1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Dear Guest, Please note that adult content is not permitted on this forum. We have had our Google ads disabled due to some posts that were found from some time ago. Please do not post adult content and if you see any already on the forum, please report the post so that we can deal with it. Thanks, scara
    Dismiss Notice

Donald Trump - The president of the United States of America

Discussion in 'Randomination' started by Danishfurniturelover, 26 Jan 2016.

  1. Mosquito_Coasting

    Mosquito_Coasting Naybet

    Joined:
    23 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    1,609
    Likes Received:
    723
    Epstein also has strong links to Bill Clinton. That's why his name never came up despite all the mud-throwing in that election race. It will get buried as usual.
     
    nayenezgani likes this.
  2. Rorschach

    Rorschach Erik Thorstvedt

    Joined:
    14 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    22,801
    Likes Received:
    11,424
    Location:
    ...here
    Epstein probably has dirt on almost everyone. If he sings he will bring down a whole host of the white elite.
     
  3. Mosquito_Coasting

    Mosquito_Coasting Naybet

    Joined:
    23 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    1,609
    Likes Received:
    723
    I wish that were true, he won't sing though, did you see the joke sentence he got last time? He just went to jail during the day time if I remember correctly, could sleep at home. Same thing will happen again. They need to drain that fudging swamp. Prince Andrew linked to Epstein too. They're all in it up to their gills.
     
    nayenezgani likes this.
  4. Rorschach

    Rorschach Erik Thorstvedt

    Joined:
    14 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    22,801
    Likes Received:
    11,424
    Location:
    ...here
    I don't think it will go the same way this time. Last time was effectively a coverup and I can't imagine we'll see a repeat of it. At least that is the legal noise I'm reading. If he is looking at a long time in prison we'll see how quiet he keeps.
     
  5. Mosquito_Coasting

    Mosquito_Coasting Naybet

    Joined:
    23 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    1,609
    Likes Received:
    723
    Trump is bullet proof at this point, so is Clinton and all of them. American structure has too much to lose. It will all be swept away as usual. Don’t think anything will come of this, just like Mueller.
     
    thfcsteff and Robbo like this.
  6. Mosquito_Coasting

    Mosquito_Coasting Naybet

    Joined:
    23 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    1,609
    Likes Received:
    723
    It’s too embarrassing for America to allow it to be known they elected someone who colluded with Russia, had sex with underage girls, got tinkled on by a Russian pro. It undermines the way they like to see themselves and the way they want to be seen too gravely. Same for any country really.
     
  7. Rorschach

    Rorschach Erik Thorstvedt

    Joined:
    14 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    22,801
    Likes Received:
    11,424
    Location:
    ...here
    Well we can hope. If Epstein gets done again he's looking at up to 45 years and if that happens he will talk. A man with as little morals as he has will have no compunction in giving up whomever he needs to. They should be going after Acosta too for giving a free pass last time.
     
  8. Mosquito_Coasting

    Mosquito_Coasting Naybet

    Joined:
    23 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    1,609
    Likes Received:
    723
    Let’s hope so, mate!
     
  9. 90291Spur

    90291Spur Frederic Kanoute

    Joined:
    3 Dec 2012
    Messages:
    8,612
    Likes Received:
    6,429
    Trump will pardon him. Nailed on.
     
  10. galeforce

    galeforce Tony Galvin

    Joined:
    14 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    27,520
    Likes Received:
    12,293
    Nah, he’ll throw him into jail, on the Mexican border
     
  11. Rorschach

    Rorschach Erik Thorstvedt

    Joined:
    14 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    22,801
    Likes Received:
    11,424
    Location:
    ...here
    Technically yes, it is a federal crime and Trump could pardon Epstein. But would he? Trump's whole outlook is transactional and a pardon would only make sense to him if he was benefitting from it somehow.

    So there are two scenarios, one where Trump is involved and one where he is an innocent bystander. He's almost certainly not but lets flesh that one out. Say Epstein is charged and is going down for say 30 years for child sex trafficking. Pardoning a paedophile has significant optics problems (and is another misuse of the pardon power) coming up to his reelection campaign, and if Trump is not directly implicated there is little upside for him. Yeah, he's an old sex buddy but I doubt that will make one iota of difference to Trump when push comes to shove. Pardoning Epstein would likely hurt his election campaign among the swing voters.

    Scenario 2 is where Trump is involved. The original deal for Epstein included wording that granted immunity to “any potential co-conspirators’’. What if he is one of them? It is not a stretch to imagine that is the reason why Acosta turned the rules upside down on the original case and was later rewarded with a cabinet position by Trump. If Trump is one of the paedos (and there is certainly evidence pointing that way) I'm not sure pardoning Epstein will be forefront in his mind.

    The fat fudging fly in the ointment is Barr who has jurisdiction over this case now that it is in federal court. Epstein also worked for his father, which in normal times would mean a recusal from overseeing the case. These are not normal times however and Barr has already shown he can not be trusted.
     
  12. Rorschach

    Rorschach Erik Thorstvedt

    Joined:
    14 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    22,801
    Likes Received:
    11,424
    Location:
    ...here
  13. 90291Spur

    90291Spur Frederic Kanoute

    Joined:
    3 Dec 2012
    Messages:
    8,612
    Likes Received:
    6,429
    I wish your scenario 1 made a jot of difference. Pardoning Epstein means he doesn’t have to testify about TRump’s involvement. He can take whatever fall he will get and then be free to fcuk kids again. Trump’s ‘base’ will not give a flying fcuk if he pardons a paedophile. He has already publicly endorsed one running for senate - Roy Moore. He has already not done a thing about immigrant and asylum seeing kids being warehoused in concentration camps under conditions that would cause a parent to have their child taken from them due to child endangerment.

    And in the USA today there are no swing voters. You either support Trump and what he stands for or you don’t. I don’ think there are a significant number of people who think ‘Jeez, fcuking kids is going a bit too far from the racism/abortion bans/tax cuts for the wealthy/refusing to honour congressional subpoenas/racking up $100,000,000 for gold trips in 2 1/2 years etc.
     
  14. Rorschach

    Rorschach Erik Thorstvedt

    Joined:
    14 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    22,801
    Likes Received:
    11,424
    Location:
    ...here
    In scenario 1 as I have described it, Trump is not involved so there will be no testimony about him anyway. I can't see an upside for Trump pardoning Epstein when he is already in the clear.

    In scenario 2 where he is implicated as a co-conspirator, the sordid details will play out in the trial. He cannot pre-pardon Epstein before a trial as there needs to be a conviction before a pardon, so the only way a pardon for Epstein helps Trump is that (1) he is indeed a co-conspirator and (2) Epstein is thinking of flipping but the pardon stops that and (3) most importantly that there is no other evidence that will mean Trump is on the hook anyway.

    Yes the base will vote Trump no matter what. But there are still swing voters. Yes, you would think that any sane person would have already seen Trump for who he is but the opinion polls still swing up and down by more than margins of error. 2020 is still in play IMO.
     
  15. 90291Spur

    90291Spur Frederic Kanoute

    Joined:
    3 Dec 2012
    Messages:
    8,612
    Likes Received:
    6,429
    Trump pardons people he likes and who are loyal (and rich). There was no real need to pardon Apraio or Dinesh D-Souza…

    I hope this puts a dent in Trump, but I still stand behind the notion that swing voting is dead - whatever the polls say (and remember how wrong polls have been of late). This country is sooo polarized, and Trump has delivered so much of the agenda of the far-far-right (muslim ban, attempts at abortion ban, lifetime appointment of radical right judges, huge tax cuts for the wealthy, elimination of regulations on business…).. BUT, if you are aware of what issues might still be ‘swing’ I’d be fascinated to have my opinion changed.
     
  16. Rorschach

    Rorschach Erik Thorstvedt

    Joined:
    14 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    22,801
    Likes Received:
    11,424
    Location:
    ...here
    That is a fair point but I think those pardons were trial balloons, so to speak. Very controversial of course but designed mostly to judge reaction and maybe break the ice for future pardons. Pardoning a monster like Epstein is cranking it up more than a few notches. Would Trump do if he benefitted from it? Absolutely, but the benefit is not clear at the moment IMO.

    I'm not American but I have family there and amazingly they are not really that engaged with the daily brickshow. They may have a vaguely negative opinion of Trump but also could not articulate why. They also have only a vague idea who is running for the Democrats and no knowledge what their proposals are. Frankly, it seems incredible to me that they are not engaged but I imagine they are not alone. I guess the positive economic numbers and job figures still have a lot of sway over the fence sitters. The headlines hide a multitude of issues but there is a still a percentage of people that are doing OK and are happy enough with their lot.
     
    Last edited: 9 Jul 2019
  17. 90291Spur

    90291Spur Frederic Kanoute

    Joined:
    3 Dec 2012
    Messages:
    8,612
    Likes Received:
    6,429
    I think Trump is so emboldened right now that he might do anything. Just three weeks ago there was a 22nd claim against him - a credible rape claim - that just withered on the vine. And the Democrats, headed by Pelosi in the House, do nothing.

    As for the economy, it’s not doing better than under Obama, but that doesn’t matter as Trump takes credit for it. And last election 100,000,000 eligible voters didn’t vote. Ugh, it’s awful here and Britain is about to get a taste of having a malignant, lying, racist, narcissist in charge. Voted in by 160,000-ish Conservative party members.

    Thank goodness we have football and Spurs!
     
    Last edited: 9 Jul 2019
    Robbo, Gilzeantoscore and Rorschach like this.
  18. Jordinho

    Jordinho John White Staff Member

    Joined:
    14 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    41,859
    Likes Received:
    9,890
    Location:
    Next season
    There's your swing voters. The Republican base show up no matter what. The Democrats need a candidate that can get enough votes from the rest to win.
     
    Rorschach likes this.
  19. Rorschach

    Rorschach Erik Thorstvedt

    Joined:
    14 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    22,801
    Likes Received:
    11,424
    Location:
    ...here
    The whole thing is utterly amazing. Imagine the craziness that will erupt in the weeks just after, if he looses the election. He'll try everything to nullify the election and stay in power. His freedom will depend on remaining in office.

    Pelosi and the rest of dem leadership are like rabbits in the headlights. They are paralysed with fear.

    Who of the dem presidential candidates do you like?
     
  20. nayimfromthehalfwayline

    nayimfromthehalfwayline Tom Huddlestone

    Joined:
    14 Jan 2012
    Messages:
    13,698
    Likes Received:
    8,076
    Location:
    lobbing seaman from 50 yards
    I thought the whole joke with Trump was that he wanted the attention of the election, but not to actually win it?

    Is it that obvious he would want a second term? Im not sure Id expect that.
     

Share This Page