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Circus ManUnitus - Erik's At The Wheel

Manchester United will not be pursuing a deal for Bologna striker Marko Arnautovic after former United players privately expressed concerns about the potential transfer
 
markysimmo said:
Manchester United will not be pursuing a deal for Bologna striker Marko Arnautovic after former United players privately expressed concerns about the potential transfer
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fudge me - trying to wrestle back the narrative after being rejected by Arnautovic. How the mighty...
 
United have been the top club in this country since the 50's, when I was a kid they were the only team I ever heard any Londoner support other than their local club, mainly due the massive sympathy the nation felt after the Munich tragedy. Their standing has held due to their success and the fantastic players who have played for them since then.
Their decline has been a slow steady dip since SAF stepped down, this is due to mismanagement by their owners in terms of success on the pitch, they still make mega bucks and are a major worldwide brand.
Why they have not employed a football man to run the club is unbelievable, I think their current manager might be their last chance to get it right, he looks a good coach but he was in a one horse race in Holland, it needs major surgery with a long term strategy rather than buying box office names, which is against their recent policy.
It appears they dont know who they want to sign or whether they would want to join a situation I never thought I'd see.
If I were a fan I would be very worried as a change of ownership will be difficult to happen given the price the Glazers would want for their milk cow.
But never mind they'll still be one of Skys favourites as long as the millions of glory seekers follow them.
 
K.D.D.D.D.Soc said:
United have been the top club in this country since the 50's, when I was a kid they were the only team I ever heard any Londoner support other than their local club, mainly due the massive sympathy the nation felt after the Munich tragedy. Their standing has held due to their success and the fantastic players who have played for them since then.
Their decline has been a slow steady dip since SAF stepped down, this is due to mismanagement by their owners in terms of success on the pitch, they still make mega bucks and are a major worldwide brand.
Why they have not employed a football man to run the club is unbelievable, I think their current manager might be their last chance to get it right, he looks a good coach but he was in a one horse race in Holland, it needs major surgery with a long term strategy rather than buying box office names, which is against their recent policy.
It appears they dont know who they want to sign or whether they would want to join a situation I never thought I'd see.
If I were a fan I would be very worried as a change of ownership will be difficult to happen given the price the Glazers would want for their milk cow.
But never mind they'll still be one of Skys favourites as long as the millions of glory seekers follow them.
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My brother (who supports united) said that Raganick told them that then need to sell 10 of the current squad and get 10 players in. He was supposed, I thought, to be promoted to DOF, but that has fallen through. My brother wasn't sure if that was because he told the owners how much work was needed, or if Ten Haag didn't want a DOF.

My other brother (also man u supporter) always (fudging always!) says that the rot started under SAF. That he never replaced the good midfield he had and when he left they were mediocre and getting by on the reputation and Fergie's insane drive.

I agree that they're just a cash cow, and long may it continue. While I was grateful to them, for beating the arse to the title on numerous occasions, I won't be sorry to see them spiral into a lengthy decline.
 
Alaric said:
My brother (who supports united) said that Raganick told them that then need to sell 10 of the current squad and get 10 players in. He was supposed, I thought, to be promoted to DOF, but that has fallen through. My brother wasn't sure if that was because he told the owners how much work was needed, or if Ten Haag didn't want a DOF.

My other brother (also man u supporter) always (fudging always!) says that the rot started under SAF. That he never replaced the good midfield he had and when he left they were mediocre and getting by on the reputation and Fergie's insane drive.

I agree that they're just a cash cow, and long may it continue. While I was grateful to them, for beating the arse to the title on numerous occasions, I won't be sorry to see them spiral into a lengthy decline.
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For me at least your brother is correct on a lot of it. Ragnick said 6,8 maybe 10 need to be brought in.

Seems like they wanted him as dof but he became so unpopular amongst the fan base they abandoned the idea.

SAF worked under financial constraints. The glazers launched on the ny stock exchange after he left (i believe) allowing them to spend money. The utd team that won the league the last season fergie was there was brick. But teams still feared them. So they got results they probably shouldn't have. After moyes shaky start, teams no longer feared them. They haven't since.
 
Alaric said:
My brother (who supports united) said that Raganick told them that then need to sell 10 of the current squad and get 10 players in. He was supposed, I thought, to be promoted to DOF, but that has fallen through. My brother wasn't sure if that was because he told the owners how much work was needed, or if Ten Haag didn't want a DOF.

My other brother (also man u supporter) always (fudging always!) says that the rot started under SAF. That he never replaced the good midfield he had and when he left they were mediocre and getting by on the reputation and Fergie's insane drive.

I agree that they're just a cash cow, and long may it continue. While I was grateful to them, for beating the arse to the title on numerous occasions, I won't be sorry to see them spiral into a lengthy decline.
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If they're going to pick a team to support based on glory, why don't they just pick another team, rather than moan about a team who's only affiliation was they used to win stuff? Plenty of tickets available for City games.
 
LemonadeMoney said:
If they're going to pick a team to support based on glory, why don't they just pick another team, rather than moan about a team who's only affiliation was they used to win stuff? Plenty of tickets available for City games.
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What! Admit you've been wrong after spending years telling everyone how superior to them you are because you support a winning team and taking the tinkle out of everyone else. That would take a big man and demonstrate how shallow a person you are, or just a prick.
 
Lilbaz said:
For me at least your brother is correct on a lot of it. Ragnick said 6,8 maybe 10 need to be brought in.

Seems like they wanted him as dof but he became so unpopular amongst the fan base they abandoned the idea.

SAF worked under financial constraints. The glazers launched on the ny stock exchange after he left (i believe) allowing them to spend money. The utd team that won the league the last season fergie was there was brick. But teams still feared them. So they got results they probably shouldn't have. After moyes shaky start, teams no longer feared them. They haven't since.
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Paratici was available. Campos was available. Ragnick was available and they got him. Really strange decisions from the outside at least.

It's certainly possible to rebuild without a DoF like one of them, but it's easy to get trapped in a cycle of inadequate short term results, new manager, start again more or less from scratch. A good DoF guards against that to some extent at least.
 
braineclipse said:
Paratici was available. Campos was available. Ragnick was available and they got him. Really strange decisions from the outside at least.

It's certainly possible to rebuild without a DoF like one of them, but it's easy to get trapped in a cycle of inadequate short term results, new manager, start again more or less from scratch. A good DoF guards against that to some extent at least.
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Ragnick had done a very good job as dof for red bull. In player recruitment at least.
 
braineclipse said:
I think he is a very good DoF. He's not a great manager though. Hiring him as a caretaker with a view to make him DoF makes sense to me. But then not making him DoF seems really strange to me.
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Think they should have straight hired him as dof then got an interim coach in. Use last season as a total audit of the club. What changes need to be made. Then bring in ten haag or poch this summer.
 
Alaric said:
My other brother (also man u supporter) always (fudging always!) says that the rot started under SAF. That he never replaced the good midfield he had and when he left they were mediocre and getting by on the reputation and Fergie's insane drive.
Click to expand...
Lilbaz said:
SAF worked under financial constraints. The glazers launched on the ny stock exchange after he left (i believe) allowing them to spend money. The utd team that won the league the last season fergie was there was brick. But teams still feared them. So they got results they probably shouldn't have. After moyes shaky start, teams no longer feared them. They haven't since.
Click to expand...

I don't think there is any question the rot started under Ferguson. He had an ageing team which he did wonders with and left the new manager big problems. While it's true he was working under financial restraints, this was because of the model the Glazers introduced and he was a big defender of theirs (as well as a big part of the reason they took control ... his sense of entitlement for a horse). That he was able to get success with the Glazers disguised the structural problems and the new manager didn't have his built up credibility or the support of a strong executive (Gill) to argue that football considerations should be part of the strategy. Instead they got Woodward from their London office.

It would be interesting to see how Moyes would have got on if supported properly. With hindsight what he did at Everton looks better and he is reborn at West Ham. He inherited Fergie's team and got nothing to spend. They refused to buy Fellaini early in the summer when he had a release clause and then bought him late in the window at a premium. Mata came in January when they were struggling. Subsequent managers have had much better support, but much of it has been wasted as they tried to patch up a dysfunctional team with little thought for the long-term. Backing Moyes with serious money to rebuild the team might have been a good investment with long term benefits on and off the field.

Long may the short-sightedness continue.
 
jts1882 said:
I don't think there is any question the rot started under Ferguson. He had an ageing team which he did wonders with and left the new manager big problems. While it's true he was working under financial restraints, this was because of the model the Glazers introduced and he was a big defender of theirs (as well as a big part of the reason they took control ... his sense of entitlement for a horse). That he was able to get success with the Glazers disguised the structural problems and the new manager didn't have his built up credibility or the support of a strong executive (Gill) to argue that football considerations should be part of the strategy. Instead they got Woodward from their London office.

It would be interesting to see how Moyes would have got on if supported properly. With hindsight what he did at Everton looks better and he is reborn at West Ham. He inherited Fergie's team and got nothing to spend. They refused to buy Fellaini early in the summer when he had a release clause and then bought him late in the window at a premium. Mata came in January when they were struggling. Subsequent managers have had much better support, but much of it has been wasted as they tried to patch up a dysfunctional team with little thought for the long-term. Backing Moyes with serious money to rebuild the team might have been a good investment with long term benefits on and off the field.

Long may the short-sightedness continue.
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All spot on imo. Most of the quality players that they did have under Ferguson in the last season were mostly getting up there in age. Where Ferguson did incredibly well rebuilding and bringing in younger players earlier in his career that stopped towards the end. Of course related to the takeover, but still.
 
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