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Mark Duggan

Discussion in 'Randomination' started by SpursLodge, 8 Jan 2014.

  1. SpursLodge

    SpursLodge Nicola Berti

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    I don't understand the families outrage. Obviously I get that they're disappointed by the verdict but they're calling the police murderers and saying that a black mans life doesn't mean anything.

    Have they forgotten that he was carrying a gun and that's very much illegal? Whether he threw it away before being shot or not that still makes him dangerous.

    I get that the police can't go round shooting any old black man (or anyone else) but if you go about with a pistol in you pocket then your giving the old bill a decision to make surely?
     
  2. 3DSpur

    3DSpur Milenko Acimovic

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    Off the bat, if he was part of a Gang who went around terrorising people, then he was an outright **** in my book.

    However, for me, it's the bull**** that was put together before and during he was shot which the was most sketchy. How information was being added, even after the events, just like what happened when Charles De Menenzes was shot and killed. The flow and organisation of information and communication is one of the most important things for the police, and when they **** up as much as they have in both cases, they deserve a slapping down.
     
  3. The Portugeezer

    The Portugeezer Terry Yorath Wind Up Merchant

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    You both talking b*llocks. The police murdered an unarmed civilian in cold blood! He was not a threat to anyone. Did they need to kill the man? No! If Mark Duggan was wanted for criminal activities then arrest him and not shoot him! It would have saved his family a lot of heartache and the riots would have never happened. But the Police are comprised of stupid people because that's why they are in the police force in the first place. They exist to enforce unjust laws and protect the wealthy elite. F*ck em!
     
    Last edited: 8 Jan 2014
  4. Kingdawson

    Kingdawson Banned

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    They ruled that he was lawfully killed but didn't have a gun. How exactly does that work out?
     
  5. The Portugeezer

    The Portugeezer Terry Yorath Wind Up Merchant

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    The Police are never held accountable. It's a mafia.
     
  6. ringo

    ringo Eidur Gudjohnsen

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    Ch4.
    Police chief on live link says to Ch 4 news journalist, that police are making progress with local community.
    Ch 4 news journalist turns to ex gang member turned community liaison person standing in street next to journalist and asks if he believes police are making progress.
    Ex-gang member turned community liaison person says no - and explains that he was just stopped and searched on the way to Sky studios to do an interview, detained from his business for 45 minutes and then released without charge!

    Brilliant news moment.
     
  7. spitshine

    spitshine Gheorge Popescu

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    The police are no angels. However, I think the correct decision was made. You carry a gun surely you have to expect the worst, irrespective of whether he threw the gun out. I for one will be sleeping alot easier and so will the finances of the state. He had 6 kids by the age of 29.
     
  8. Kingdawson

    Kingdawson Banned

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    What's that got to do with anything?
     
  9. spitshine

    spitshine Gheorge Popescu

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    I thought I would just paint the whole picture. At this rate of reproduction I would say we have saved a small fortune in housing benefit, child benefit, job seekers allowance, tax credit, disability living allowance.
     
  10. Jurgen the German

    Jurgen the German Andy Thompson

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    I'm not too famialiar with the ins and outs of this case, but cast your mind back to the unlawful killing of Ian Tomlinson. I was outraged when the verdict was reached that PC Simon Harwood was found not guilty of manslaughter, eventually he was dimissed by the Met for 'gross misconduct' but I had a feeling that the police intentionally dragged their feet throughout the case just so Harwood could get off easy so to speak. I did lots of reading on the subject when it was in the news and remember feeling that something fishy was going on and the Met were doing their best to cover it up.

    I was sad because I used to think our police and government were different to other countries in Europe for example where corruption is rife, it's not as extreme over here but it still exists.
     
  11. parklane1

    parklane1 Andy Thompson

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    No sympathy for a gang member who carries guns.
     
  12. johnola

    johnola Pascal Chimbonda

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    Overdue a Darwin award surely.

    Surrounded by armed men he throws his weapon away...
     
  13. The Portugeezer

    The Portugeezer Terry Yorath Wind Up Merchant

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    So the Police have a shoot to kill policy if they suspect you have a gun basically. There's been numerous cases where the police royally ****ed up and end up assassinating innocent people because they thought they were packing and no one is really held accountable for their crimes.


    Yep corruption is rife everywhere. The police here are no different, just they exercise a little more restraint than in other countries.
     
    Last edited: 8 Jan 2014
  14. johnola

    johnola Pascal Chimbonda

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    The NHS are considerably more dangerous than the police.
     
  15. LutonSpurs

    LutonSpurs Niko Kranjcar

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    Can any of you actually explain how much of a gang member he was?

    He had two previous. One for cannabis possession and one for handling stolen goods. Minors in the big picture.

    The alleged gang is just an area thing and he was not part of any organised crime ring. There is no evidence for this. You should do better than to slander a dead man without knowing facts.

    The gun was in his hand according to the cop who shot him. He got out of the car with it and he shot him. But the gun was found twenty yards away and nobody saw him throw it. The jury agreed he was shot unarmed.

    Basically there are a lot of questions to be answered.

    Some of the lies spread about Duggan are disgusting.

    And his having six kids doesn't justify the cops shooting him. I can't believe it is being mentioned. Frighteningly stupid to mention it.
     
  16. Trixster

    Trixster Reto Ziegler

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    Trouble is he was deemed a threat to life at the time, and police most likely being the same as the forces then you use what force you deem necessary to remove the threat to life - Forces are generally more overzealous in these matters, but seems also the police to in this case.

    Shoot him in the leg/arm then he still has the potential to shoot back, afaik the firearms squad are still taught bodyshots for the put down and not much more.

    The same would have happened to him in the majority of countries.
    If your daft enough to have a firearm then you should expect something bad to happen when it is waved about, yes it is sad that he died but if he never had it in the first place then maybe he would still be here..
     
  17. scaramanga

    scaramanga Tommy Harmer Staff Member

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    I'd be interested to see some reports of these cases. Especially some unbiased ones.
     
  18. scaramanga

    scaramanga Tommy Harmer Staff Member

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    Quite. The policy (and clearly one that the majority of the country are comfortable with) is that the police only need good reason to believe their lives are in danger in order for them to take the required action.

    Seriously people, this is just silly. The police did the right thing, Lee Harvey Oswald took out JFK, the World Trade centre was taken down by terrorists and we're not being oppressed by some secretive lizard men that disguise themselves as humans.
     
  19. Bonsaiboy

    Bonsaiboy Steven Caulker Wind Up Merchant

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    "No Justice! No Peace!" So basically his family threatening to become violent and start another riot if they don't get their own way.
     
  20. parklane1

    parklane1 Andy Thompson

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    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-24210480

    Mark Duggan 'among Europe's most violent criminals', inquest toldMark Duggan Mark Duggan was shot dead in Tottenham in August 2011, sparking riots that spread across England Continue reading the main story


    Mark Duggan was a member of a violent gang involved in gun crime and dealing class A drugs, a senior detective has told an inquest.

    Det Ch Insp Mick Foote headed Operation Dibri which targeted Tottenham gang TMD, a group he said contained "48 of Europe's most violent criminals".

    Mr Foote told the hearing: "Duggan was in the group of 48."

    Mr Duggan, 29, was shot by police in Tottenham, north London, in August 2011, sparking riots across England.

    Mr Foote told the inquest into Mr Duggan's death that in January 2011 the Metropolitan Police received intelligence that Mr Duggan had shot "someone in a nightclub" and in February 2011 that he had "fired shots in club car park".

    'Aggressively confronted'

    Police had Mr Duggan under "lifestyle surveillance" and later in 2011, officers received intelligence he "had taken possession of gun", said Mr Foote, who was called as the first witness at the inquest.

    However, the police "had no specific intelligence to arrest Duggan before 4 August", the day he was shot dead, the jury heard.

    At the inquest, the jury was shown police paperwork suggesting Mr Duggan and his associates had been "directly responsible for murders".

    A form quoting police intelligence said 10 shootings and two murders were linked to the TMD gang.

    A police intelligence form said Mr Duggan "was violent" and had "aggressively confronted" police on the Broadwater Farm estate in north London.

    Mr Duggan had convictions for cannabis possession, handling stolen goods and had been cautioned for public disorder, jurors heard.

    The inquest at the Royal Courts of Justice is expected to last two months
     

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