Danny Rose

[BrainOfLevy]

I'm quite torn on this one. Best outcome obviously is for Rose to realise he is going nowhere, at least for this season, get fit, knuckle down and get his place back. Which means mending bridges with Poch at least, possibly others.
On the other hand, if he is going to be a disgruntled presence around the place, would we be better off selling him now, as long as we can get the same fee we'd get for a fit Danny Rose? (And get in a suitable replacement of course). There's also no sense in letting his transfer value diminish by keeping him benched just for the sake of making a point. Selling now might be better all round, except it then gives the impression that a player can engineer a move through the media. It sends out the wrong message, and keeps the (somewhat-mythical these days) "selling club" tag alive and kicking.
A bit of a conundrum for Poch and Levy.

I think there is value in letting him stick in the reserves to be honest. He's created that hazard for himself. As a club, we can't be seen to let any player kick up a fuss and basically demand a move so publicly and in such a disruptive fashion on the eve of the season and then give him completely and totally what he wants. We just can't do it, no matter how much value we lose in cash terms, the value to showing players that you damn well better at least respect the club (as Walker did) will be more in the future. We need players bought in to the mission. We need other players to know they aren't bigger than that mission. Otherwise we won't continue to punch above our weight.

It's an incredibly difficult one, but I trust Poch and Levy to go the right way. Would be great if we move to Sessegnon and keep Rose this window. Davies has some fit competition to keep him on his toes in RG and Rose is injured anyway. After trying and manfully failing to get back into the first team, we give him his desired transfer out of the club, to Stoke.

The sad thing is, we probably would have been willing to sell him next summer. Just such bizarre actions from a disrespectful toerag.

 

[parklane1]

Bye bye Danny, please close the door on your way out.

 

[Gazza Dazzla]

Poch is really taking this double agent work to the brink isn't he, after all I was told on here that Rose did the interview with Pochs blessing to put pressure on Levy and that the whole squad was behind Rose?...

 

[thfcsteff]

Why would he not be first choice? He's a better player than Davies in most aspects of the game and suits our style of play better than Davies IMO. I definitely get why some fans are unhappy with him but there's no point keeping him on the bench when he regains fitness just to prove a point. As things stand, Rose is still our player, it's a World Cup year so he has no choice but to put a shift in for us until we can find a suitable club to move him on to (assuming the damage is irreparable).

Luka Modric openly stated that he not only wanted to leave but he wanted to play for Chelsea and he walked back into the side no questions asked. Why has what Rose said or did any worse than that?

I am not going to paint Luka as an innocent but he basically said nothing whilst Mamic pushed him around...we are seeing the consequences of THAT relationship!!!


Sitting on my porcelain throne using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app

 

[thfcsteff]

I can't see what they'd gain from doing so - unless Rose's exit in some bizarro deal that gets us Martial and Shaw has already been sorted out, and the only consideration for Levy is mollifying fans. Otherwise, why would it ever be useful to alert the market that he wants out?

If that was on the cards there would be no mollifying necessary IMO as it would represent some great business.


Sitting on my porcelain throne using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app

 

[NaijaSpurs]

Poch is really taking this double agent work to the brink isn't he, after all I was told on here that Rose did the interview with Pochs blessing to put pressure on Levy and that the whole squad was behind Rose?...

 

[Mikey10]

If Rose follows Walker out during this window I believe it could well be the end for this group of players achieving anything. Not because either is irreplaceable, but because we will look weak to our rivals and to those players still here. We will also have significantly strengthened a couple of our immediate competitors. The press will have a field day.

I can't believe for one moment that Poch and Levy will have anything in their minds other than standing absolutely firm on Rose.

 

[Spur of the moment]

Principles vs pragmatism. An unsettled Rose could be a rotten apple in the box. But if we let him go and get in a decent replacement before the window closes we also risk putting out the wrong message.

Just hope Daniel is as good at resolving dilemmas as he is at negotiating transfers.

 

[thfcsteff]

If Rose follows Walker out during this window I believe it could well be the end for this group of players achieving anything. Not because either is irreplaceable, but because we will look weak to our rivals and to those players still here. We will also have significantly strengthened a couple of our immediate competitors. The press will have a field day.

I can't believe for one moment that Poch and Levy will have anything in their minds other than standing absolutely firm on Rose.

I would say you have few worries mate. IF he goes this window it will be because we are getting some unbelievable assets back. Personally-speaking, if there was a deal which included Martial and Shaw, I'd take it! I think he will still be here in Sept though...

 

[awesome dawson]

There isn't enough time left this transfer window for a 'talks' between Rose, his agent and Levy. If he wanted to engineer a move he should have released that interview with the Scum about a month earlier. He's also got fcuk all legs to stand on given he's been getting paid for physio for six months. Foolish.

 

[Spur of the moment]

I would say you have few worries mate. IF he goes this window it will be because we are getting some unbelievable assets back. Personally-speaking, if there was a deal which included Martial and Shaw, I'd take it! I think he will still be here in Sept though...

And Rose would get his wish because he wouldn't need to google those names.

 

[parklane1]

There isn't enough time left this transfer window for a 'talks' between Rose, his agent and Levy. If he wanted to engineer a move he should have released that interview with the Scum about a month earlier. He's also got fcuk all legs to stand on given he's been getting paid for physio for six months. Foolish.

I would suggest foolish is being kind to him, idiot is getting closer ( even that is not sufficent).

 

[Jurgen the German]

Silly boy. We are on the cusp of something amazing at this club and he wants out.

Bury him in the reserves for a season.

What good would that do for us nevermind Rose? His stock would only continue to drop which would mean we would get a lower price than if he plays performs at a similar level to the one he performed at since around the beginning of 2015.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Right, thats one example and a good one, but can you honestly recollect many other times hes been soundly done defensively? My point wasnt to suggest that hes as good as Walker on defensive duties, but that he isnt the significant drop in quality that many suggest....

No offence but how many examples do you need? If a poster gives 3 examples then some people would ask for 4. You can't expect people to remember all of them.

 

[Jurgen the German]

I am not going to paint Luka as an innocent but he basically said nothing whilst Mamic pushed him around...we are seeing the consequences of THAT relationship!!!


Sitting on my porcelain throne using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app

IIRC the quotes about wanting to leave came from Modric himself. There was a comical spoof of his transfer request that did the rounds "no understand word triffic" etc. Jermaine Jenas also admitted that Modric was desperate to leave to go to Chelsea.

I see no reason why Rose shouldn't be ingrained back into the setup. He's a superior player to Davies and we need him back, especially against the likes of Chelsea where you need your "streetwise" players like Alli, Rose, Vertonghen and I'm not his biggest fan but someone like Lamela.

To lose BOTH full backs in the same window to rival clubs would send out a very bad message and it would make me question our ambition to a certain extent. It also leaves us with very little time to replace him. Given how slowly the majority of our transfers take, it doesn't fill me with confidence.

The best solution I can see is we ingrain him back into the team when fit, he regains his place and slowly start to ease him out from 2018 onwards.

 

[Jurgen the German]

I think there is value in letting him stick in the reserves to be honest. He's created that hazard for himself. As a club, we can't be seen to let any player kick up a fuss and basically demand a move so publicly and in such a disruptive fashion on the eve of the season and then give him completely and totally what he wants. We just can't do it, no matter how much value we lose in cash terms, the value to showing players that you damn well better at least respect the club (as Walker did) will be more in the future. We need players bought in to the mission. We need other players to know they aren't bigger than that mission. Otherwise we won't continue to punch above our weight.

It's an incredibly difficult one, but I trust Poch and Levy to go the right way. Would be great if we move to Sessegnon and keep Rose this window. Davies has some fit competition to keep him on his toes in RG and Rose is injured anyway. After trying and manfully failing to get back into the first team, we give him his desired transfer out of the club, to Stoke.

The sad thing is, we probably would have been willing to sell him next summer. Just such bizarre actions from a disrespectful toerag.

I don't there is any value to it. His asking price would only drop the longer we keep in the reserves.

It's not an easy situation for Poch, but if it were me, I would get him back to full fitness ASAP, then reinstall him as the first choice LB but gradually start to leave him out of certain games like Poch did with Walker and sell him next summer, on our terms. I believe he handled the Walker situation about as well as any manager could have handled it.

I realise how much you value Poch's regime and his principles but all clubs go through a similar thing with a player at some point. Ronaldo wanted to leave United, Fergie convinced him to stay one more season. Levy stood firm on Modric and we got another season out of him. This is a World Cup year, Rose knows that and should also realise he has no choice but to give his all for us.

 

[harr1984]

No offence but how many examples do you need? If a poster gives 3 examples then some people would ask for 4. You can't expect people to remember all of them.

No offence taken. He didnt give three examples he gave one. I cant recall Trippier being shown up defensively much, and I dont exactly see a plethora of scenarios to prove me otherwise. Im assuming you recall his defensive deficiencies on several occassions? I just havent really seen an obvious defensive weakness from him yet, and I am happy to be told otherwise as my memory isnt always the best....

 

[Rorschach]

What good would that do for us nevermind Rose? His stock would only continue to drop which would mean we would get a lower price than if he plays performs at a similar level to the one he performed at since around the beginning of 2015.

I point you @BrainOfLevy post above. This is more about player power than money in this instance, IMO. Walker's situation was handled differently because of the way the player behaved. If the club concede to Rose's wishes then a dangerous precedent has been set.

I don't think his value would drop all that much anyway in the space of one season.

 

[Jurgen the German]

I point you @BrainOfLevy post above. This is more about player power than money in this instance, IMO. Walker's situation was handled differently because of the way the player behaved. If the club concede to Rose's wishes then a dangerous precedent has been set.

I don't think his value would drop all that much anyway in the space of one season.

We wouldn't be conceding because he hasn't been given a pay rise AFAIK. All we would be doing is utilising a huge asset to the club on the pitch to the greatest of our ability. We can revisit the possibility of offloading him in a year's time if he still feels the same or if Poch decides he no longer wants/needs him.

As I said previously, plenty of players from our club and other clubs have acted in a similar behaviour and a large number have been re-integrated back into their teams' setup.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

I don't there is any value to it. His asking price would only drop the longer we keep in the reserves.

It's not an easy situation for Poch, but if it were me, I would get him back to full fitness ASAP, then reinstall him as the first choice LB but gradually start to leave him out of certain games like Poch did with Walker and sell him next summer, on our terms. I believe he handled the Walker situation about as well as any manager could have handled it.

I realise how much you value Poch's regime and his principles but all clubs go through a similar thing with a player at some point. Ronaldo wanted to leave United, Fergie convinced him to stay one more season. Levy stood firm on Modric and we got another season out of him. This is a World Cup year, Rose knows that and should also realise he has no choice but to give his all for us.

I think United under Fergie are a great example. If any player did what Rose did under Fergie, I think they'd be dead to him. I don't recall Ronaldo doing anything to a similar extent, and Fergie exercised similar omnipotence at the top of the club, with everyone bought into a plan knowing they couldn't cross him. It meant they always had fantastic team spirit, discipline, character etc. No doubt they sold players when they needed to, but it would be on Fergie's terms. I think Poch is building the club in a similar way, and we need to do it that way if we are going to compete.

If Rose made his protestations in private to Poch, I'm sure Poch would have said something like 'I appreciate your concerns, but we simply can't lose both you and Kyle in one summer. You have my word that we will revisit this next summer if you perform to the same standard', and given how respectfully we handled Walker's wishes, and how respectful Walker was to us, we would have given Rose no reason to believe that we couldn't be trusted.

What Rose did, was just something that can't be swept away. Publicly it has to be so the circus dies down, but it was a massive error of judgement on his part and I don't think it will ever be the same for him again here. Fergie would never let Rose back in if he was Manager. Harry probably would. But Harry is a pragmatist who makes sure players play to their level by giving them freedom. Fergie is a managerial legend who got a ridiculous amount of performance out of bang average players, in large part because of discipline and adherence to a strong plan.