having seen this "fashion" become popular throughout global football).

did you get a different impression?
 
Neymar said:
from listening to the interview, imo smertin was trying to say that rather than a deep rooted culture of racism, a minority of fans in russia are using racist abuse as a vehicle to put off opposition players (having seen this "fashion" become popular throughout global football).

did you get a different impression?
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No. I think that he said that racism was not a problem in Russia and that it was something that comes from overseas. He also says that there is no harm in throwing (giving :confused:) bananas at black players.
 
milo said:
No. I think that he said that racism was not a problem in Russia and that it was something that comes from overseas. He also says that there is no harm in throwing (giving :confused:) bananas at black players.
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yes but when the interviewer rephrases his thoughts, he reaffirms that the interviewer phrases his thoughts much better. smertin's english vocabulary is clearly very limited. smertin obviously wants the interviewers interpretation of his thoughts to take precedence over how he himself has phrased his thoughts. in this case, we should quite clearly be using the rephrased words as smertin's own.
 
smertin doesnt even realise how controversial his own words would sound to an english speaking audience. similar to the kouma incident last week.

if smertin knew, he obviously wouldnt have done the interview imo. the problem is, when the english audience slate him, unneccesary divisions are created. and it doesnt help at all in terms of resolving the issue of racism and other forms of discrimination. when at the end of the day, both ourselves and smertin probably want the same thing in terms of eliminating racism
 
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