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Ledley King

Jurgen the German said:
I've been saying all season that he needs some competiton, and Danny Rose just doesn't provide it. He's had a good season, but he still has the odd game where he's terrible.
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I have been saying it all season as well, he plays to many games and even when he gets a rest he knows he will come straight back in the team, as you say he needs competiton.
 
braineclipse said:
Rose for Ekotto? You're having a laugh...

Ekotto is the best left back we've had in at least two decades.



That's not a problem of not having competition. That's a problem of expectation. People for some reason expect our fullbacks to have no bad games despite playing 40-50+ games a season and being in one of the toughest leagues in the world. This despite seeing our wingers tear even good fullbacks apart quite regularly and sometimes our full backs being left quite unprotected. Unless there is a young Maldini clone running around somewhere waiting to be snapped up by us I think people need to accept that sometimes full backs (and other defenders) have off games. Unsurprisingly this seems to happen when the rest of the team are poor and they are put under a lot of pressure.
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People don't expect him to play great in every single game. I'm getting tired of saying it, but he's still far too casual and laidback for my liking. I think he's been up there with the best left backs in the league this season, but what on earth was he doing yesterday just jogging back whilst Walcott ran unchallenged? Surely if had a better left back than Danny Rose on the bench to keep firmly in his place it would make him a bit less complacent.
 
He's still got it, but I think we need to replace him in the summer with someone who can play every league match. I'd rather we make the transition now, rather than wait for the next January transfer window where it may be possible that he will break down next season.

We all know that he's a remarkable player, but we have to start pushing him backwards soon. And once he is no longer a regular - he can do something else within the club like, say, a coaching role. No point singling him out for the game against Arsenal, he wasn't very good but which of our players was?
 
Hootnow said:
Every season, King has at least one bad game where we proclaim that its the end of the King, that he should retire at the end of the season etc etc. Only for him to then come back next game, dominate the other team and we all announce he's amazing again.

Let's be clear, King has gone downhill. Clearly. He's much much slower and much less mobile than he was before. His brain is still as quick as ever but sometimes his body just doesn't quite obey. So he's worse than he has been in previous seasons. And every once in a while, especially when the midfield becomes non-existent, he gets exposed by waves of attacks and comes up looking a bit silly. And for all the mocking of Arsenal throughout the season, their front 6 is still one of the best, fastest and most technically accomplished in the league, especially when on form.

But he's still an excellent defender. Even now, with no knees and no training. His effect on our win percentage isn't a coincidence. The effect of his presence on the team isn't a coincidence. He's played a huge part of us sitting in 3rd right now. King stays at the club until he decides its enough imo. Or if we get to a point where King is having a very clear detrimental effect.

But still, in the long term, I'd like us to build a reliable, consistent back two and that means we have to try to buy so that King is no longer an automatic starter when fit. Harder said that done though.
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Absolutely spot-on. A mate text me during the game to say King should never be playing. rubbish, all yuou have to do is look at our record with and without. If we had a replacemnt that was half as consistent as Ledley, we would be winning the league! Midfield was a joke yesterday, we were running around like headless chickens, making that lot look special. Harry was at fault for bad tea, selection and then terrible substitutions, shall we sack him too?
 
Regarding his pace though, some of the best defenders of all time weren't the fastest. King's reading of the game which has always been one of his strong attributes should cancel out his dieing pace. We'll never see those Robben or Huckerby type tackles again, not from King anyway. He'll need to work on a different way of defending as apposed to relying on his pace and I believe he's doing that.
 
judging by this thread most people on here would change the entire team for next sunday. we've lost 3 games in 6 months ffs and 2 of those were in unfortunate circumstances. yesterday was the only really poor performance in that period

the formation was largely to blame. it was a shambles. we'll be alright if we go back to picking our best players in the their best positions.
 
Kingdawson said:
King with his bad knee is still faster than Dawson so i fail to see what you're getting at.
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No way on GHod's earth King on his current condition is faster than Dawson. Daws is faster and quicker. Not hitting on King, but it's the nature of the injury..it caught up with him finally and teams watch him and figure out his weakness..which is....SLOW..again..he will be great against slower teams because of superior positional awareness but against a fast winger/striker like Mata for example he will get caught..
Again..not that he is bad...it's the injury ..I love the guy to death and was/is/will be a huge fan..but let's face it..

:rolleyes:
 
Robbo said:
I think he's had enough good games this season to warrant a pay-as-you-play deal for another year, but he has also shown signs that he is losing it. Yesterday was sad to watch - he couldn't keep up with the game at all. These are the kinds of games where he would normally be our best player, but yesterday he was as bad as the rest of the team.

King is certainly not as consistently good as he used to be. He'll always be a legend - I just hope he himself realise when it is time to retire. I'd hate to see him playing as a shadow of his former self.
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I agree with this and it's a little sad to see. He's still great, but i've noticed a few times this season where he's made uncharacteristic errors. We really need to invest in 1/2 top class or potential top class CB's in the summer.
 
Can we play a match tomorrow or something the knee jerk on here is out of control atm Rose in for Benny? FFS he just played a blinder against Saudi Sportswashing Machine two weeks ago and now he is brick?
 
Is this thread a joke?

Think Ledley, whenever he's played this season has been a rock for us. We always look so much worse without him.

As much as I think we need to consider things long term, I still think Ledley has a big role to play for us.
 
arabspur said:
No way on GHod's earth King on his current condition is faster than Dawson. Daws is faster and quicker. Not hitting on King, but it's the nature of the injury..it caught up with him finally and teams watch him and figure out his weakness..which is....SLOW..again..he will be great against slower teams because of superior positional awareness but against a fast winger/striker like Mata for example he will get caught..
Again..not that he is bad...it's the injury ..I love the guy to death and was/is/will be a huge fan..but let's face it..

:rolleyes:
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I don't agree if I'm being honest. To me he's still faster than Dawson. I can never imagine Dawson being faster than King, it just doesn't sound right.
 
Kingdawson said:
I don't agree if I'm being honest. To me he's still faster than Dawson. I can never imagine Dawson being faster than King, it just doesn't sound right.
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Does that mean your basing it on previous rather then looking at what is happening at the moment. I think king is not as good as he once was, but he does not do those annoying cross field passes that dawson does and for that alone he should start ahead of dawson.

But i agree about a new centre back in the summer, ideally next year it will be kaboul and new signing and then dawson and caulker with king as 5th choice on a pay as you play deal.
 
I love King, he needs to stay, but we have to stop shoehorning him in. We need an absolute quality reader of the game with pace (basically a new King) to partner Dawson or Kaboul (who are both similar). King shouldn't play whenever he's fit, but actually only when we need him and cup games, rather than the other way around.

get rid of Gallas and Bassong, a new CB and bring Caulker back and we'll be looking good.

NEW CB and Dawson
Kaboul and Caulker back up
King when we need him and when he's fit.

he deserves that, he's still amazing, but we need stability.
 
Hootnow said:
Every season, King has at least one bad game where we proclaim that its the end of the King, that he should retire at the end of the season etc etc. Only for him to then come back next game, dominate the other team and we all announce he's amazing again.

Let's be clear, King has gone downhill. Clearly. He's much much slower and much less mobile than he was before. His brain is still as quick as ever but sometimes his body just doesn't quite obey. So he's worse than he has been in previous seasons. And every once in a while, especially when the midfield becomes non-existent, he gets exposed by waves of attacks and comes up looking a bit silly. And for all the mocking of Arsenal throughout the season, their front 6 is still one of the best, fastest and most technically accomplished in the league, especially when on form.

But he's still an excellent defender. Even now, with no knees and no training. His effect on our win percentage isn't a coincidence. The effect of his presence on the team isn't a coincidence. He's played a huge part of us sitting in 3rd right now. King stays at the club until he decides its enough imo. Or if we get to a point where King is having a very clear detrimental effect.

But still, in the long term, I'd like us to build a reliable, consistent back two and that means we have to try to buy so that King is no longer an automatic starter when fit. Harder said that done though.
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Pretty much spot on.

I can't think of many other CBs in world football who, having had amazing natural attributes (pace, athleticism, spring, strength, can adapt successfully if they lost one or more of those natural physical attributes. They will have relied on those same natural attributes for their whole career, usually to the detriment of their footballing 'brain', so when they lose their pace....... they're shot.

Ledley King is far from shot. He's actually been magnificent for pretty much all of this season - because he's England's most naturally talented CB in the last 15 years. He didn't even have that bad a game yesterday IMO - it's just his creaking knees/legs got exposed too much, due to the absolutely shambolic defending in front of it.

Long Live The King of White Hart Lane.
 
So Ledley has a bad game and you want to put him out to pasture. Fine but what about the rest of the team that played yesterday? Apart from the keeper they were all brick. Funny how people are ready to write of Ledley but seem to find no fault with the rest of the team.
 
And if people want to make a dig at King for being slow and past it yesterday then what was Kaboul's fukking excuse then because he was at best just as poor as King?
 
GrimsbyYid said:
I love King, he needs to stay, but we have to stop shoehorning him in. We need an absolute quality reader of the game with pace (basically a new King) to partner Dawson or Kaboul (who are both similar). King shouldn't play whenever he's fit, but actually only when we need him and cup games, rather than the other way around.

get rid of Gallas and Bassong, a new CB and bring Caulker back and we'll be looking good.

NEW CB and Dawson
Kaboul and Caulker back up
King when we need him and when he's fit.

he deserves that, he's still amazing, but we need stability.
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Wut? New cb and dawson?

I'd go New cb and kaboul. Kaboul has been our best defender this season. Dawson, Caulker and new cb to partner him depending on the game that is being played would suit me just fine.
 
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