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Politics, politics, politics part deux

Discussion in 'Randomination' started by SpurMeUp, 19 Feb 2019.

  1. r-u-s-x

    r-u-s-x Ruel Fox

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    Its not Tokenism in this case its an indication (one of many) that shows we lag Europe on green issues rather than being held back. See also land fill and renewable energy. To say we are held back from being more green by the EU is false.

    We may be held back from carrying out your suggested solution (localism / de-growth etc.) but this is not what the UK would be doing outside the EU.
     
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  2. the dza

    the dza Christian Ziege

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    I don't agree with all this throwing milkshakes business that's been happening lately, even if the targets are tw@ts. There's a danger it could escalate to something more serious. In the case of the youtube edgelords, it only plays into their victim-meteorology free speech martyrdom.

    Wasn't long ago that a guy smacked Corbyn in the head with an egg in his hand (different from just throwing it imo, basically trying to get away with punching someone in the head). I think the old bill should at least be giving a slap on the wrist to the milkshake lobbers to discourage it.
     
  3. Gutter Boy

    Gutter Boy Tim Sherwood

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    Egging a politician or equivalent is an ancient right of protest. The suffragettes used to use flour. It's going way too authoritarian to try and suppress that right.

    But equally important is to preserve the politician's right to respond with a Prescott.
     
  4. the dza

    the dza Christian Ziege

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    In ordinary times, I might agree. But with social media and the general toxicity of politics at the minute, I think things being calm should be encouraged. We had a crank locked up just the other day for plotting to murder a Labour MP. I know throwing a milkshake isn't the equivalent, but it's a worry that someone escalates it imo.
     
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  5. Gutter Boy

    Gutter Boy Tim Sherwood

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    Those times are only created by people being cowed by the fear. It's the whole MO of authoritarianism. Respond with a bit of whimsy instead and the situation deescalates. Get a youtube video of the 10 greatest eggings in history, backed by the Benny Hill music, going viral, and the world becomes a better place.
     
  6. AuroRaman

    AuroRaman Young-Pyo Lee

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    monkeybarry likes this.
  7. Rorschach

    Rorschach Erik Thorstvedt

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    Brexit is isolationism. The UK greens are pro-EU much as it annoys you, and they've moved this way because of simple pragmatism. The scale of the climate challenge will not be solved by individuals or even isolated governments. We are facing an existential problem that requires our full attention and frankly I see Brexit as a distraction from these more important discussions.

    As for the desire for local enterprise, local food production, increased self-reliance, reduced consumerism, and frankly any other environmental policy you can throw on the table, I'm fully on board. I'm glad that you see yourself as a green, I am too. But it is a bigger picture thing for me at this point. I view everything now through the eyes of my children.

    Edit: I'm all in on this... https://www.gndforeurope.com/faq
     
    Last edited: 20 May 2019
  8. SpurMeUp

    SpurMeUp Chris Perry

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    @ShipOfGoldblum, Milo and anyone, presuming you're not voting the brexit party, who should one vote for on Thursday? Green, Lib Dem, Change UK, or Labour?
     
  9. nayimfromthehalfwayline

    nayimfromthehalfwayline Ian Walker

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    Why is it isolationism?
     
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  10. ShipOfTheseus

    ShipOfTheseus Neil Sullivan

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    Lib Dem if you’re in London. The D’Hondt system means that the largest party to which you are broadly sympathetic can make best use of your vote, and it’s sadly clear that the Tiggers fudged their launch to the extent that LDs are the best alternative. And they deserve support for adopting the “gonad*s to Brexit” slogan. If you’re in Wales or Scotland, much tougher, as the leading remainists are also dodgy nationalists on their own parochial terms.

    Labour is not a Remain party, not while Karie Murphy and Seamus Milne are the Rasputins whispering in the leader’s ear. And a Green vote is misinterpretable.
     
  11. DTA

    DTA Steed Malbranque

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    It's either isolationism or deregulation, if you want something in the middle that's called being a member of the EU.
     
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  12. nayimfromthehalfwayline

    nayimfromthehalfwayline Ian Walker

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    Why not simply "independence".

    What is it in not wanting to be part of a larger legal governance, to write your own rules, means we are being "isolationist"?

    I do not see the correlation at all.

    There is nothing to stop us being cooperative and outward facing as an independent nation. Nothing to stop us being involved on the world stage.

    We dont need to be a part of the EU for those things to happen.
     
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  13. SpurMeUp

    SpurMeUp Chris Perry

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    There is nothing to stop us now either. What would you say is stopping us in the EU?

    The point is within the EU we have a structure to cooperate with our neighbours and the world beyond. How would you organise such inter-nation cooperation better? Your logic doesn't hold together. Brexit sold an emotion "The UK taking control" problem is we never lost control. So there is almost nothing that can be delivered (nothing of value to the UK but there are significant loses to the UK from leaving. Almost no gains, lots of losses). Brexit is a sham.
     
    Last edited: 21 May 2019
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  14. DTA

    DTA Steed Malbranque

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    Yeah we have been through this before. As soon as you sign a trade deal, you lose 'independance'... It really is a flimflam term within the context of Brexit, as we either have it already within the EU, or don't but will lose it as soon as we sign a trade deal.

    Like with a lot of what Brexit is about, sounds great, but is not based in reality.
     
  15. Gilzeantoscore

    Gilzeantoscore Ruel Fox

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    Ha,ha Farage, he's a crook, milking thousands of pounds from his position in Europe and yet people still support him. Post intellect politics!
     
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  16. parklane1

    parklane1 Andy Thompson

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    I think you can say the same for any of the arseholes that are in Parliment at the moment ( i know Farage is not) they are all a lot of self serving tacos.
     
  17. nayimfromthehalfwayline

    nayimfromthehalfwayline Ian Walker

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    None of which actually addresses the point being made.

    What about Brexit is "isolationist" exactly?
     
  18. nayimfromthehalfwayline

    nayimfromthehalfwayline Ian Walker

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    Theresa May says MPs will get vote on whether to hold another referendum if they back EU Withdrawal Agreement Bill
     
  19. Gutter Boy

    Gutter Boy Tim Sherwood

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    I do wonder if she has medically lost the plot. She's so out of touch with reality, it's almost cruel to watch. She just needs to go now and let a new PM restart negotiations with the EU asap.
     
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  20. SpurMeUp

    SpurMeUp Chris Perry

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    Maybe the Directors of British Steel and Jamie's Italian don't know what they are talking about, but both named Brexit as a factor in them closing. Extra 20% costs for Jamies food imports, and potential future tarrifs affecting steel orders. I'm sure there are other reasons too, but economics is rarely simple cause and effect. There are always many variabes, and Brexit will slowely and consistently degrade our economy. What a terrible waste of time. I hope we don't spend more wasteful years pursuing this myth and losing jobs and wealth in the UK.
     
    Last edited: 21 May 2019
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