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***OMT***Tottenham Hotspur FC v West Ham

Discussion in 'Spurs News & Views' started by thfcsteff, 16 Dec 2013.

  1. Pirate55

    Pirate55 The Last Man Standing 17/18

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    Agree 100%. It was the right approach for West Ham at home. Most times we would have won that game playing like that. However, it would not be the right approach for Soton away. Horses for courses.
     
  2. scaramanga

    scaramanga Mel Hopkins Staff Member

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    In all likelihood that's because Inter were most vulnerable at the start of the match.

    The reason those other teams can do this more often is that they are not only more comfortable keeping the ball to keep a lead than we are (due to settled systems, better players, etc) but they haven't had the player upheaval we have and therefore have the option of picking locks that we can't.

    I'd also be very surprised if any of those teams went out against an Allardyce team (very organised defenders, high levels of concentration/fitness/strength) at 100mph - there are some teams you can do that against, but last night's wasn't one of them.
     
  3. scaramanga

    scaramanga Mel Hopkins Staff Member

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    I agree with what you're saying there, but as I have alluded to in my reply to Pirate, I think our midfielders/forwards need a better understanding first - which is why it hasn't really worked so far.

    Teams know (much like Liverpool) that we don't have a level of understanding where we can play the ball around quickly yet - put us under heavy pressure and we'll lose the ball. I think that given time our player would have gained that understanding that would allow us to expend a lot of energy first and then recover later.

    Currently, if we expend energy first we're unlikely to keep the ball long enough to recover.
     
  4. braineclipse

    braineclipse Gary Stevens

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    I think West Ham would have been able to put us under pressure regardless of how we'd taken the lead. Going for an early goal and then try to get another makes sense to me. We were weak at the back and stronger in attack.
     
  5. thfcsteff

    thfcsteff Willie Hall

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    Pirate, mate...Sherwood doesn't have a scooby!
     
  6. thfcsteff

    thfcsteff Willie Hall

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    Well said...I think what galled me the most last night was how 'thick' our performance was. Brainless really. No strategy beyond the obvious. Harry got away with it because h had Modric, Bale and sometimes (when he could be arsed) VdV...
     
  7. 90291Spur

    90291Spur Christian Ziege

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    And Fat Sam had a nice dig at Sherwood when he said he expected us to defend the lead but that when he saw us going for the second he exploited the gaps, oh, and the fact that Vlad isn't match fit, Capoue is a midfielder playing at CB and Fryers is a novice at this level.
     
  8. Pirate55

    Pirate55 The Last Man Standing 17/18

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    You may well be right Steff, but too early to judge at the mo. IMO
     
  9. Kingdawson

    Kingdawson Banned

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    4th,5th,4th = "Getting away with it"

    CL quarter final = "getting away with it"
     
  10. Nigeyman

    Nigeyman Chris Armstrong

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    What do you think this is fking hide and seek
    Harry's achievements were very good....and I think without the england distraction we were just about there with a decent striker which needed purchasing.....

    defo not a case of him getting away with anything.....

    either way hope regular defeats to spam is not something we have to get used to.....
     
  11. SteveAWOL

    SteveAWOL Andy Thompson

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    Well it's been almost half a century since the Spammers last won back to back games at WHL so hopefully I won't ever witness such a shameful set of results again [-o<

    Twitter / ESPNFC: For the first time since 1966, West Ham has won back to back games at White Hart Lane. Spurs showed promise but will need to step up soon.
     
  12. thfcsteff

    thfcsteff Willie Hall

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    http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/news/Harry-Redknapp-denies-England-talk-has-distracted-Tottenham-article874574.html

    http://www.theguardian.com/football/2012/apr/13/harry-redknapp-england-spurs-chelsea

    http://metro.co.uk/2012/03/23/harry-redknapp-spurs-players-dont-care-whether-i-take-england-job-372031/

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/tottenham-hotspur/9312723/Harry-Redknapp-warns-Spurs-of-dressing-room-unrest-if-they-delay-offering-him-a-new-contract.html

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/harry-redknapp-fresh-blast-fa-2346158

    He has only himself to blame.
    4th, 5th, 4th whatever…he disengaged, and yakked, himself out of a job. I really wish people could at least give that particular opinion the credence it UNDENIABLY deserves. It's not about agreeing or disagreeing, that's a personal prerogative, it's about seeing the situation as it actually played out.
    The above are just a smattering of the stories out there which can be read.

    Harry is not a hero…IMO.
     
  13. unit kaboom

    unit kaboom Kevin Dearden

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  14. Nigeyman

    Nigeyman Chris Armstrong

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    What do you think this is fking hide and seek
    yep to be fair steff I was gonna ask you that to.....
     
  15. SteveAWOL

    SteveAWOL Andy Thompson

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    I thought the reason for that disastrous run of form was because Redknapp had made the players expend too much energy in the first half of the season thrashing teams they should have beaten in a more efficient manner :-"

    Harry was an utter **** for shamelessly getting his tabloid mates to campaign on his behalf for the England job but we played some great football and enjoyed the most glorious spell in decades, we might've got a couple more points last season but ultimately the wide boy was the only one who could wheeler-dealer us a spot in the Top 4 plus some Champion League football.
     
  16. thfcsteff

    thfcsteff Willie Hall

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    First off, I agree. Harry had some great times and gave me some too. As I've said countless times mate, my biggest gripes with him are

    a) he could've gone all the way had he focussed 100%
    b) he bull****ted us
    c) two years in a row, he was teflon here for a while
    d) his failure to fully focus broke my Spurs heart because he could've done it!

    I just like to offer the counter view when it comes to the statement of his achievements versus his dismissal. He did some good stuff but he equally did some poor stuff too IMO and we shouldn't forget EITHER.

    Sherwood...

    It's a fair question mate, and I suppose it's born partially out of suspicion and partially out of opinion (which is, I agree, a dangerous mix)…I've long heard of Sherwood's 'respect' within certain areas of the club and his growing profile/power base as such. I personally don't like the way in which he appears to operate (his comments about Hoddle a decade ago being chief among the examples) and on a personal level, I fail to see what credentials he holds which warrant the level of respect within the club he appears to hold. I know he has badges, and I know he and Ramsey have run the youth set-up, but I think it's fair to say that Alex Inglethorpe was doing a stand-up job for us with regards to developing some fine next-gen players. I'd love to know why he sprinted to Liverpool and why we couldn't keep him.

    I cannot forget Sherwood constantly giving us a kicking whenever possible as he performed his Setanta pundit duties too…he made Paul Walsh seem like Stevie P! He was even at it whilst still with us as a player.

    http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11675_2241748,00.html


    I was heartily unimpressed by what he did the other night. I cannot believe that any coach who has aspirations of being a great manager would, in two days, thrust an ENTIRELY new system of play upon players for 90 MINUTES. I understand he wanted a bit more of the, err, 'up and at 'em' approach, but IF the entire squad has been conditioned for a marathon and not a sprint, I think it's fair to ask why he went 180 degrees? Why, when we went 1-0 up and he saw the creaking, did he not adapt his gameplan as such? Why did he not instruct the players to do what they are currently more used to doing? Why did he not bring on an extra midfielder or defender to offer some stodge and support to an ailing defence? And why did Defoe spend the final 20 minutes of the game drifting to the left and leaving us with no viable option upfront? His post-match comments were exceedingly worrying for a man who is supposed to be vying for one of the top jobs in football AND who has a pole position. He offered next to no clear reasoning behind what had happened, other than to sound like a poor coach from Hackney Marshes, and when asked the invasive question as to whether he would be in charge on Sunday, instead of a firm but friendly 'no comment' he proceeded to make us look Mickey Mouse (which might be the case right now but you hardly want the world receiving further confirmation!!!)…

    I absolutely, whole-heartedly hold my hands up and say there is simply something about this guy that doesn't feel right to me personally. he came back here in what, 2008? And he's got how much power? What's he done to merit it? And what did he do Wednesday to showcase himself?

    As I did mention elsewhere, I support my team and as such, I support him and hope the very, very best for him because, well, he's in charge right now.But yeah, i do not like him, for reasons and impressions that might (or might not!) be a fair reflection of who he is.

    That's as honest (and comprehensive) an answer as I can offer mate…interested to hear other opinions. If there are a few more, i will move this post (and those subsequent) to the Sherwood thread. Cheers chaps! Steff
     
  17. thfcsteff

    thfcsteff Willie Hall

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    Right Steve, again, no argument on SOME of what he did (let's remember he had some exceptional players and no distractions that season) but I think it's important to note principle here. He simply showed none when it came to the facts. Personally, I don't think a football club can have a guy like that around even if he's winning everything, because it's just wrong.
     
  18. AuroRaman

    AuroRaman Mitchell Thomas

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  19. unit kaboom

    unit kaboom Kevin Dearden

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    Thanks for the honest response mate.

    I do agree about redknapp, i just find it crazy that some people on here can bash him so much, as if they didn't watch the football we were playing at times under him or saw the positions we finished.

    Re Sherwood if I'm honest I've never really warmed to him either however some of the rubbish I've heard spoken about him on here seems completely over the top. Although not one of the worst, you have written opinions about him on here as if you knew a lot more about him then you are now stating you do, this is always dangerous in my opinion.
    He certainly made some basic errors vs west ham but honestly the gambles he took on winning that game were ones MANY managers would have made, we would have won it 9 times out of 10. I was there with my brother and we really were so comfy until the last 10, there was a buzz in the stands at half time even though we were yet to score because we came out and tried to play….it was a one off cup game and we treated it as such, if sherwoods tactics were the same on sunday i would understand more what you are saying.

    I will be amazed if Levy trusts this expensively assembled squad in the hands of a novice for any real period of time, but in the meantime the vitriol and accusations are simply not needed and are unhelpful. we've had it from sections while harry was in charge, then again under AVB, now your self and gutter boy and others seem to be leading another witch hunt against sherwood….There is such negativity around the club I'm not sure how people expect it to come out the other side at present.
     
  20. Hootnow

    Hootnow Jermaine Jenas

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    Steff mate, I completely agree with you. I wanted Redknapp to go in the end and not because of footballing reasons.

    However, I wouldn't say the two are mutually exclusive. I think there has been a bit of a drive recently by those who most disliked Redknapp to discredit his performance as our manager. He was lucky, scraped by, doing the bare minimum (as if our recent past has been scattered with 4th and 5th place finishes. It i also easy to forget that though we didn't win a trophy under him, we came close multiple times. We played good football. He played players in their actual position, rather than the crap Ramos was serving up. He allowed Modric to settle in well and changed how we played based on resources available. AVB gets a lot of credit for Bale's improvement, despite the fact that Redknapp also brought Bale forwards leaps and bounds.

    All this doesn't also mean that Redknap's conduct from when Capello was fired was disgraceful. He effectively treated it as a long interview and trial period for the England job. For most people, this would mean doing the best job you could do for your club and then gracefully taking the job at the end of the season. Instead, he took his eyes off the ball and started making comments that indicated that he was already thinking like the England manager. When you fob us off like that and then expect a contract renewal? Sorry Harry, you got to go, regardless of whether AVB was the right choice to replace.

    So in my view, he was a great manager for us, who achieved well above and beyond what anyone imagined he ever would. But that doesn't also mean he's not a dingdong who deserved to be moved on after how he acted.
     
    Last edited: 20 Dec 2013

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