But I dont think anyone is expecting that deliverance right now - Just saying we havent achieved anything as of yet its that simple. Plenty of teams have overachieved throughout the years, they dont get remembered for it unless theyve won things throughout that period....
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Mauricio Pochettino - Sacked
- Thread starter DubaiSpur
- Start date
Gazza
Nick Barmby
Having impatience and knit picking is the disease of this era.
No coach comes out saying that they are not interested in winning things.
Big club is relative ... big compared to west ham small compared to madrid
Poch constantly talks about winning the PL - there are only a small handful of coaches who do that. Where's the impatience? I dont see anyone expecting us to be winning the league right now, I just said we havent achieved anything yet. When we have a poor defeat, everybody gets questioned from the players to the manager - its nothing new. What is the big deal? Are people screaming for Pochs' head? No. I cant ever see that happening to be honest, and rightly so.....
JerusalemMan
Johnny Morrison
I don't level that accusation at you.
However, fans of other clubs have shifted the goalposts about Spurs so much that - up until our recent blip - the only thing they could use to beat us with was that we hadn't won anything yet. And some Spurs fans seem to adopt that yardstick in a way that means they can't truly enjoy what is happening NOW because of some artificial expectation they have seemingly adopted from a non-neutral place.
As for 'they don't get remembered for it', well, I will remember it and my memories & feelings are what matter to me. My joy. My pleasure at watching the team I love.
Though, looking at your post, even when you say that we haven't achieved anything as of yet...is that really true? Of course, as we all acknowledge, nothing has been won. But is that the same as saying nothing has been achieved? I don't like the binary conflation of achievement with winning things because it doesn't ring true to me.
My sense over the last few years, since Arnesen joined, has been one of growth and increasing fulfilment of what I want SPurs to be. Of course there is more to do and further to go but I feel like much has already been achieved and, right now, that is more than enough.
In five years time, if we are stuck in the same place with nothing having been won, I doubt I shall feel the same.
Agree with all of that - to me achievement is more quantifiable. But I mentioned in previous posts how Ive enjoyed watching Spurs week in week out, and since Jol our rise.
Indeed, a few more years should be allowed to determine whether this was another typical Spurs flatter to deceive period, or a truly glory era....
nayimfromthehalfwayline
Luka Modric
A little perspective goes a long way.
City beating us, comprehensively, when we had less than an optimal team - and were in the game for an hour, seems to have kicked this off.
City have a net spend for the last 5 years of £640.43m. And currently an annual wage bill (as of last season) of £244-270m*.
For a bit of perspective, those two numbers alone cover the cost of New WHL (land, planning, construction -the lot) - something that will take our club to new heights over the long term.
Our net spend? £3.51m PROFIT. And our wage bill is now £161.20m.
That people are even getting tinkled off because we arent beating teams like this, in matches or in competitions, speaks volumes for just how well we are doing. By rights we shouldnt even be in the same conversation as them.
*Spend taken from here:
https://www.transfermarkt.com/manchester-city/alletransfers/verein/281
*Wages from here:
http://www.90min.com/posts/5848266-the-20-teams-with-the-highest-wage-bills-in-the-world-of-football
and here
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football...wage-bill-rises-25-244m-pep-guardiolas-first/
City beating us, comprehensively, when we had less than an optimal team - and were in the game for an hour, seems to have kicked this off.
City have a net spend for the last 5 years of £640.43m. And currently an annual wage bill (as of last season) of £244-270m*.
For a bit of perspective, those two numbers alone cover the cost of New WHL (land, planning, construction -the lot) - something that will take our club to new heights over the long term.
Our net spend? £3.51m PROFIT. And our wage bill is now £161.20m.
That people are even getting tinkled off because we arent beating teams like this, in matches or in competitions, speaks volumes for just how well we are doing. By rights we shouldnt even be in the same conversation as them.
*Spend taken from here:
https://www.transfermarkt.com/manchester-city/alletransfers/verein/281
*Wages from here:
http://www.90min.com/posts/5848266-the-20-teams-with-the-highest-wage-bills-in-the-world-of-football
and here
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football...wage-bill-rises-25-244m-pep-guardiolas-first/
Gazza Dazzla
Chris Perry
tickle my balls with a feather Nayim!
Gazza
Nick Barmby
all will be forgiven if we win the champions league
poor performance and everyone has won the champions league ... I refuse to accept this until we, like west ham, win the world cup
We'll do that in the summer -- well, Harry will.
Gazza
Nick Barmby
Just don't call him a wheeler dealer
Mate, you as others do, simply go to the end goal and miss the journey and where we started.
Poch hasn't "been given" 4 years, he's fudging earned it, in case we forget he's got us to CL twice (we had only been once, he did it two years in a row), he's got us to 2nd, something we haven't done in decades, we have seen immense improvement in players, and he's done it on a budget. We beat Real Madrid ffs, the 2X reigning CL champions.
Comparing Poch to any other Spurs manager is a false comparison, all the great Spurs managers didn't have to compete with "cheating/money doping" clubs, and we now have to deal with them in PL as well as Europe. Even so, people miss that Spurs of the last 7 season has results wise (not trophies, just league results) been in the most consistently successful run of the club's history (we haven't finished less than 6th in 7 seasons, only twice lower than 6th in last 12 seasons, previous 13 seasons we never were in top 6).
Here's the thing, Spurs has been amazingly successful in last decade (given where we started in PL era), despite the well documented money disadvantages, and it's a false narrative from the media and opposing fans to suggest anything otherwise. Make no mistake, its the consistency of results that have allowed us to build the training ground and new stadium, and its the CL of last two seasons that will attract a good stadium sponsor, and its all of those things that will make sure Spurs can compete 10 years from now at top levels regardless of who manages or which players leave. A fizzy pop cup would not have done that.
Should we be aiming for titles and trophies = absolutely
Should we panic because it doesn't happen this season = no
Enjoy the fact that we have a manager that represents the club well, has done more for the English game/players than anyone else in a decade or more, has us play some amazing stuff and is preparing us well for our new stadium and more level playing field that will hopefully come with it.
90291Spur
Les Ferdinand
Spot on. And while many of us fans HATE losing, and losing poorly as we've done in the past few weeks, I would wager that none of us have a clue what the long term plan is at the Club. And with Levy at the helm I don't doubt that there is one that goes beyond winning the league this year.
Dear lord this is getting boring now, I agree with everything you say. Where have I said Poch should have won something by now, expect us to of won anything by now or anything of the sort? I’ve acknowledged how he’s improved us. I simply said we haven’t achieved anything, and we haven’t. If this era is going to be recognised as a truly successful one under Poch he’s going to have to win trophies like it or not. Did I say he should have by now? Did I say to this season? No. Just at some point he will have to if he truly wants to go down in history - coming second in the league whilst having the sixth highest wage bill isn’t going to go down in the history books. Poch is insistent on trophies so I really don’t see what the big deal....
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StephenH
David Ginola
This season has seen the rebalancing of the premiership along the lines of spending power.
The last two seasons are in hindsight looking like there was a lot more turbulent for a few of the top sides. That is over with table stacking up along financial lines.
Pochettino will struggle until we work out how to catch firstly the likes of Arsenal and Liverpool.
The last two seasons are in hindsight looking like there was a lot more turbulent for a few of the top sides. That is over with table stacking up along financial lines.
Pochettino will struggle until we work out how to catch firstly the likes of Arsenal and Liverpool.
90291Spur
Les Ferdinand
Maybe a new stadium with increased capacity and hence increased match-day revenues would help? Just a thought.
StephenH
David Ginola
Yes it will help but that will take time.
We need to get real here, we are 6th in financial pecking order. We have done brilliantly under Enic by comparison with the mess that preceded them.
Asking Pochettino to carry on with the current financial handicap and expect the same results as recently is slightly unrealistic of us all. Pochettino has done well but he is not a miracle worker. Well not as much as the past few seasons!
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Do we even know if Levy is going to increase budgets with the extra revenue? I mean I know we all assume so to some degree, but has he said anything on the matter?
Lemonade Money
Steffen Freund
Isn't that Levy's whole reasoning for a new stadium, we need it to compete with wages and fees?