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Fabio Paratici - Consultant

Neither Mane or Wijnaldum went to Liverpool on 4/5 times the wages that we pay. I'm not even sure that the money they were paid by Liverpool at the time they signed was as much as our top earner was getting.

I believe the story at the time was that they offered Mane triple what we did. I concede Mitchell is a slightly better football scout than I am.

If our chief scout is recommending players I’ve already heard of they are not trying hard enough.
 
I believe the story at the time was that they offered Mane triple what we did. I concede Mitchell is a slightly better football scout than I am.

If our chief scout is recommending players I’ve already heard of they are not trying hard enough.
If that's the case then we were offering him £30k a week, which is an insult for a £30+ million player.
 
I believe the story at the time was that they offered Mane triple what we did. I concede Mitchell is a slightly better football scout than I am.

If our chief scout is recommending players I’ve already heard of they are not trying hard enough.
It's not just about recommending little known players, it's also about having an idea of which players already at decent clubs can make another step up. Watching Mane for Liverpool, I think it's clear that him Harry and Son as an attacking three would've been the best attack in the PL and perhaps even across Europe.
 
or he's on about 240k a week, liverpool famously over pay their players, look at henderson
His first deal there was £90k a week, he then signed a new deal in November 2018 for £150k a week. Liverpool have been offering him further improved terms of over £200k a week since the end of last season.
 
His first deal there was £90k a week, he then signed a new deal in November 2018 for £150k a week. Liverpool have been offering him further improved terms of over £200k a week since the end of last season.

must have been a massive signing on fee and incentives then, I should imagine we offered at least 60k a week, which would be about right for a lower half PL player with potential, the dippers obviously gambled that it would work out but we can’t risk 90k a week + bonuses on a player who isn’t a definite starter, we always need to factor in moving them on too

it’s fine for our scout to recommend Mane, in 2011
 
must have been a massive signing on fee and incentives then, I should imagine we offered at least 60k a week, which would be about right for a lower half PL player with potential, the dippers obviously gambled that it would work out but we can’t risk 90k a week + bonuses on a player who isn’t a definite starter, we always need to factor in moving them on too

it’s fine for our scout to recommend Mane, in 2011
We offered him parity with Kane at the time (that was reported) of around £100k. I though that was sensible to top heavy as Kane was proven to be top top drawer but in hindsight mane has turned out to be quality

Liverpool offered him £120k

also he has a choice where he goes and i believe he said once Liverpool were interested that was it.

We signed Sissoko over Neverton even though they offered more money as he wanted to come here. It happens

as I’ve said earlier people highlight the successes with transfer vs the failures of their clubs to say some things are wrong

how about comparing son with say Marković who they signed a little bit before son. One is now a £100m player and the other is probably working in a kebab shop
 
must have been a massive signing on fee and incentives then, I should imagine we offered at least 60k a week, which would be about right for a lower half PL player with potential, the dippers obviously gambled that it would work out but we can’t risk 90k a week + bonuses on a player who isn’t a definite starter, we always need to factor in moving them on too

it’s fine for our scout to recommend Mane, in 2011
I’ll add that I said we should look at Mane before he went to Southampton
His stats were excellent and I’d seen him play one game but it was an obvious opportunity signing
Same also with Payet who had the best record in France when the spammers signed him
Some players you can see how good they are on paper and then do the next level with the scouting
I think scouting been made into some kind of art form when a lot of it can be broken into the numbers more and more
 
I’ll add that I said we should look at Mane before he went to Southampton
His stats were excellent and I’d seen him play one game but it was an obvious opportunity signing
Same also with Payet who had the best record in France when the spammers signed him
Some players you can see how good they are on paper and then do the next level with the scouting
I think scouting been made into some kind of art form when a lot of it can be broken into the numbers more and more

Its a science rather than an art IMO, if you have the means to measure all relevant factors of course
 
a DoF only works when the club has an understanding of the direction it is going, the club picks a style of football (not a format just the style) then every manager it picks and player ill fit the style ( not saying that each player will suit the new manager) like Swansea used to do,
Levy is not doing that, we got rid of Poch & got in Jose (totally different football), so now we need players that suit/will work in Jose's style, when jose goes do we go for an front foot manager ? (then maybe 6-8 players don't fit with the new manager)

Mourinho and Poch's fundamental approach is really not all that different.

Both of them focus on lightning-quick transitions - it's at the heart of their styles. Get into the opponent's box within 5 passes after winning the ball back - no unnecessary possession, try the killer ball, go direct, draw the opponent in and use quick balls into spaces behind them to break up the opponent's defensive organization.

Where they do differ is where on the pitch they would like transitions to occur. For Poch, he wanted to enact transitions as high up the pitch as possible - for Mourinho, he wants to enact transitions in a lower block, so there's more space to run into when the quick out-ball is played after winning it back.

That entails differences in where you press - high up, or further back. But note - it doesn't mean *not* pressing. In Mourinho' s case, it's less pressing higher up, which means a higher PPDA (Passes Per Defensive Action) score, but intense pressing still occurs in key zones (the flanks, mostly).

If you think of the great transition in football over the last ten years, it's been the passing of the crown from possession-oriented styles to pressing-oriented styles. Those are the two paradigms which still define football tactics - possession versus pressing, or more accurately, indirect versus direct approaches to chance creation.

Both Poch and Mourinho are on 'direct' end of the scale. Yes, differences exist in terms of fitness levels of their teams (a Poch team will be fitter than any side in the league, just about) and overall mentalities (a Mourinho team will have a disproportionately high percentage of experienced players with 'grinta', the ability to win a game with willpower alone, versus Poch who tended to like young players more).

But I think the transition is not so great, and more thought went into the Poch-Mourinho swap than at first glance.

Our next coach will be an interesting one to watch - I can think of basically no manager out there now who actually subscribes to the possession-oriented philosophy, not even Guardiola. Pressing has massacred passing to that degree. So the question really becomes about fitness levels - our next boss will likely have to fall somewhere on the pectrum between Mourinho and Poch in terms of managing fitness, if we want to keep the similarity and overall philosophy going.

Marcelo Gallardo, perhaps.
 
Mourinho and Poch's fundamental approach is really not all that different.

Both of them focus on lightning-quick transitions - it's at the heart of their styles. Get into the opponent's box within 5 passes after winning the ball back - no unnecessary possession, try the killer ball, go direct, draw the opponent in and use quick balls into spaces behind them to break up the opponent's defensive organization.

Where they do differ is where on the pitch they would like transitions to occur. For Poch, he wanted to enact transitions as high up the pitch as possible - for Mourinho, he wants to enact transitions in a lower block, so there's more space to run into when the quick out-ball is played after winning it back.

That entails differences in where you press - high up, or further back. But note - it doesn't mean *not* pressing. In Mourinho' s case, it's less pressing higher up, which means a higher PPDA (Passes Per Defensive Action) score, but intense pressing still occurs in key zones (the flanks, mostly).

If you think of the great transition in football over the last ten years, it's been the passing of the crown from possession-oriented styles to pressing-oriented styles. Those are the two paradigms which still define football tactics - possession versus pressing, or more accurately, indirect versus direct approaches to chance creation.

Both Poch and Mourinho are on 'direct' end of the scale. Yes, differences exist in terms of fitness levels of their teams (a Poch team will be fitter than any side in the league, just about) and overall mentalities (a Mourinho team will have a disproportionately high percentage of experienced players with 'grinta', the ability to win a game with willpower alone, versus Poch who tended to like young players more).

But I think the transition is not so great, and more thought went into the Poch-Mourinho swap than at first glance.

Our next coach will be an interesting one to watch - I can think of basically no manager out there now who actually subscribes to the possession-oriented philosophy, not even Guardiola. Pressing has massacred passing to that degree. So the question really becomes about fitness levels - our next boss will likely have to fall somewhere on the pectrum between Mourinho and Poch in terms of managing fitness, if we want to keep the similarity and overall philosophy going.

Marcelo Gallardo, perhaps.
I’d love to think there was more thought but I think it was as simple as Poch looked and acted like a broken man and Jose was available with a CV that’s truly the best out there (Pep would need to win something big with a lesser side for me)
But I agree on the other things around the styles not being as far sort as people say
I’ll also add that Mourinho has played multiple styles but focussed on less passes for quicker attacks. Both managers tended to focus on fixing the back line too which Jose has at had a chance to do yet (Poch created the best defence in the league for a couple of seasons)
 
Wasnt it the CF from France that went to Chelsea that was rumoured to be the tippining point? Name escapes me

Batishyui (sp?)...I did hear something about that, but I always heard the other two mentioned. What you're saying makes sense as it was the same window...
 
So he wanted 2 prem players we couldn’t afford due to better wages being offered elsewhere, and a Belgian lad who has been a really poor signing for Chelsea for £33m

i always thought the genius in DOF as mentioned by Campos a few times in some articles I’ve read about him, is scouting the players within your budget for a start ... and of course targeting the unknown players

I think his other signings prove he was very good. I think part if any good DoF is having that scouting eye (although this is why scouts are scouts!) and knowing when you need to blend, thus using your nous and relationships.
 
I could name loads of players that could improve us who happen to play for teams that pay 4/5 times the wages we do. A good scout finds value in the market.

Mane is obviously very quick and has scored a lot of goals, but personally I wouldn't swap Wijnaldum for Sissoko, I don't think thats a miss at all.

The rumour is that Sissoko ended up on the same wages Mane wanted. A rumour though, can't say I ever personally heard that.
 
I think his other signings prove he was very good. I think part if any good DoF is having that scouting eye (although this is why scouts are scouts!) and knowing when you need to blend, thus using your nous and relationships.
I too nice it’s much much easier looking good with clubs that are weak... you can improve a club like Southampton quite easily with a few players
RB are actually a big spender by German standards
 
I too nice it’s much much easier looking good with clubs that are weak... you can improve a club like Southampton quite easily with a few players
RB are actually a big spender by German standards
Indeed.... in the top 25 in the world overall in the last decade and behind only Bayern in Germany....

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.gi...he-biggest-transfer-net-spent-this-decade?amp

I'd say that they have used that net spend wisely though.

That list also gives yet another indication of how well Pochettino did at Spurs.
 
must have been a massive signing on fee and incentives then, I should imagine we offered at least 60k a week, which would be about right for a lower half PL player with potential, the dippers obviously gambled that it would work out but we can’t risk 90k a week + bonuses on a player who isn’t a definite starter, we always need to factor in moving them on too

it’s fine for our scout to recommend Mane, in 2011

We gave Sissoko 90k that same summer.
 
That is why there needs to be separation between the manager and the chairman in the form of a DoF. The DoF has the budget and works with the manager to identify what positions to strengthen. The DoF and manager can then make a decision on whether it is prudent to blow the entire budget on (e.g.) only two proven players or whether better to buy 4 unproven players. They can also decide whether selling an existing player or two for a bit less than their perceived market value makes sense if it would allow the signing of a third key player and things like that. The great thing is that they then live and die by those decisions as opposed to be able to say - 'well the chairman didn't get me the players I wanted'
Nobody gets given a budget along with the freedom to blow it on whatever the fudge they like.

It would be stupid of a DOF to expect that and for Levy to allow it.

Think of it like a COO and a Chairman. The COO is at the head of day to day stuff but there's no way they'd make significant investment decisions without the board's approval.
 
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