Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

[scaramanga]

Haven't you been told? You do know that there is medication available these days for the likes of you?

The fact that you laugh at his conspiracy theories but are unaware of how similar yours are is quite funny.

 

[scaramanga]

I actually had a longer post, but my phone screwed it.
Yes and no.
Proven, as in past tense - yes.
But like with any business, it's the organisational and cultural change that defines whether it NOW can be done.
At civil service level, it can be done now. There is still a little way to go to improve governance, but in general there are now enough people with good private sector experience and business acumen to run a something as a non departmental government body efficiently.
I have been both sides of the fence. We also have incredibly successful business people involved at a non exec level.
(Queue Scara being - "why would anyone do that?". Think of it like a parent being on a PTA committee. Although for a small fee.)

Politicians are still an issue though. As is short cycle political thinking. But we are chipping away.

How do you benchmark without competition?

The CEO of East Coast Mainline said as much himself - he was able to make a public company successful by benchmarking against his competition from the private sector.

 

[parklane1]

Thread appears to have gone a bit Infowars...

Conspiracy theory abounds.

 

[scaramanga]

Exactly! You can't open up railways or energy to genuine free market competition! It's obvious right. Nor can you for water and sewage. it is an example of how an ideology overpowered simple logic. (telecoms might be different with mobile masts and virgin laying their own fibre cable).

Telecoms providers didn't always have their own masts and cables. Yet they have lots of competition which has resulted in low prices and high quality. Same goes for energy.

600m now because they're building a super sewer so brick doesn't flow into the Thames, more in other years. But this is every year...10 billion a decade...just for one water utility comany that covers London.... Would you prefer wasteful government, where people pay more taxes, rather than threaten your ideology? Follow beliefs, but don't forget to think for yourself....

I don't understand what you're trying to say. You refer to governments and their expenditure as wasteful, yet you want to deliver money from the pockets of customers into their grubby hands so that they can waste it?

 

[DTA]

@DTA ....my question was in response @AuroRaman 's post regarding jewish conspiracy...I were being sincere in asking the question to him as I'm to you ..

Do you believe conspiracy exists? Do you discount the possibility of any conspiracy at all, other than the one perpetrated by Farage, Banks and Putin against the British people?

Conspiracy exists but not in the places you are looking.

If you want to to know why so many refugees AND immigrants are coming in to Europe, you need to look at the state of their countries, war torn and poor. It's for a safer more prosperous future for themselves and families... Not to irradicate the 'white race' (what the fudge is the 'white race' anyway? where do you as a Greek (if I remember correctly) fit into this so called 'whiteness'?

 

[glasgowspur]

I believe the terminology nowadays is Jewspiracy, Scara.

The most recent one I’ve heard is that by making a very large percentage of the global Western population gay/gender neutral through propaganda, the Jews are well on the path to eradicating the White race.

Seems odd, the majority of Jews being white and all, but don’t tell that to my mate Alan who used to be an accountant but now spends his time making podcasts and YouTube vids about it all and sneering at everyone on Facebook for not arming themselves with the facts.

One of his mates the other day said that she didn’t feel sorry for rape victims who had abortions (another Jewspiracy to control the population). I sadly had to unfriend him because he was providing much entertainment up to that point.




Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk

I was listening to the radio the other and iirc it was an Israeli ex government member saying Israel will be in the deep stuff in the next 25 years because of the rise of orthodox Jews who won't serve in the military, work the sabbath etc.
So not really a very well thought out conspiracy.

 

[SpurMeUp]

Telecoms providers didn't always have their own masts and cables. Yet they have lots of competition which has resulted in low prices and high quality. Same goes for energy.

That's not really the case. BT became megga rich because they owned and ran the infrastructure. Hence them going into football broadcasting - they had oodles of cash to burn. They had no effective competion. Other companies are then not really competing as they are all offering the same serive, just branded differently, and hence they are all more or less the same price and same speed.

I don't understand what you're trying to say. You refer to governments and their expenditure as wasteful, yet you want to deliver money from the pockets of customers into their grubby hands so that they can waste it?

So they can cut your taxes. Or spend it on education or whatever.

Is there anyone else you have ever meet who will argue a point quite like you - when they themselves know it doesn't add up? Have to hand it to you for staunch loyality to your dogma and sheer pigheadedness.

 

[scaramanga]

That's not really the case. BT became megga rich because they owned and ran the infrastructure. Hence them going into football broadcasting - they had oodles of cash to burn. They had no effective competion. Other companies are then not really competing as they are all offering the same serive, just branded differently, and hence they are all more or less the same price and same speed.

They're all about the same service and price because the market had balanced itself almost perfectly. All the providers have reached an equilibrium whereby the service is both very good and very cheap.

So they can cut your taxes. Or spend it on education or whatever.

I don't want the government to spend money on education, I want customers to in a free and open market.

The government doesn't need income to cut my taxes, it just needs to spend less.

Is there anyone else you have ever meet who will argue a point quite like you - when they themselves know it doesn't add up? Have to hand it to you for staunch loyality to your dogma and sheer pigheadedness.

Just because you don't understand my concepts it doesn't mean they don't make sense. Without wanting to sounds rude (and I genuinely don't) your posts bely a fairly limited understanding of economics and business in the real world. Suggestions such as perfecting a process without competition or benchmarking, needlessly cycling money through the public sector and expecting it not to all dwindle away really are the kind of suggestions that stop in the first week of economics 101.

 

[monkeybarry]

How do you benchmark without competition?

The CEO of East Coast Mainline said as much himself - he was able to make a public company successful by benchmarking against his competition from the private sector.

He didn't have alternative product to directly to compare against. No other trains offering the same journey, so no.
If he was benchmarking against similar products, in line with realistic operational delivery and proactively seeking and analysing feedback on customer expectations, then yes he could benchmark and set realistic deliverables.

 

[scaramanga]

He didn't have alternative product to directly to compare against. No other trains offering the same journey, so no.
If he was benchmarking against similar products, in line with realistic operational delivery and proactively seeking and analysing feedback on customer expectations, then yes he could benchmark and set realistic deliverables.

Of course. But if all franchises are nationalised then there's nobody to compare to.

 

[monkeybarry]

Of course. But if all franchises are nationalised then there's nobody to compare to.

You would benchmark against similar products - I assume this is what the East coast mainline guy did. And use solid business analysis tools to create a realistic service delivery.
It is currently completely possible, it just requires thinking outside of a basic business management/economics text book.

I would also argue it encourages innovation, as part of the benchmarking includes comparisons to overseas service delivery (the dept I work in is one of the world's best for what we do - so we have plenty of link ups with worldwide partners to share and develop best practice. As a result we are also harsh critics of ourselves.).

The above comes down to employing staff who have service delivery as a core driver for personal achievement (as well as career progression - which is where the money comes in of course. Along with performance based financial incentives).

 

[SpurMeUp]

They're all about the same service and price because the market had balanced itself almost perfectly. All the providers have reached an equilibrium whereby the service is both very good and very cheap.

D-

They are not "about" the same service. They are the same service. All internet lines apart from vigin use the same cable. So it is litterally the same service. If someone cuts the cable in the road, it doesn't matter if you're with Plustnet, BT, TalkTalk whatever, your internet goes off.

The government doesn't need income to cut my taxes, it just needs to spend less.

E-

If the UK Exchequer recieved the £2.8 billion profits instead of BT's shareholders, it is simple arithmetic to see that taxes could be reduced by the same amount. Or are you suggesting the goverment doesn't need to spend any money at all? You are a hoot.

Just because you don't understand my concepts it doesn't mean they don't make sense. Without wanting to sounds rude (and I genuinely don't) your posts bely a fairly limited understanding of economics and business in the real world. Suggestions such as perfecting a process without competition or benchmarking, needlessly cycling money through the public sector and expecting it not to all dwindle away really are the kind of suggestions that stop in the first week of economics 101.

Again, rather than use your own logic, you fall back on things that were taught to you. If you're restricted to economics 101 from the book, you'll never think for yourself.

Economies need competition and free enterprise. That is obvious. No one is suggesting communism with the state running companies. If you seperated government from a given publicly owned industry and simply had the Exchequer as a passive share holder (aka us) then let these companies behave exactly like they do now as private entities. The people get the dividends, and benifit from competition where there is actually competition. True competion doesn't exist with water utility companies or BT. They are monopoly players. Why not have them paying us, rather than paying unknown shareholders who are often taking moeny out of the nation?

 

[thfcsteff]

My experience has been very different. I knew two people who had the same type of cancer. The one in Canada it was picked up in an annual/bi-annual required health check, he had a few days off work for a minor procedure, and was good as new. The one in the UK was diagnosed coming into A&E in agony, and was dead within two weeks. This isn't isolated - we have about the lowest cancer survival rate in the first world, because of late diagnoses.

In trying to make the NHS as cheap as possible, it is just completely reactive. Bandage you up and give you some drugs.

I would support any alternative that introduces pro-activity - regular compulsory health screenings for everyone and preventative treatments.

Just to make it clear. Canada and the US are different systems. The Canadian system is mostly publicly-funded. The US system mostly private. The Canadian system regularly outperforms the US in terms of life stats.

You are making a further point about how the NHS has been attacked IMO. Essentially, what you would support then is proper investment in all areas of the NHS, which has been mismanaged and chipped away at by the Tories for too long.
If you genuinely believe that a shift to the US healthcare model will result in what you want with regards to pro-activity, then you'll just have to trust me (or do the research) and see you will be left sorely disappointed.

https://www.unison.org.uk/news/article/2018/04/healthconf-funding/

 

[thfcsteff]

Okay. I'll re-write it correctly this time ...

Do you totally discount the possibility, that some* rich powerful Jewish people see themselves as the chosen ones and are motivated by revenge against white Europeans, for what they see as crimes against their people?

yes or no?

I think you should be ashamed. Do you have a whole collection of conspiracy theories along these prejudicial lines. "Crimes against their people"? Are you a Chelsea supporter in disguise? I am so SICK of this brick. It is EXACTLY how the Nazis slid into power back in the '30s in Germany. Don't pretend otherwise, although I am sure you will now tell me you're "offended" to read what I have just said. I was offended to read what you wrote.

 

[thfcsteff]

Conspiracy is why rape Pakistani rape gangs have been getting away with raping and abusing young white girls from working class families, in northern working class towns and cities, whilst the local police and Labour "working class" councilors were oblivious. Isn't that right @Gilzeantoscore oh great defender of the working classes.

I happen to believe that when liv ing in a society there should be a level of integration into that society, thus I have little time for Sharia communities who choose to thumb a nose at the country they have chosen to live in. But what "conspiracy" are you talking about? It is the lack of distinction between sharia communities and average muslim families which ends up perpetuating the issues and giving extremists the breeding grounds to convert. FWIW some of those extremist communities abuse and murder their own daughters, sisters and wives. It is their religious extremism which drives them to do it, not their race. Why make it a race issue? That's the sort of flimflam that fudgetard Tommy Robinson tries on.

I would further wager there are far more WHITE "working class" people "getting away with raping and abusing young WHITE girls" than Asian. How about focussing on ALL of them, Asian, white, whoever is abusing girls of whatever color should be severely dealt with.

As for your "working class" thing, I grew up on a council estate and remember well Thatcher's England. If you really want to see who is taking the working class up the swannee, look no further than Farage and Brexit. If Brexiteers get their wish, you will soon see that far from a brave new world of trading possibilities, we will be an isolated country in need of a "big protector" like the US, who will then treat us a slave partner. Unless you envision a world where the globe suddenly cries out for tons of Wenslydale and Red Leicester, because beyond English cheeses, I don't actually see a whole lot we have to offer when it comes to trade that others (such as the US) don't already have.

 

[thfcsteff]

I don't want the government to spend money on education, I want customers to in a free and open market.

... needlessly cycling money through the public sector and expecting it not to all dwindle away really are the kind of suggestions that stop in the first week of economics 101.

You don't want the standard of national education to be be raised? You'd rather good education became the providence of those who can afford it? My word...frightning...

As for "needlessly cycling money through the public sector" I think you'll find that even a 3% cut in the defense budget would see the education system and NHS systems return to full glory. The sad fact is we are locked into a fear-based economy, thus the needs of a functional society get politicized and instead we are told how unsafe we are and how vulnerable our daily existence is, leading to over-spending on munitions and defense.

 

[AuroRaman]

I happen to believe that when liv ing in a society there should be a level of integration into that society, thus I have little time for Sharia communities who choose to thumb a nose at the country they have chosen to live in. But what "conspiracy" are you talking about? It is the lack of distinction between sharia communities and average muslim families which ends up perpetuating the issues and giving extremists the breeding grounds to convert. FWIW some of those extremist communities abuse and murder their own daughters, sisters and wives. It is their religious extremism which drives them to do it, not their race. Why make it a race issue? That's the sort of flimflam that fudgetard Tommy Robinson tries on.

I would further wager there are far more WHITE "working class" people "getting away with raping and abusing young WHITE girls" than Asian. How about focussing on ALL of them, Asian, white, whoever is abusing girls of whatever color should be severely dealt with.

As for your "working class" thing, I grew up on a council estate and remember well Thatcher's England. If you really want to see who is taking the working class up the swannee, look no further than Farage and Brexit. If Brexiteers get their wish, you will soon see that far from a brave new world of trading possibilities, we will be an isolated country in need of a "big protector" like the US, who will then treat us a slave partner. Unless you envision a world where the globe suddenly cries out for tons of Wenslydale and Red Leicester, because beyond English cheeses, I don't actually see a whole lot we have to offer when it comes to trade that others (such as the US) don't already have.

The race/ethnicity of these gangs and individuals is always at the forefront of the conversation yet the common denominator that’s never mentioned is the gender of them.....there’s your fudging issue, not someone from Kilburn or someone from Kirachi.


Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk

 

[scaramanga]

You would benchmark against similar products - I assume this is what the East coast mainline guy did. And use solid business analysis tools to create a realistic service delivery.
It is currently completely possible, it just requires thinking outside of a basic business management/economics text book.

I would also argue it encourages innovation, as part of the benchmarking includes comparisons to overseas service delivery (the dept I work in is one of the world's best for what we do - so we have plenty of link ups with worldwide partners to share and develop best practice. As a result we are also harsh critics of ourselves.).

The above comes down to employing staff who have service delivery as a core driver for personal achievement (as well as career progression - which is where the money comes in of course. Along with performance based financial incentives).

He benchmarked against the other franchises. He himself has said the nationalisation would ruin the industry as without benchmarking against each other, they would all go to brick.

 

[scaramanga]

You don't want the standard of national education to be be raised? You'd rather good education became the providence of those who can afford it? My word...frightning...

As for "needlessly cycling money through the public sector" I think you'll find that even a 3% cut in the defense budget would see the education system and NHS systems return to full glory. The sad fact is we are locked into a fear-based economy, thus the needs of a functional society get politicized and instead we are told how unsafe we are and how vulnerable our daily existence is, leading to over-spending on munitions and defense.

The state doesn't have to stop being a customer to open up the market, it simply has to stop being a provider.

I'd say the most hotly contested part of the market in a few education system would be the bottom price point. This is where most customers would be, this is where most providers would be.

That level of competition would lead to far greater efficiencies, innovation, etc. Currently all the shot state schools try to emulate the good private ones. In a purely private system, the best work would likely come from the poorer end of the scale.

As for government budgets, you're looking at this all wrong. It's not your fault, this has been ingrained into you by successive militant socialist Labour party officials. More money does not equal a better service. If one has a broken hose pipe, opening the tap more will only increase the volume of water tinkled out the leak.

 

[monkeybarry]

He benchmarked against the other franchises. He himself has said the nationalisation would ruin the industry as without benchmarking against each other, they would all go to brick.

So he didn't benchmark against a competitor. The point of benchmarking in the private sector is to where you sit in the industry sector and set price etc accordingly.

The railways are a network, not a set of comparable products. A nationalisation would still see a set of distinct routes, which could be benchmarked against in the same as you can now. The difference is it would run purely as a public service and not to make profit for a few people. Granted the profit margins are small and generally restricted, but there is still little benefit to the model.