Nabil Bentaleb

[africanspurs]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

Capoue had already earned that place in the squad - don't you think that most players would feel hard done by to lose that place to someone because the boss knows them better?

this isnt a popularity contest though, its a big chair..big decsions. professionals should know this even though i understand they would feel hard done by. but in takeover if the buying body brings it people in and they have a project they need doing asap.....are they going to be like...

"you there, citizen X. i dont know you or what you are able to do well enough, but i am trusting you with this HUGE project of immense proportions for which my ass is on the line. There i hope this has made you happy today"

Tim sherwood actually gets points for me for doing the most intelligent and sensible thing in that scenario, a move that was very bold and brave but took the stuff of steel guts and nothing to lose attitude to make the right call.

put the guy on that he knows and trusts to get the job done

 

[africanspurs]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

It's not about putting in a player - if you listen to any player talk they'll treat a squad place as their to lose and if they perform, they don't expect to lose it.

Until NBD knows more about Capoue I think Capoue has every reason to feel hard done by.

LOL

you still havent answered the question.

why do you keep doing that :lol: , you've done that one quite a few points we have discussed recently

i'm going to harp on about it until you tell me that you are voting yes to entrusting a mission of high importance to someone that you dont know and you dont have enough trust in

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

LOL

you still havent answered the question.

why do you keep doing that :lol: , you've done that one quite a few points we have discussed recently

i'm going to harp on about it until you tell me that you are voting yes to entrusting a mission of high importance to someone that you dont know and you dont have enough trust in

If that person is the one who has been regularly doing that job (or in this case, first choice stand-in) then, yes. I would allow them to continue until they prove otherwise.

Your analogy isn't really relevant as we promoted from within (apparently this allows for continuity) rather than a takeover happening.

 

[africanspurs]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

If that person is the one who has been regularly doing that job (or in this case, first choice stand-in) then, yes. I would allow them to continue until they prove otherwise.

Your analogy isn't really relevant as we promoted from within (apparently this allows for continuity) rather than a takeover happening.

but it is relevant in the sense that he doesnt know the quantity of a player, if you assume you last sentence then what that means is that he KNOWS BOTH players and STILL made the right decision for that game.

Thats the main benefit of promoting from within and having continuity if thats the line you want to take. He definately made the right decision in that context...

..no what you need is to have the continuity factor broken or diluted enough so that his comment stands "didnt know him well enough" so that you can say he made the wrong decision to not play someone BECAUSE he doesnt know them

you problem is the reason he didnt play capoue...not the fact he didnt play him.

I am satisfied now....you've answered the question

so if a manager.......

Doesn't know a player well enough, but is getting to know them better
Doesn't fully trust the player yet
Has a task that needs to be carried out that is exteremly important
Has a player that he has known for years
A player whose ability he has personally assessed infinitely more than the player he doesn't know OR trust
A player he has worked with for years and trusts
A player he has faith in

the decision , which helps you qualify our managers name NBD btw, that is so wrong its worrying to you....is the decision to go with the informed solution that he has assessed and thought about as opposed to ignoring all the information he has and instead going with the one that he has little clue about and cant quantify future events

i disagree strongly

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

but it is relevant in the sense that he doesnt know the quantity of a player, if you assume you last sentence then what that means is that he KNOWS BOTH players and STILL made the right decision for that game.

Thats the main benefit of promoting from within and having continuity if thats the line you want to take. He definately made the right decision in that context...

..no what you need is to have the continuity factor broken or diluted enough so that his comment stands "didnt know him well enough" so that you can say he made the wrong decision to not play someone BECAUSE he doesnt know them

you problem is the reason he didnt play capoue...not the fact he didnt play him.

I am satisfied now....you've answered the question

so if a manager.......

Doesn't know a player well enough, but is getting to know them better
Doesn't fully trust the player yet
Has a task that needs to be carried out that is exteremly important
Has a player that he has known for years
A player whose ability he has personally assessed infinitely more than the player he doesn't know OR trust
A player he has worked with for years and trusts
A player he has faith in

the decision , which helps you qualify our managers name NBD btw, that is so wrong its worrying to you....is the decision to go with the informed solution that he has assessed and thought about as opposed to ignoring all the information he has and instead going with the one that he has little clue about and cant quantify future events

i disagree strongly

I can see where you're going with that, but I think your scope is too small.

It's not about choosing the player that gets the result in a single match, it's about making decisions that get the team playing to their best as a whole.

I wouldn't put much effort into a job knowing that my performance was irrelevant to keeping that job if my boss had a mate who wanted it.

You're looking at a single decision to try and win a single match, I'm looking at what that decision does to the whole team over the longer term.

 

[africanspurs]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

I can see where you're going with that, but I think your scope is too small.

It's not about choosing the player that gets the result in a single match, it's about making decisions that get the team playing to their best as a whole.

I wouldn't put much effort into a job knowing that my performance was irrelevant to keeping that job if my boss had a mate who wanted it.

You're looking at a single decision to try and win a single match, I'm looking at what that decision does to the whole team over the longer term.

am not talking about long term and i suspect neither were you. if indeed you were talking long term then you would need to have a rough idea whats going to happen in the future

at this moment in time, considering he played capoue already midweek...you cant possibly know that the decision to play bentaleb will have a long term impact on the squad.

the point at which you will know is when you have more information to play with..if in the next say, lets even give you a bone with this example, TWO games....bentaleb is favoured to both holtby and capoue...then i would say that you have grounds to worry to an extent.....but sherwood was in that job less than a week over 180 minutes picked his boy for like 20 mins of that

wouldnt it be best to give it time before saying that decision was wrong? cause if its alright to judge on the one decision then you made that judgement on that one isolated case and grew that into an issue

this is a "in hindsight" scenario i think.

(i'm still amazed you would think its the wrong decision to go with the familiar / assessed and known quantity)

 

[Kingdawson]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

Playing Bentaleb turned out to be a good thing. Not playing Capoue because he's never met him is a bad thing.

NBD got the right end result by failing to do something he should have done.

That's not a good decision, that's a bad decision lucking into the right result.

He said he knew Bentaleb more than Capoue..that's it.

 

[P.D.]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

I see your point but I'm not enthused about just producing youth players just so we can flog them. At the end of the day you want all of them to have been trained to a high enough standard to play for us and to have the ability to push on further with senior team experience. The youth players will always care more than any marquee signing about our club, probably the closest you can get to having a fan playing.

I watched some of the game again last night, and without getting ahead of myself I do think the lad will only get better with the right players around him. He has the physique to do the physical game, but he also has good movement and a willingness to show for a pass that is very good for a 19 year old. Our academy has produced a player with the basic tools to play at a high level, it's down to the player to push on, but we should be supportive all the way. The lad will make mistakes but that's part and parcel of the game at his age.

I'm not saying sell all players that come through, I'm saying that if we have ones that we know aren't going to make it but are still of a decent standard then we should look to give them some experience where possible so that we can make the call for ourselves and if they don't make it still get decent money for them rather than casting them adrift aged 22/23 when we have no use for them anymore.

Of course if players come through showing genuine talent then they should be kept, I would far rather a homegrown player in the side than an expensive foreigner, home grown players will always have a bit more affinity for the club.

 

[Modric THFC]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

Sherwood started Capoue against West Ham and he cost him the game. You can see why he trusted Bentalab over him.

 

[africanspurs]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

Sherwood started Capoue against West Ham and he cost him the game. You can see why he trusted Bentalab over him.

eh?

where did that come from? Capoue didnt cost us that game. you act like we were not in a precarious situation for most of that match.

that line up was begging for midfield runners to batter the defensive line

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

am not talking about long term and i suspect neither were you. if indeed you were talking long term then you would need to have a rough idea whats going to happen in the future

at this moment in time, considering he played capoue already midweek...you cant possibly know that the decision to play bentaleb will have a long term impact on the squad.

the point at which you will know is when you have more information to play with..if in the next say, lets even give you a bone with this example, TWO games....bentaleb is favoured to both holtby and capoue...then i would say that you have grounds to worry to an extent.....but sherwood was in that job less than a week over 180 minutes picked his boy for like 20 mins of that

wouldnt it be best to give it time before saying that decision was wrong? cause if its alright to judge on the one decision then you made that judgement on that one isolated case and grew that into an issue

this is a "in hindsight" scenario i think.

(i'm still amazed you would think its the wrong decision to go with the familiar / assessed and known quantity)

I don't think it was a wrong decision, it was just made for the wrong reasons. As it turned out, Bentaleb played well and Capoue doesn't seem to have complained. But, that correctness can only be applied in hindsight. I still think the right thing to do is to allow a player who's been performing well to keep his place.

 

[Modric THFC]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

eh?

where did that come from? Capoue didnt cost us that game. you act like we were not in a precarious situation for most of that match.

that line up was begging for midfield runners to batter the defensive line

Capoue and Chiriches inability to head a football cost us the game. If two league two centre half's were playing instead of them we would have won the game.

 

[Modric THFC]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

I don't think it was a wrong decision, it was just made for the wrong reasons. As it turned out, Bentaleb played well and Capoue doesn't seem to have complained. But, that correctness can only be applied in hindsight. I still think the right thing to do is to allow a player who's been performing well to keep his place.

When was that? At the start of the season?

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

When was that? At the start of the season?

Every time he's been called upon. Clearly in training too as he keeps making the squad.

 

[the dza]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

He played poorly against West Ham, Sherwood's first game in charge. So perhaps that had a bearing on his decision. But Chiriches was also poor, yet he started (and was poor again) v Southampton. We have limited options at centre-half right now though.

But it's not just about Capoue is it? Bentaleb clearly deserved a chance to play, he showed that by handling himself brilliantly when he came on.

Why is it that some of our fans have to find a problem where there isn't one? We should be happy that we have a coach who is very knowledgeable of our young players, so much so that he can make the decision to bring them on at key moments of a game and have it work well.

 

[Pandy]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

I don't think it was a wrong decision, it was just made for the wrong reasons. As it turned out, Bentaleb played well and Capoue doesn't seem to have complained. But, that correctness can only be applied in hindsight. I still think the right thing to do is to allow a player who's been performing well to keep his place.

How do you ever blood young players then? Wait for dips in form? By the time the requisite player loses form, the team might be playing very poorly which would be an acidic atmosphere to throw a kid in for his debut. Moreover, we are well stocked in CM, so Bentaleb by your logic would not get a game until every one of our CMs was injured/out of form/ out on loan.

This is the reason few youth team players make it in this league... I am having some serious de ja vu here. It's going to be the Redknapp hate all over again with some posters. Thank GHod Parker left!

 

[Pandy]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

He played poorly against West Ham, Sherwood's first game in charge. So perhaps that had a bearing on his decision. But Chiriches was also poor, yet he started (and was poor again) v Southampton. We have limited options at centre-half right now though.

But it's not just about Capoue is it? Bentaleb clearly deserved a chance to play, he showed that by handling himself brilliantly when he came on.

Why is it that some of our fans have to find a problem where there isn't one? We should be happy that we have a coach who is very knowledgeable of our young players, so much so that he can make the decision to bring them on at key moments of a game and have it work well.

Because 'Nice But Dim' 'looks' and 'sounds' stupid. He is an 'up and at em' '4 fackin 4 fackin 2' specialist with no knowledge of football (or tactical knowledge whatsoever for that matter) who is only able to motivate players. How can you not see this!? He is English after all, and therefore knows nothing about football. Clearly we know this because of his many years in football, and the fact that the similarly odious cretin that was Harry Redknapp (forget the impeccable finishes for a minute) appointed him, therefore he must be one of the amateurish 'old boys' appointed for no reason other than nepotism.

 

[the dza]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

Because 'Nice But Dim' 'looks' and 'sounds' stupid. He is an 'up and at em' '4 fackin 4 fackin 2' specialist with no knowledge of football (or tactical knowledge whatsoever for that matter) who is only able to motivate players. How can you not see this!? He is English after all, and therefore knows nothing about football. Clearly we know this because of his many years in football, and the fact that the similarly odious cretin that was Harry Redknapp (forget the impeccable finishes for a minute) appointed him, therefore he must be one of the amateurish 'old boys' appointed for no reason other than nepotism.

Fair points. Perhaps we should just shoot him and put him in the foundations of the new stadium. He's just so English, and he even sounds like one of those ghastly people that might go to White Hart Lane.

Bring me a Southern European with perfectly quaffed hair, please; performances on the pitch, be damned!

 

[SteveAWOL]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

http://www.101greatgoals.com/blog/a...ottenham-v-southampton-individual-highlights/

All of a sudden Tottenham have a new fans’ favourite: 19-year-old French midfielder Nabil Bentaleb.

Bentaleb played 40 minutes in Tottenham’s 3-2 away win at Southampton last Sunday in the Premier League, and the youngster made an excellent impression with a composed and solid performance.

Called into action to replace the injured Mousa Dembele, Bentaleb slotted in to the Spurs midfield in a like-for-like role for the Belgian, and immediately the teenager got stuck in.

Showing good upper body strength, simple but accurate passing skills, and appearing to have a knack at being in the right place at the right time to win back possession, Bentaleb’s debut was an effort he could be proud of.

As it is though, Tottenham fans should only expect to Bentaleb to be used in limited doses this season.

Mousa Dembele and Sandro are expected to be fit on Boxing Day for West Brom. Paulinho returns from suspension versus Stoke on Sunday and Christian Eriksen arguably had his best game for Tottenham at Southampton.

Watch footage of Nabil Bentaleb’s super performance for Tottenham v Southampton below.

[video=youtube;_--50HxqA5I]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_--50HxqA5I[/video]

 

[Pirate55]

Re: Official Nabil Bentaleb Thread

If I recall correctly, Capoue had a monster of a debut coming on as sub against CP. probably even more eye catching than Bentelabs debut. But too early to make definitive judgements about either of them IMO .