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Harry Kane MBE

glasgowspur said:
And yet when win its all about harry.
You win as a team you lose as a team.
Unless you're harry kane or son.
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It's true that's the media perception, but it's not fair on the rest, imo. Son and Kane are great, but they couldn't do what they do without the backing cast supplying them or keeping goals out at the other end.
 
DubaiSpur said:
Yeah, but look at the players you cited, mate - they played in top teams, Liverpool and Chelsea. They had players around them that shared their talent and their mentality - Lampard and Drogba were on the same team, Gerrard always had the likes of Mascherano and Xabi Alonso around him to help him out.

Kane just doesn't. At best he has Son, who people have already cited as hot-and-cold on here - there's no one else on the team who's top class, who can relieve the burden of being the primary creator.
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He played in team with Eriksen, jan, toby, walker, rose, Dembele and hugo, and we still couldn't get over the line, on nore than one occasion.
 
glasgowspur said:
He played in team with Eriksen, jan, toby, walker, rose, Dembele and hugo, and we still couldn't get over the line, on nore than one occasion.
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Those players the attacking minded ones especially aren't on the same level as the players that were mentioned earlier. Good players, not great players or players that could grab a game either. Whereas some of those supporting cast did.

I'm not trying to make excuses but we've never had the standard of first 11 or more importantly squad that the teams who tend to win things do.

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Bishop said:
Those players the attacking minded ones especially aren't on the same level as the players that were mentioned earlier. Good players, not great players or players that could grab a game either. Whereas some of those supporting cast did.

I'm not trying to make excuses but we've never had the standard of first 11 or more importantly squad that the teams who tend to win things do.

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And yet we have beaten all those teams and finished above them in the league, but when it comes to the important head to head games we fail.
 
glasgowspur said:
And yet we have beaten all those teams and finished above them in the league, but when it comes to the important head to head games we fail.
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One off games don't matter. We finished ahead of those teams when they didn't have the players mentioned.

Tbh I don't think Kane is the be all and end all. He's a. Excellent player of course. I also don't agree with the narrative that a single star should be the difference maker. Sure a star player can seal a deal but not usually when the rest of the performance is brick. The star player performance is usually the icing on the cake not the entire cake. Whenever we lose we seem to ask why Kane didn't prepare the ingredients and bake the damn cake too.

If the supporting cast can't do their job neither wi the star players. Besides the most important part of the park is the midfield and we lost that today. It's always the midfield where games are won and lost.

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Bishop said:
One off games don't matter. We finished ahead of those teams when they didn't have the players mentioned.

Tbh I don't think Kane is the be all and end all. He's a. Excellent player of course. I also don't agree with the narrative that a single star should be the difference maker. Sure a star player can seal a deal but not usually when the rest of the performance is brick. The star player performance is usually the icing on the cake not the entire cake. Whenever we lose we seem to ask why Kane didn't prepare the ingredients and bake the damn cake too.

If the supporting cast can't do their job neither wi the star players. Besides the most important part of the park is the midfield and we lost that today. It's always the midfield where games are won and lost.

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You win as a team you lose as a team.
I have no real problem with Kane.
What i do rail against is the narrative that without him we'd be nowhere and that when we fail its everyone else that is rubbish.
 
glasgowspur said:
You win as a team you lose as a team.
I have no real problem with Kane.
What i do rail against is the narrative that without him we'd be nowhere and that when we fail its everyone else that is rubbish.
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Without him is going in to an alternate reality which is hard to fathom, but taking away that part, it is not like we’ve had great success in signing strikers for a while..I do appreciate that the argument that maybe it’s been difficult due to him being here to a certain extent, but still doubt that Vincent Jansen would have been a resounding success were it not for Harry being around.

The gaping holes in the squad - ie one injury has us playing Royale at WB or Winks in a midfield two or Gollini in goal or Sanchez in any CB position (I could carry on) aren’t Kane’s fault, the guy deserves better than that imo.
 
spurspinter1 said:
Without him is going in to an alternate reality which is hard to fathom, but taking away that part, it is not like we’ve had great success in signing strikers for a while..I do appreciate that the argument that maybe it’s been difficult due to him being here to a certain extent, but still doubt that Vincent Jansen would have been a resounding success were it not for Harry being around.

The gaping holes in the squad - ie one injury has us playing Royale at WB or Winks in a midfield two or Gollini in goal or Sanchez in any CB position (I could carry on) aren’t Kane’s fault, the guy deserves better than that imo.
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Do you really believe that if we sold Kane we would replace him with someone of jansens level?
 
glasgowspur said:
Do you really believe that if we sold Kane we would replace him with someone of jansens level?
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I love Bobby Soldado. He was the last really big pre-Kane striker signing we had. But he was, unfortunately, total crap, although a trier.

And before him? Counting backwards - Adebayor, Crouch, Gudjohnsen on loan, Defoe (again), Keane (again), Pavlyuchenko, Bent, Fraizer Campbell on loan.

Yes, I think we would replace him with someone of Janssen's level. Not because that's what we want to do, but because we tend to shop for top strikers that cost too much in wages for our dear leader to sanction, fail, and then sign alternatives that are highly-priced anywayin terms of transfer fees, but well within our wage range.

Sadly, that usually means they're crap or coming off the back of an overperforming season, if that lot is anything to go by. We could (and did) have countless DoFs in charge, from Arnesen to Comolli to Baldini to now Paratici, but the same constant remains dooming everything - the man up top. They could recommend the next Messi to replace Kane, but we are likelier to cheap out on him and buy the next Vincent Janssen instead.

Just like Janssen himself, actually - if I recall, Poch didn't want him. His first choice was Batshuayi, who, while not a lot better, still had a better career in English football than Janssen did.
 
DubaiSpur said:
I mean, also the case that, in 'big' games, he's usually well-marked by opponents who are good enough to make it to those 'big games'.

Our failure in big games is collective, not individual. And today it's more on Conte, who is usually regarded as a master of the big moment.
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But also against teams he’s single handedly destroyed at other times.
 
Baleforce said:
But also against teams he’s single handedly destroyed at other times.
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He's never singlehandedly destroyed teams though. Players have passed him the ball, they've made the defensive tackles, they've made the dummy runs etc. No player does it by themselves. None.

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glasgowspur said:
Its all ifs and buts, we will never know.
After CL final, fund the rebuild?
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I find the term rebuild a bit problematic, much like the usage of world class or top four level and those terms get thrown around a lot on here.

It’s not a new idea that when Kane struggles, we struggle as a team. I also appreciate that when Kane’s been injured, Son has done statistically well when playing central.

Whilst it’s great to have a clear XI, there’s no doubt in my head that we don’t have genuine competition in the forward positions, and haven’t in a while. I’ve been told a couple of times to wait until the summer so we can sort it out so will try my best to diligently do so, it does seem like these issues aren’t exactly new so you could see where my cynicism comes from in that regard...
 
Bishop said:
He's never singlehandedly destroyed teams though. Players have passed him the ball, they've made the defensive tackles, they've made the dummy runs etc. No player does it by themselves. None.

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I was thinking of that Liverpool game at Wembley where we scored about 25 goals, then a few months later he's anonymous against the same team in Madrid
 
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