Mosquito_Coasting
Jonathan Woodgate
You can tell from Suarez's face that he's not exactly saying "hello me old black mucker". It's all screwed up with hate.
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Victimpool FC - Klopp leaving, grown men crying
- Thread starter southstand1882
- Start date
@ Jimmyb
You wrote "Evra wasn't demonised by racists at Anfield any more than Sol Campbell is demonised by racists whenever he comes to the Lane."
Sol Campbell was booed because he left Spurs to play for arsenal and all that he did with it. Its not racist to boo a black player.
Remind yourself why Evra was booed though.
Because a Liverpool player called him a n#gger, and got found out. Who other than a racist prick would boo Evra for that. Even if you have a hang up on the tribunal, how the hell can you boo Evra?
Suarez admitted saying it. How come Suarez is the victim of language breakdown, but Evra doesnt have that benefit? EVEN if Evra did take it the "wrong" way, why is he not the victim?
You wrote "Evra wasn't demonised by racists at Anfield any more than Sol Campbell is demonised by racists whenever he comes to the Lane."
Sol Campbell was booed because he left Spurs to play for arsenal and all that he did with it. Its not racist to boo a black player.
Remind yourself why Evra was booed though.
Because a Liverpool player called him a n#gger, and got found out. Who other than a racist prick would boo Evra for that. Even if you have a hang up on the tribunal, how the hell can you boo Evra?
Suarez admitted saying it. How come Suarez is the victim of language breakdown, but Evra doesnt have that benefit? EVEN if Evra did take it the "wrong" way, why is he not the victim?
Even in spanish it can be offensive. It depends how you use it. He used it with intent to insult. Thats racist.
What dont you get?
Do you think two people having a heated, ongoing row, and when one slags off the others family (from what Ive heard, and if so, also out of order), that the other replies with "listen black person..."
Take your head out the sand and stop being so silly. Its really a lost cause. The evidence was strong enought to convict, and that doesnt change no matter how many people want to paint Suarez as the real victim.
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They didnt need to prove he said it
He admitted it.
Papercut
Jermaine Jenas
Add to that - he's spent circa 5 years in Holland, played a number of internationals around the World. I honestly do not believe he's as naive as he's trying to make out,
And saying he has a black grandparent (I think), that's another weak argument.
You might well have spent time in South America (I have too, by the way) but that doesn't mean that you are necessarily intimately familiar with Latin American culture and the South American Spanish vernacular.
In your time there, you might never have heard the words "negro" or "negrito" used in the context described. But the context very much exists. And it is common. It's an unarguable fact, fella.
Agreed that Liverpool played the whole situation very badly.
As to Suarez, he admitted that he did say the word. He only denied that he meant it as a racial slur.
By the way, did Evra apologize for his slur - against Suarez and his family? Was he punished?
The mere fact that Suarez looked angry isn't evidence of racism. I repeat the example I used earlier in the discussion:
"For fudge's sake, you're really tinkling me off, mate. You're behaving like a total clam. fudge off."
"Mate", in English, may not mean exactly the same thing as "negro" in Spanish. But the example does show how a harmless and friendly word can be used in the midst of an angry exchange.
With respect, you're still missing the point, fella.
Liverpool fans don't believe that Suarez had any racist intent. They believe that he is a victim of cultural misunderstanding.
Whether or not they are right to do so is irrelevant. The point is that their support for Suarez is not, in their eyes, support for a racist.
And their booing of Evra is therefore not booing of a victim of racism but rather booing of a player who plays for their most hated rivals; booing a player, moreover, who has admitted that he made vile comments towards Suarez in Spanish and whose word is the sole evidence used to determine Suarez' 8 game ban. Yet, despite Evra's seedy role in the whole affair, he got off scott free.
Imagine that Spurs had had one of our best players banned for eight games, purely on the basis of an Arsenal player's accusation, after that Arsenal player had provoked an incident......you think that Arsenal player wouldn't get booed the next time he came to the Lane.........?
Like fudge, he wouldn't.
Suarez admitted that he used the word. But in a context which is very different to that which Evra claimed he meant it.
The tribunal haven't come remotely close to proving that Suarez said what he said with racist intent.
What I said to Billyiddo
Do you think two people having a heated, ongoing row, and when one slags off the others family (from what Ive heard, and if so, also out of order), that the other replies with "listen black person..."
Take your head out the sand and stop being so silly. Its really a lost cause. The evidence was strong enought to convict, and that doesnt change no matter how many people want to paint Suarez as the real victim.
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You're looking at it from a Western European perspective. Which is understandable.
But Evra addressed Suarez in Spanish. So Suarez naturally responded in the Spanish vernacular.
And as I've pointed out a number of times already in this thread, it's perectly possible to use a harmless word in the midst of an angry exchange.
This
thingonaspring
Radek Cerny
lucky it wasn't the panel to decide that bit then, isn't it. instead, getting language experts in who DO KNOW what is what. and the panel based their decision on what the EXPERTS told them.
except the bit where his ENTIRE DEFENCE was that he said it in a conciliatory manner, in order to be friendly. then when he was asked repeatedly whether that was ACTUALLY TRUE, he evaded the question FOUR TIMES with answers not relevant to the question, and when it was pointed out it was a yes or no answer, he said no it wasn't meant in a friendly conciliatory manner. HE SAID SO himself.
For what exactly?
linnet_spur
Pascal Chimbonda
I didn't but i know where my next holiday is gonnna be
:ross:
yiddo2786
Steed Malbranque
Odd how Liverpool fans were so ready to passionately defend Suarez due to the fact that there wasn't enough concrete evidence (other than Suarez admitting using the word and Evra reacting angrily to it), but they're totally certain that Evra is lying through his teeth even though there is zero evidence whatsoever.
mick cooper
Neil Sullivan
This is the same set of people crying out for justice for the dead 96 Liverpool fans, whilst conveniently forgetting that they were crushed to death by..........Liverpool fans.
Its always someone elses fault.
yiddo2786
Steed Malbranque
It's not a very popular view to have, but I have always felt this. It was a totally awful, horrible thing; I can't imagine how terrible it must be to be crushed to death by the sheer mass of people, but what do they want in terms of justice? What does that mean?
Danishfurniturelover
the prettiest spice girl
Im glad the is someone else on here who thinks this. Hillsborough would never have happened if their fans had not tried to get into a match they did not have tickets for, yes the sun were wrong to print the stories they did and the police and stewards could have reacted better, but they would not have needed to if the scum bag liverpool fans had not tried to get into a game they did not have tickets for.