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*** OMT Tottenham Hotspur v Some european team ***

Benny_Lad said:
It will be either something we cant see (from training maybe). Or tactical opinion of Poch. I actually thought Dele was pretty decent first half. Noticed very short patience around the crowd when things didn't come off for him.
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I suspect that's because he often gets easily dispossessed when trying what looks like flicks and tricks. When they come off, they look awesome, but when they don't...boy...
 
Benny_Lad said:
It will be either something we cant see (from training maybe). Or tactical opinion of Poch. I actually thought Dele was pretty decent first half. Noticed very short patience around the crowd when things didn't come off for him.
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Cause you have to earn the right to play that way. Whether due to form or injuries etc Alli at the moment isn't starting from the point where he probably thinks he left off. He needs to do the simple things well and then build on that.
 
DubaiSpur said:
This was a slap in the face we fully deserved, tbh.

I just wish I knew what was wrong with the place. Poch has made tactical errors galore in the past couple of months - that diamond, asking Hugo to play out, the horrors at right-back. But the players have looked knackered, the mood has been ominous, there have been back-room issues....this is what we had to look forward to after the CL final?

Poch stays, there is no question about that. 5th or 15th. Turn on him next season if you must, but at least give him the luxury of a bad year after five beautiful ones.

But I know I'm not alone in thinking that we're now barreling downwards from our brief moment in the sun. And only Tottenhan could come close to every major prize in a five-year period of glory, and win absolutely none of them - not even a motherf*cking Carling Cup.
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All of the posts I’ve read on here since last night, this is the one that has stuck in my mind. We are still very weak mentally. I don’t know if it is fair to assign the blame to Poch for that, I think it’s a combination of the transfer policy, the players and the manager. 5 years on we look no closer to winning a trophy, in fact we look further away. Liverpool didn’t win the league last season but they won the CL so they have a trophy to show for it. We have nothing to show for our title challenges and back to back FA cup semi finals.It’s sheer bad luck for Poch that the Wembley move came directly after our best league finish in decades but if you look at our performances in those semis, finals and games where we have had a chance to go top with a win, the performances have been insipid, gutless and uninspiring.

Even after last night I’m not at the point where I feel Poch has lost the dressing room or needs to go but he has to turn this around. The absolute minimum from the next two league games should be 6 points.

If we lose to Brighton i fear Poch will be gone.
 
Jurgen the German said:
if you look at our performances in those semis, finals and games where we have had a chance to go top with a win, the performances have been insipid, gutless and uninspiring.
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That's why this culture of sacking off cups makes no sense. How do you expect to win the biggest prizes if you can't win the smaller ones. I understand squad issues. But once in the semi final/final should be going 40000% to win that brick. It's not the time to be having tactical innovation ideas and doing things like playing a winger left back or playing players who are injured/known to take a while to get back up to speed.
 
DeanoAustin said:
We conceded 7 goals at home. I can't recall that ever happening in my lifetime. We were so ridiculously open. In a way no profession side should ever be. I'd rather not be in the Champions League than suffer that brick.

The manager should be ashamed of himself. I know I'm embarrassed by that. If he's not, hes further from planet earth than I thought he was.
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xG however, suggests we were not so ridiculously open. I'm not saying it was a defensive masterclass, but they scored 7 goals from a xG of 1.27! It was one of those games where everything went in for them. These games happen and we happened to be on the wrong end of it. The overreaction by a lot on here is because it happened to come at a time when the team is still finding its feet and has put in mixed performances. But the performance in this game was actually quite decent. We were undeservedly down at halftime and had to chase the game and whenever you are chasing the game against a team like Bayern, you take a risk.

In any case, I had said a few years back that there will come a time under Poch when the team will be wobbling and that it is important to be patient while he works his way through the wobble. Well, we're in it now, so let's give the guy the chance to pull us out of it. If nothing has changed by the end of the season, we re-evaluate and maybe then we can say that Poch took us as far as he could, or that the team is not responding to him any longer.
 
Please lets not allow ourselves to get wrapped up in some narrative about how we only lost because Bayern had some supernatural strike rate/technique/luck last night.

When people take one look at the team sheet and instantly predict the clusterfudge that unfolded, thats nothing to do with xg and bad luck.

We were awful last night. Through the whole game. We were deservedly spanked. Thats the reality.
 
Not a good night at all do not think i have seen a Spurs team capitulate like that for a very long time. The players looked at a loss what to do and there was no one on the pitch to drive them on. We have far too many players who are just going through the motions at the moment and we lack winners on the pitch.

I have said for years that we DO lack the winning attitude among some of the players ( and have took a lot of stick for saying just that) but you have to be blind after that show not to see that. Where do we go from here???

I do not think getting rid of Poch now ( like some are suggesting) is the answer but we/he do need to start rattling some cages and kicking some arses of certain players who think they are doing us and the team a favour by wearing our shirt.

Watching Poch after the game he looked shell shocked and maybe he needs to have a rethink about first his tactics and secondly replacing some players who think they are doing us all a favour by wearing our shirts.

We all have our favourite players but there are a few who are just not putting the effort in and we need to root them out before that attitude spreads to the players who are busting a gut for us.

I will end by saying that Bayern were very good last night and imo the best team i have seen at the Lane for a long time, but we were crap and its not good enough for any fans but especially those that spend all their money actually going to games.

I have watched far worse teams in a Spurs shirt over the 50 odd years i have been traveling around but some of those teams did not have the quality in numbers that we have now and I/we the supporters could see that and accept it. Now we have players who should be doing MUCH better and are failing to do that.

Before anyone accuses me for going overboard with my grumbles but IMO last night we threw the towel in and that in my eyes is unforgivable.
 
galeforce said:
AVB had two results like that, two, and got fired.
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It wasn't just the result though it was the performance. Last night we had 8 shots on target to Bayern's 10. Our shots on target were all genuine chances as well. We were in that game for decent periods.

In the Liverpool game when AVB was (rightfully) sacked we had 0 shots on target to their 10, we had lost that game right from kick off.
 
glorygloryeze said:
Question: Were we any worse last night than when we played Leicester a few weeks ago?
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I don't think we were but we were fudging dreadful against them too.

Any team of half-arsed professionals should be able to get a 3-4 goal spread over a Brenton Rodgers team.
 
ringo said:
We can't/shouldn't play Sissoko/Ndombele/Winks...too defensive, not enough goals in them, and end up accommodating them in sub-par formation. I think Ndombele starts, and either Sissoko or Dier sits with Ndombele.
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N'Dombele looks anything but defensive to me. Seems to have a fantastic eye for a through ball and delivers them well, also looks like he gets himself in and around the box to score goals (2 already and unlucky not to have one last night). N'Dombele is a very good attacking option IMO.
 
parklane1 said:
Not a good night at all do not think i have seen a Spurs team capitulate like that for a very long time. The players looked at a loss what to do and there was no one on the pitch to drive them on. We have far too many players who are just going through the motions at the moment and we lack winners on the pitch.

I have said for years that we DO lack the winning attitude among some of the players ( and have took a lot of stick for saying just that) but you have to be blind after that show not to see that. Where do we go from here???

I do not think getting rid of Poch now ( like some are suggesting) is the answer but we/he do need to start rattling some cages and kicking some arses of certain players who think they are doing us and the team a favour by wearing our shirt.

Watching Poch after the game he looked shell shocked and maybe he needs to have a rethink about first his tactics and secondly replacing some players who think they are doing us all a favour by wearing our shirts.

We all have our favourite players but there are a few who are just not putting the effort in and we need to root them out before that attitude spreads to the players who are busting a gut for us.

I will end by saying that Bayern were very good last night and imo the best team i have seen at the Lane for a long time, but we were crap and its not good enough for any fans but especially those that spend all their money actually going to games.

I have watched far worse teams in a Spurs shirt over the 50 odd years i have been traveling around but some of those teams did not have the quality in numbers that we have now and I/we the supporters could see that and accept it. Now we have players who should be doing MUCH better and are failing to do that.

Before anyone accuses me for going overboard with my grumbles but IMO last night we threw the towel in and that in my eyes is unforgivable.
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Thanks for the summary. It's always interesting to hear views from within the stadium...who do you think yesterday were the players who weren't putting in a shift?
I ask, because i always find it a fine line between not putting in required effort vs the system meaning you "run on a treadmill but don't go anywhere", i.e. put in a lot of effort but in vain
 
We again looked naive and ill-prepared.
Bayern was very good indeed but this is a run of the mill side from this Bavarian powerhouse!
They are not world-beaters by any means, their press thinks they are quite workmanlike according to my friend and uber Bayern fan.
 
StephenH said:
We again looked naive and ill-prepared.
Bayern was very good indeed but this is a run of the mill side from this Bavarian powerhouse!
They are not world-beaters by any means, their press thinks they are quite workmanlike according to my friend and uber Bayern fan.
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I thought their front 4 were formidable. Their midfield "meh". Their defence rather poor.

In terms of Bayern sides, probably the worst Ive seen in years.

In terms of general quality, I think they are a decent team, above average, but nothing like top class.
 
DeanoAustin said:
In my view, you still need someone who is defensively aware in those positions and neither Winks or Ndombele are defensively aware or even close to it.

Don’t agree on Dier. I think he’s quite limited offensively but I’d have him in the team right now at centre mid if he’s fit.
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I am 100% with you here. Having Winks and N'Dombele means that the opposition's creative number 10 type player will always find himself in space, centrally outside our penalty area. Typically PL level number 10s will punish you and CL level ones certainly will.
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
I thought their front 4 were formidable. Their midfield "meh". Their defence rather poor.

In terms of Bayern sides, probably the worst Ive seen in years.

In terms of general quality, I think they are a decent team, above average, but nothing like top class.
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Glenn was about to give himself another heart attack watching our setup last night!
The space we allowed them was shocking!
 
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