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Who else would you sell before the end of the transfer window?

Which would you sell?

  • Soldado

    Votes: 30 38.0%

  • Adebayor

    Votes: 69 87.3%

  • Chiriches

    Votes: 67 84.8%

  • Carroll

    Votes: 24 30.4%

  • Dembele

    Votes: 10 12.7%

  • Townsend

    Votes: 34 43.0%

  • Lamela

    Votes: 5 6.3%
  • Total voters
    79
DublinSpur said:
No we don't. You're missing the point. I'm talking about planning for injuries and building in flexibility. You then cite some teams who suffered no serious injuries in defence all season and who *did* have cover but just didn't need them.



Chelsea won the league with Terry, Cahill, Zouma, Aké and Christensen (along with Ivanovic who can cover that position). The three main guys all stayed on top form and remained injury free so the back-ups only featured in 6 games between them. But they were there!

City finished 2nd with Kompany, Demichelis, Mangala and Boyata (plus at least two top quality full-backs who are comfortable in that role).

"Arsenal 3rd with Koscielny, Mertesacker and Gabriel joining halfway through". But you forgot to mention their back-ups... Hayden and Chambers; both of whom got match time at centre back during the season - albeit very little, because - once again - the main guys remained injury free.

Those back up players would have spent more time on the pitch if Mertesacker or Terry or Kompany had spent a lengthy spell on the sidelines due to injury. Their respective managers were glad they didn't need them; but they didn't go into the season without the back-ups. Of course, in an ideal world you wouldn't need a big squad with a spare CB. But personally I never again want to see us in the kind of situation where we're forced to play Capoue at centre-back, or fielding a back four that includes Jenas and Huddlestone.

I suspect we're not going to agree on this though. So we'll just have to accept that I want more contingency built into the defence than you do. But it's just plain wrong to say that Chelsea only had 3 CBs when - in fact - they had five but were fortunate enough to only need three. Which is exactly what I'm proposing.
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It's not plain wrong at all, none of those players you mentioned are first team CBs, with most being no further along in their development than Veljkovic or CCV. They all had three first team players and young back ups, we're going to have five first team(and that's assuming Chiriches leaves). Having Isaac Hayden or Andreas Christensen kicking around somewhere as emergency backup isn't the same as a 28 year old Fazio on sizeable wages depreciating in value by the week.
 
We are no longer working with a group of CB's who are continually crocked though. All these years with the squad covering for King, Gallas and Kaboul meant we have got used to having a large number of CB's.

I'm with Yoof on this. CCV and Veljkovic could easily by our fifth choice cover.
 
Probably for CCV, he's younger and could get cup games and U21 games for half a season before a loan somewhere. Veljkovic on the other hand needs regular first team football now, the bonus is that he has played as a DM during his development so could cover there if we don't sign a dedicated DM before the window closes.
 
DublinSpur said:
Chelsea won the league with Terry, Cahill, Zouma, Aké and Christensen (along with Ivanovic who can cover that position). The three main guys all stayed on top form and remained injury free so the back-ups only featured in 6 games between them. But they were there!

City finished 2nd with Kompany, Demichelis, Mangala and Boyata (plus at least two top quality full-backs who are comfortable in that role).

"Arsenal 3rd with Koscielny, Mertesacker and Gabriel joining halfway through". But you forgot to mention their back-ups... Hayden and Chambers; both of whom got match time at centre back during the season - albeit very little, because - once again - the main guys remained injury free.

Those back up players would have spent more time on the pitch if Mertesacker or Terry or Kompany had spent a lengthy spell on the sidelines due to injury. Their respective managers were glad they didn't need them; but they didn't go into the season without the back-ups. Of course, in an ideal world you wouldn't need a big squad with a spare CB. But personally I never again want to see us in the kind of situation where we're forced to play Capoue at centre-back, or fielding a back four that includes Jenas and Huddlestone.

I suspect we're not going to agree on this though. So we'll just have to accept that I want more contingency built into the defence than you do. But it's just plain wrong to say that Chelsea only had 3 CBs when - in fact - they had five but were fortunate enough to only need three. Which is exactly what I'm proposing.
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Kompany only played 23 premier league games last season - isn't that a lengthy spell out of the side?
 
So are we counting Wimmer as a possible stating CB seeing as we have jus bought him to the Prem?. We get rid of Vlad and that leaves us with Jan, Toby, Dier and Fazio which makes 4 not 5.
 
parklane1 said:
So are we counting Wimmer as a possible stating CB seeing as we have jus bought him to the Prem?. We get rid of Vlad and that leaves us with Jan, Toby, Dier and Fazio which makes 4 not 5.
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I'm suggesting we start the season with 5 CBs including Wimmer (i.e. get rid of Chiriches, but keep Fazio). I believe we need plenty of injury cover and squad depth in defence. Others are saying it's sufficient to start the season with 4 CBs including Wimmer (i.e. get rid of Fazio and Chiriches).

I don't think anyone's going to be changing their position any time soon though. If we get to the end of the season without a major injury crisis, then the "sell Fazio" side will appear vindicated. If Vertonghen and Dier both get injured at the same time, then (I believe) keeping Fazio will immediately look like the obvious right decision.

My point is that you lose more than you gain by offloading Fazio and failing to prepare for the worst. And the downside of keeping him at the club are fairly small.
 
DublinSpur said:
I'm suggesting we start the season with 5 CBs including Wimmer (i.e. get rid of Chiriches, but keep Fazio). I believe we need plenty of injury cover and squad depth in defence. Others are saying it's sufficient to start the season with 4 CBs including Wimmer (i.e. get rid of Fazio and Chiriches).

I don't think anyone's going to be changing their position any time soon though. If we get to the end of the season without a major injury crisis, then the "sell Fazio" side will appear vindicated. If Vertonghen and Dier both get injured at the same time, then (I believe) keeping Fazio will immediately look like the obvious right decision.

My point is that you lose more than you gain by offloading Fazio and failing to prepare for the worst. And the downside of keeping him at the club are fairly small.
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I agree with you. It was more asking others why if Chambers could not be counted as a CB for the Arse why should Wimmer be counted as he has never played in the Prem.
 
parklane1 said:
I agree with you. It was more asking others why if Chambers could not be counted as a CB for the Arse why should Wimmer be counted as he has never played in the Prem.
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Doesn't make much sense to me either. Apparently the Chelsea and Arsenal back-ups are "nobodies" so they don't count. But I don't see how they are any different to Wimmer or Dier last year (it's unlikely we'd have seen much of Dier if Kaboul hadn't effectively ruled himself out of the squad or if Chiriches had stepped up a level). As it was, we needed our back up CB last season and thankfully he came good. If Terry had gotten injured last season and Nathan Aké had been called on to step up and play a bunch of games, he wouldn't be a "nobody" today.
 
parklane1 said:
So are we counting Wimmer as a possible stating CB seeing as we have jus bought him to the Prem?. We get rid of Vlad and that leaves us with Jan, Toby, Dier and Fazio which makes 4 not 5.
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Last season we just had Vertonghen, Kaboul and Chiriches then by that logic as Fazio and Dier have just been brought to the Premier League.
 
Modric THFC said:
Last season we just had Vertonghen, Kaboul and Chiriches then by that logic as Fazio and Dier have just been brought to the Premier League.
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Last year we had 5; Vertonghen, Kaboul, Chiriches, Fazio and Dier.

Kaboul may as well have been injured all season and Chiriches didn't perform to expectations. So the other three got plenty of game time. That's all I'm suggesting for this season; having the same level of risk management. However you slice it, Chelsea had five registered CBs in their first team squad last season. As did most teams in European competition. The fact that some didn't get used doesn't negate the fact that they are there just in case they are needed.
 
DublinSpur said:
Doesn't make much sense to me either. Apparently the Chelsea and Arsenal back-ups are "nobodies" so they don't count. But I don't see how they are any different to Wimmer or Dier last year (it's unlikely we'd have seen much of Dier if Kaboul hadn't effectively ruled himself out of the squad or if Chiriches had stepped up a level). As it was, we needed our back up CB last season and thankfully he came good. If Terry had gotten injured last season and Nathan Aké had been called on to step up and play a bunch of games, he wouldn't be a "nobody" today.
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As you say some have selective memory syndrome.
 
parklane1 said:
So are we counting Wimmer as a possible stating CB seeing as we have jus bought him to the Prem?. We get rid of Vlad and that leaves us with Jan, Toby, Dier and Fazio which makes 4 not 5.
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And Dier I would put in the same experience category as someone like Zouma.
In reality we have 3 experienced CBs and 2 developing CBs
 
Chelsea were flush with back up options as their 4th choice CB was also their first choice RB (Ivanovic). Chambers actually started the season at CB for Arsenal, but for me he fell into the same category as Dier, being the young up and coming player that needed rotating in and out. I still think three experienced CB's and a young up and coming player is what we should aim for.

A point regarding Fazio: If the guy gets so few games how match sharp is he going to be if we do have to draft him in?
 
Dier and Wimmer are not the same as Ake, Christensen and Hayden. The first two have 88 top flight appearances between them. The other three have 6. I merely forgot about Chambers as most of his game time was spent as a back up right back. Dier and Wimmer are young CBs, but they are 1st team CBs, just because they came from Portugal and Germany respectively doesn't mean all their previous experience is wiped from the record books. Veljkovic and CCV are comparable to those others listed but if we'd never signed Wimmer and Alderweireld and used the first two instead then people on here would say we only had three CBs(or two now because apparently Dier doesn't count), so you can't apply one rule for us and another for the rest. Bottom line is we have five first team CBs(plus Chiriches), all of whom cost sizeable amounts in transfer fees, all are on first team wages and all will be expecting to play.

I don't dislike Fazio, he's just a victim of poor squad planning so I hope he goes, for our sake and his.
 
Cochise said:
Chelsea were flush with back up options as their 4th choice CB was also their first choice RB (Ivanovic). Chambers actually started the season at CB for Arsenal, but for me he fell into the same category as Dier, being the young up and coming player that needed rotating in and out. I still think three experienced CB's and a young up and coming player is what we should aim for.

A point regarding Fazio: If the guy gets so few games how match sharp is he going to be if we do have to draft him in?
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Fazio is our only defender who is strong in the air, so there are quite a few games we'll need him.

I still think Wimmer will get an EPL loan
 
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