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Moussa Sissoko

Discussion in 'Spurs News & Views' started by Jordinho, 31 Aug 2016.

  1. LemonadeMoney

    LemonadeMoney Paul Robinson

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    We haven't had the what makes a player world class debate for awhile. :D
     
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  2. MKSpur

    MKSpur Simon Davies

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    I’m not Sissoko’s biggest fan but one thing you can’t say is he hasn’t wrung every last drop of his ability to become an elite footballer and gives everything physically on the pitch .

    Jenas would be on the opposite end of the talent vs drive scale.

    Since what may well be reviewed as our golden age under Poch we seemed to have signed a few players who have physicality and pace at the expense of technique - which may have been fine if one or two are involved but when you have four or five it makes it difficult to keep the ball or work the opposition as one of them will break or slow the passing sequence. Lo Celso NDombele and Bergwijn look like players who can help with this but we’ve rarely seen all three of them together, a couple more this summer will help redress the balance.
     
    harr1984 likes this.
  3. elltrev

    elltrev Niko Kranjcar

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    I agree the stats don't prove he hides, but as you say they certainly prove that he gets on the ball less than all of our other central midfielders - including Winks, who also does the majority of his work deep. And I think it's unusual to have a central midfield pairing where one gets on the ball so little. E.g. in 16/17 Dembele and Wanyama's numbers were 64 and 59. In 15/16, Dier's and Dembele's were 57 and 55. In 11/12 Modric and Parker's were 71 and 63. In 09/10 Huddlestone's and Palacios' were 54 and 48. Compared to Winks and Sissoko's 68 and 46 this season - it's very unusual.

    Personally I also see him multiple times per match pointing to a teammate to be passed to, rather than making space to receive a pass himself. Though I appreciate we're probably not going to agree on that without watching a match together and commenting on it live! So instead let me ask:

    What would you say he's doing when not getting on the ball, if not hiding? That the likes of Dembele, Wanyama, Dier, Modric, Parker, Huddlestone and Palacios weren't doing?
     
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  4. Bedfordspurs

    Bedfordspurs Steve Sedgley

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    Well in his case IMO it wasn’t ability as he showed it at times
    It’s the age old issue of what’s in the head...
     
  5. harr1984

    harr1984 John Lacy

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    Fair enough mate, but for me you’re trying to use stats to prove something that isn’t there. Winks is a tippy tappy passer who does lots of short passing so I’m not in the least bit surprised he averages far more. The only other playmaker who did lots of tippy tappy passing from that selection is Modric and his passing was far higher than Parker’s according to your stats. If you have playmakers in your team the instructions will be get the ball to them as frequently as possible, but if you want to believe it’s because Sissoko is hiding then fair enough, but he really isn’t:D.....
     
  6. parklane1

    parklane1 Les Howe

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    I do agree, he had all the quality/skills to be one of the best but never had the drive to produce in enough.
     
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  7. elltrev

    elltrev Niko Kranjcar

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    EDIT: Just to be clear, I only try to use stats to support what I think I've seen with my own eyes, and only in a (seemingly always unsuccessful!) attempt to break what is otherwise an inevitable deadlock in discussion.

    And it feels to me like you're trying to discount stats to prove something that isn't there. E.g. You say Modric's passing numbers are 'far higher' than Parker's, whereas in reality it's a difference of 8 vs a difference of 22 for Winks and Sissoko. And the fact is that Sissoko's number of passes is the lowest of those 10 CMs I mentioned.

    Do you feel more comfortable with the language 'doesn't make enough effort to make himself available to his teammates'? If not I guess we'll just have to leave it there and agree to disagree, even though to me the evidence is undeniable!
     
    Last edited: 11 Aug 2020
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  8. Bullet

    Bullet Paul Walsh

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    Trolling much galeforce? Don't be silly.

    Sissoko has the same skill level as someone like Wimmer, but is playing in midfield, so it really stands out that he cannot reliably shoot, pass nor control the ball.
     
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  9. braineclipse

    braineclipse Chris Jones

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    Not sure it's a question of effort.

    I think he rightly thinks that him receiving the ball in under pressure or in tight situations frequently would be bad for the team and him. We're all better off with him not showing for the ball in situations where others do, and should.

    For me Mourinho got it right when he essentially said that he's not a central midfielder. Perhaps Mourinho has since changed his mind, impossible to know. I hope he hasn't.
     
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  10. elltrev

    elltrev Niko Kranjcar

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    Yeah when I said he doesn't make enough effort, I didn't mean to suggest it's because he's lazy. I agree it's because he (arguably rightly) doesn't have enough confidence in his ability on the ball. And sounds like we agree that that trait is a major flaw to have in a central midifelder!
     
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  11. Bishop

    Bishop Ronnie Rosenthal

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    Imagine playing a whole CM that you shouldn't actually pass the ball to in midfield.
     
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  12. Jon

    Jon Jimmy Neighbour

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    George Graham made that dream come true...
     
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  13. Baleforce

    Baleforce Fanny Walden

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    Klopp is still doing it
     
  14. thfcsteff

    thfcsteff Les Howe Staff Member

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    We can only dream of a 4-3-3 with Dier, Holjberg and Sissoko...
     
  15. thfcsteff

    thfcsteff Les Howe Staff Member

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    In fairness, Davis and Roecastle were both good players (ouch that hurt though)...
     
  16. Jon

    Jon Jimmy Neighbour

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    I’m sure they were.

    But our version was; Leonhardsen - Sherwood - Freund - Clemence.

    A midfield 4 based on just getting in the way, never passing forward, and creativity was served by waiting for the opposition to get bored and make a mistake.
     
  17. ricky2tricky4city

    ricky2tricky4city Jimmy Neighbour

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    That's nice. Steff had completely erased that insipid period of our history....and you go and unlock the door of misery.
     
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  18. Jon

    Jon Jimmy Neighbour

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    Here to help mate, here to help...
     
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  19. Yiddo

    Yiddo Alf Ramsey

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    We sold him for £30m yet?
     
  20. Bishop

    Bishop Ronnie Rosenthal

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    If you change that figure to 13m it's more likely.
     

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