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World Cup 2018 Group D (Argentina, Iceland, Croatia, Nigeria)

Well, no one is saying it is all Messi's fault. Clearly there are deeper problems.

But Messi is considered one of the greatest players of all time, a challenger to Maradona for the throne. What did he do when the game got tough? He wandered around looking depressed and as if he'd rather be somewhere else. Can you imagine Maradona doing the same? He would try to lead his team by example, he would try anything to win. He might end up being sent off but he wouldn't passively conceded defeat. Even in the stands he looked more animated than Messi.
 
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Lamela's Dad seemed to be blaming him.

He had a few moments where he tried to do it all himself, but was crowded out. He looks like he's tired of having being the next Diego - who he may well not be as good as - hung around his neck.

You look at the players in that squad, they shouldn't have to be lead anywhere by an individual. He seems to be the focus for their failure, while all these other world stars get a pass because they're not him. What's the coach doing? They were an absolute shambles last night.
 
jts1882 said:
Well, no one is saying it is all Messi's fault. Clearly there are deeper problems.

But Messi is considered one of the greatest players of all time, a challenger to Maradona for the throne. What did he do when the game got tough? He wandered around looking depressed and as if he'd rather be somewhere else. Can you imagine Maradona doing the same? He would try to lead his team by example, he would try anything to win. He might end up being sent off but he wouldn't passively conceded defeat. Even in the stands he looked more animated than Messi.
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Also, Ronaldo, Eriksen and Bale etc. seem to manage lifting their average national teams to a higher level.
 
All Argentina have to do is beat Nigeria and do so by a bigger margin than any Icelandic win vs Croatia.
 
Argentina - Nigeria could be a good one. Argentina must win, and Nigeria can't really gamble on a draw either, so both teams need to score.
 
Saw a shocking Messi stat, BTW. Apparently he ran a meagre 7,6 km in both his matches, far less than any other player.

In comparison, Eriksen usually covers between 11-12km in Spurs games - that's a staggering difference.

Also, apparently, Messi was only sprinting in about 5% of the time he spent running - also far less than the average player.

Off form or injured? Something's clearly not right with him.
 
Robbo said:
Saw a shocking Messi stat, BTW. Apparently he ran a meagre 7,6 km in both his matches, far less than any other player.

In comparison, Eriksen usually covers between 11-12km in Spurs games - that's a staggering difference.

Also, apparently, Messi was only sprinting in about 5% of the time he spent running - also far less than the average player.

Off form or injured? Something's clearly not right with him.
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Both him and Ronaldo had the lowest running stats in the CL last year.
Both conserve and normally fresher for the key moments.

I think it's the same in the league and Messi carried them to the title.
 
LemonadeMoney said:
Also, Ronaldo, Eriksen and Bale etc. seem to manage lifting their average national teams to a higher level.
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This .. the media narrative that everyone has bought into is amazing, i.e, the world's best and good guy, Ronaldo the arrogant villain that challenges him but Messi ultimately prevails

- As said above, Ronaldo, Eriksen & Bale drag their teams (far worse teams) single handedly
- Messi in his prime has been disappointing and a flat track bully, from 24 - 30, he has helped Barca win 1 CL and Argentina nothing (not even a fudging Copa America)
- His goal ratio has always been inferior to Ronaldo over the length of career
- @Robbo I would look at his normal games (he walks a lot).
- The other narrative of somehow during his time Argentina hasn't had good players is insane, Aquero, Higuaín, Tevez, Dybala, Mascherano, Di Maria just to name a few of the "brick" players poor Messi has had to carry on his back ..

No question the guy is a great player, but not best ever and everyone can say he's better than Ronaldo, but let's be clear
- If you were betting your house/life on either of them on the biggest stage in the last minute of a match (penalty/free kick/1:1 with keeper), not a single sane person would pick Messi
 
@r-u-s-x @Raziel

I don't know Messi's regular running stats, but what you say sounds plausible from the games I've seen him in. Makes him look kinda useless if he doesn't deliver, though.
 
Robbo said:
Saw a shocking Messi stat, BTW. Apparently he ran a meagre 7,6 km in both his matches, far less than any other player.

In comparison, Eriksen usually covers between 11-12km in Spurs games - that's a staggering difference.

Also, apparently, Messi was only sprinting in about 5% of the time he spent running - also far less than the average player.

Off form or injured? Something's clearly not right with him.
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It's what he does. He never cover much ground.
 
Raziel said:
This .. the media narrative that everyone has bought into is amazing, i.e, the world's best and good guy, Ronaldo the arrogant villain that challenges him but Messi ultimately prevails

- As said above, Ronaldo, Eriksen & Bale drag their teams (far worse teams) single handedly
- Messi in his prime has been disappointing and a flat track bully, from 24 - 30, he has helped Barca win 1 CL and Argentina nothing (not even a fudging Copa America)
- His goal ratio has always been inferior to Ronaldo over the length of career
- @Robbo I would look at his normal games (he walks a lot).
- The other narrative of somehow during his time Argentina hasn't had good players is insane, Aquero, Higuaín, Tevez, Dybala, Mascherano, Di Maria just to name a few of the "brick" players poor Messi has had to carry on his back ..

No question the guy is a great player, but not best ever and everyone can say he's better than Ronaldo, but let's be clear
- If you were betting your house/life on either of them on the biggest stage in the last minute of a match (penalty/free kick/1:1 with keeper), not a single sane person would pick Messi
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He did drag them to the final at the last WC
 
DeleHarry said:
Yeah but that obviously doesnt count:rolleyes:
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My point .. in case you missed it

- It's a false narrative to say he "drags" them because individually over last 8 years they have had plenty of players with quality other than Messi (Tevez, Aquero & Higuaín infront of Mascherano & Messi?)
- He is a great player, but 1 CL in 7 years in a great Barca side in his prime, nothing for a reasonably talented national side excludes him from the "greatest of all time" for me (opinion)

But no worries … I'm sure someone will point out he won 9 million La Liga titles in a 2 horse league and that's why he's better than everyone else
 
Ronaldo and Messi are greats, equally. To have this "who is better" bollox is totally embarrassing tbh

I'm sure Messi would like an international winners medal with Argentina, and Ronaldo probably feels he hasn't won enough La Ligas with Real, heyho let them deal with it.
 
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