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The Official 2016/17 Premier League Thread

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Those are not actual flags.
 
speaking of adverts - listen to a few podcasts and every other one has Emirates Marketing Project tickets for sale - thought they sold out every week and the 100's of empties were just no shows
 
I really don't get the "Fraudiola" viewpoint. Is this just hyperbole or something? Or just good old English bias against a foreign manager?

He took over a good squad, but an ageing squad where most of the key players had injury or fitness issues and where only a few players actually fit his style of play. He's spent money, but he's primarily spent money on younger players that will most likely be better in 5 years than they are now. He's trusted his approach to football and looked to build a culture and style of play at the club despite the obvious short term problems it's caused him.

He's actually trying to build up Emirates Marketing Project to a point where they'll be able to pose a realistic challenge to the biggest clubs in Europe on a somewhat regular basis. People complain about short-termism in football and managers just spending money on immediate superstars. Guardiola essentially takes the opposite approach at a club with a lot of money and that's a sign of him not being good because he's not a runway success in his first season?

Finally they're actually third. Mourinho and Wenger would be delighted to be where Guardiola has City in his first season. The only reason they're not in a title challenge at the moment (along with us) is that Chelsea is currently on course to winning the title with 93 points - the highest in years and years. Most other years they would be right in the middle of a title challenge right now. And as controversial as the "Leicester are lucky" conversation was last season I really feel that Chelsea have had a bit of luck go their way this season in some important games. Though they're obviously also a very good team.
 
braineclipse said:
I really don't get the "Fraudiola" viewpoint. Is this just hyperbole or something? Or just good old English bias against a foreign manager?

He took over a good squad, but an ageing squad where most of the key players had injury or fitness issues and where only a few players actually fit his style of play. He's spent money, but he's primarily spent money on younger players that will most likely be better in 5 years than they are now. He's trusted his approach to football and looked to build a culture and style of play at the club despite the obvious short term problems it's caused him.

He's actually trying to build up Emirates Marketing Project to a point where they'll be able to pose a realistic challenge to the biggest clubs in Europe on a somewhat regular basis. People complain about short-termism in football and managers just spending money on immediate superstars. Guardiola essentially takes the opposite approach at a club with a lot of money and that's a sign of him not being good because he's not a runway success in his first season?

Finally they're actually third. Mourinho and Wenger would be delighted to be where Guardiola has City in his first season. The only reason they're not in a title challenge at the moment (along with us) is that Chelsea is currently on course to winning the title with 93 points - the highest in years and years. Most other years they would be right in the middle of a title challenge right now. And as controversial as the "Leicester are lucky" conversation was last season I really feel that Chelsea have had a bit of luck go their way this season in some important games. Though they're obviously also a very good team.
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It's just funny, mate - no need to overanalyze it. :p Plus, it's also probably because of his career trajectory - he's only ever been at mega clubs that have the world's best players or limitless money to acquire them. That instills doubt in people's minds - will he be able to do it in more fiscally restrained circumstances? Thus, every setback becomes the 'exposure' that we were all implictly waiting for. :p
 
I think Guardiola will have a really good team at City with another transfer window in the summer, but that's the bonus of being at one of the richest clubs. Spend, spend, spend, eventually he will have enough good players to perform how he wants them to.
 
the dza said:
I think Guardiola will have a really good team at City with another transfer window in the summer, but that's the bonus of being at one of the richest clubs. Spend, spend, spend, eventually he will have enough good players to perform how he wants them to.
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I agree they will improve, but it's going to take some time as at both Barcelona and Bayern he had "teams" with a plan, City have never had that, they have managed to win through individual performances from world class players. I'm sure with the money they have they will get better defenders, but they will be still competing with United, Chelsea and possibly Woolwich and Liverpool who all need to buy.
 
braineclipse said:
I really don't get the "Fraudiola" viewpoint. Is this just hyperbole or something? Or just good old English bias against a foreign manager?

He took over a good squad, but an ageing squad where most of the key players had injury or fitness issues and where only a few players actually fit his style of play. He's spent money, but he's primarily spent money on younger players that will most likely be better in 5 years than they are now. He's trusted his approach to football and looked to build a culture and style of play at the club despite the obvious short term problems it's caused him.

He's actually trying to build up Emirates Marketing Project to a point where they'll be able to pose a realistic challenge to the biggest clubs in Europe on a somewhat regular basis. People complain about short-termism in football and managers just spending money on immediate superstars. Guardiola essentially takes the opposite approach at a club with a lot of money and that's a sign of him not being good because he's not a runway success in his first season?

Finally they're actually third. Mourinho and Wenger would be delighted to be where Guardiola has City in his first season. The only reason they're not in a title challenge at the moment (along with us) is that Chelsea is currently on course to winning the title with 93 points - the highest in years and years. Most other years they would be right in the middle of a title challenge right now. And as controversial as the "Leicester are lucky" conversation was last season I really feel that Chelsea have had a bit of luck go their way this season in some important games. Though they're obviously also a very good team.
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As other have said, his previous success has been in clubs where he had the biggest chequebook in league +best squad, and 85% (yes, I made that number up) of league games could be won sleep walking

- Don't feel sorry re the aging squad comment, he's got endless money to solve that problem
- If he has actually bought players for 5 years from now, he should be fired on the spot, that is neither his or the clubs mandate, they hired Pep to win now.
- The reason they aren't leading now is they can't defend for brick, and he says stupid brick like the game isn't about tackles (or something like that)
- His treatment of Aquero is borderline bizzare

Conte had far more work to do after the mess of Jose last season and has shown what a good coach that understands the basics and the grind of competitive leagues can do. Pep has had no disadvantage, is supposedly the world's best coach and yet no one can honestly say City play better now (consistently) than they did last year.

Not saying he's a brick coach, but most coaches would have that team in top 4 ..
 
afsoc4life said:
Fraudiola is a fraud simply because he relies on the chequebook at the best club in each league he is in.
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but that's a skill too, plenty have failed with limitless funds

sure it's different to managing in lower leagues, but it's a different game, with such fine lines between success and failure, even the best managers can only do so much it makes perfect sense to get the best tools you can

(there's an assist for a Toure joke)

i think it will be a learning curve for him too, but look at the Madrid side (and the managers) he kept at bay in Spain
 
@galeforce, Madrid didnt have the talent to match up to Barcelona. Watch Ronaldinho's destruction of them pre-Guardiola. Pep had the most dangerous midfield and forwards in Spain. Xavi, Iniesta and Messi. Also look at his transfer spending in Barcelona. I am not convinced that Pep can pick up a club like Spurs and improve it without a massive cheque book. One key thing that should also worry City is that their Academy's products are not even being considered for the squad with all the monies spent. At the moment, City's academy is the hot draw in Manchester however once youth realise that United gives the better career wrt playing time, things would change.
 
afsoc4life said:
@galeforce, Madrid didnt have the talent to match up to Barcelona. Watch Ronaldinho's destruction of them pre-Guardiola. Pep had the most dangerous midfield and forwards in Spain. Xavi, Iniesta and Messi. Also look at his transfer spending in Barcelona. I am not convinced that Pep can pick up a club like Spurs and improve it without a massive cheque book. One key thing that should also worry City is that their Academy's products are not even being considered for the squad with all the monies spent. At the moment, City's academy is the hot draw in Manchester however once youth realise that United gives the better career wrt playing time, things would change.
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I disagree with your rating of Madrid, there was never really that much of a gap imo, it was the same core of players which Madrid have won two out of the last three EC's with

i'm not sure he could pick up a club like us either, but he's not being asked to, and that's a different skill set, the business plan at city is to buy a load of superstars and make it work, if there is one knock against Pep it's his inability to handle headstrong players such as The Zlatan, but if he's given carte blanche to build a side that shouldn't really matter as he won't be signing any, although you could argue he has cracked this with Toure

I doubt the ownership are that bothered about the academy, it's good PR to have one and i'm sure the people who work there are doing a diligent coaching job anyway so it might produce something, but it's certainly not the plan to rely on it
 
galeforce said:
I disagree with your rating of Madrid, there was never really that much of a gap imo, it was the same core of players which Madrid have won two out of the last three EC's with

i'm not sure he could pick up a club like us either, but he's not being asked to, and that's a different skill set, the business plan at city is to buy a load of superstars and make it work, if there is one knock against Pep it's his inability to handle headstrong players such as The Zlatan, but if he's given carte blanche to build a side that shouldn't really matter as he won't be signing any, although you could argue he has cracked this with Toure

I doubt the ownership are that bothered about the academy, it's good PR to have one and i'm sure the people who work there are doing a diligent coaching job anyway so it might produce something, but it's certainly not the plan to rely on it
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The owners of Emirates Marketing Project are pouring a lot of money into the Academy. Their goal is to produce quality products from that Academy and in future rely on it. If players like Iheanacho cant get a look in and Pep buys other 19 year olds to replace him, their academy will take a hit. There is a reason young English players would rather move to certain clubs.

I am not sure that Pep has cracked man management with Yaya. He has turned the most dangerous striker, Aguero, in the EPL to something else. Pep is a very stubborn man.
 
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