Danny Rose

[90291Spur]

As I said before mate, whoever is repping him is not doing right by him IMO. The only caveat is they might well think they got him to agree to be quiet and work through this situation with help behind the scenes only for DR to take another turn unscripted. There simply seems to be no good reason to speak right now, I cannot see where this helps him?


Sitting on my porcelain throne using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app

Correct. His actions are the actions of someone who is not grounded and regulated, hence saying things that don't help him either professionally or personally.

 

[thfcsteff]

So you claim it was some sort of masterstroke for Poch to do his book and reveal very intimate things about himself and players at the club so publicly yet Rose was ill advised to speak out like he did? He hasn’t said anything out of place and who cares about when he does it? Maybe it’s been in his mind for a while and wanted to get it off his chest before the World Cup....

First of all, if you had read what I said about the book at the time, I had said I had my doubts that he should've done it.
That being said, the comparison you've made suggests to me you have no clue as to what I was saying/expressing (frankly, I think the comparison smacks of your trying to find someone you think I will "protect" against everything, which is just silly IMO).
Now, perhaps 50% of that lies with me not clearly enough articulating what I am saying in a way you at least understand it (I don't care if you agree or not obviously, I just want to be sure you understand).

So...it is my personal opinion that allowing someone who is still working through their depression to speak publicly before having briefed their family and close working associates is not helping that person. I will further take the liberty of suggesting that perhaps you don't fully gauge that allowing someone with depression (or another psychiatric condition) to "get things off their chest" in a public forum is not always the healthiest course of action.

I don't wish to sound patronizing, but sadly I'm sure I do, so apologies for that. But IMO this is a far, far bigger issue than "getting things off his chest"...it is about a deep issue that appears unresolved and still in turmoil. I sincerely hope he makes it through.

 

[billyiddo]

OK.
I believe he was ill-advised in not being protected from giving this interview.

Im really not seeing any reason why giving this interview is even ill advised tbh mate, asides from a few peoples noses being put out of joint on the internet (missguidedly too imo) he hasn't really done anything other than open up about some dark stuff going on in his life - surely that's gotta be better than bottling it up? maybe if Aaron Lennon was able to speak out about similar issues then.had he could have sort help a lot sooner

 

[thfcsteff]

Correct. His actions are the actions of someone who is not grounded and regulated, hence saying things that don't help him either professionally or personally.

I hate to say this, but some of the wolves around are hungry and I think the only person who really ends up paying out of this, is Danny himself.

 

[thfcsteff]

Im really not seeing any reason why giving this interview is even ill advised tbh mate, asides from a few peoples noses being put out of joint on the internet (missguidedly too imo) he hasn't really done anything other than talk opening about some dark stuff going on in his life - maybe if Aaron Lennon was able to speak out about similar issues that he had he could have sort help a lot sooner

We agree to disagree?

 

[Raziel]

Im really not seeing any reason why giving this interview is even ill advised tbh mate, asides from a few peoples noses being put out of joint on the internet (missguidedly too imo) he hasn't really done anything other than talk opening about some dark stuff going on in his life - maybe if Aaron Lennon was able to speak out about similar issues that he had he could have sort help a lot sooner

Because a lot of what he said can be "interpreted" and won't help him (brick people say), with his family (who he has admitted leaving out) or professionally (club's viewpoint).

Effectively he had very little good to say about Spurs or his teammates (admittedly more by omission) and paints "England" as this great escape (probably some insight into his mental issues, anywhere but where I am is going to be better).

Question is has it really helped him? (not sure I see how)

 

[harr1984]

First of all, if you had read what I said about the book at the time, I had said I had my doubts that he should've done it.
That being said, the comparison you've made suggests to me you have no clue as to what I was saying/expressing (frankly, I think the comparison smacks of your trying to find someone you think I will "protect" against everything, which is just silly IMO).
Now, perhaps 50% of that lies with me not clearly enough articulating what I am saying in a way you at least understand it (I don't care if you agree or not obviously, I just want to be sure you understand).

So...it is my personal opinion that allowing someone who is still working through their depression to speak publicly before having briefed their family and close working associates is not helping that person. I will further take the liberty of suggesting that perhaps you don't fully gauge that allowing someone with depression (or another psychiatric condition) to "get things off their chest" in a public forum is not always the healthiest course of action.

I don't wish to sound patronizing, but sadly I'm sure I do, so apologies for that. But IMO this is a far, far bigger issue than "getting things off his chest"...it is about a deep issue that appears unresolved and still in turmoil. I sincerely hope he makes it through.

No the Poch thing has nothing to do with you protecting him although I must say if it was Poch who had depression and come out with these sound bites I don’t think there would be any sort of discussion on here about what he had said - just because it’s Rose who has ruffled some peoples feathers on here previously hes an easy target.

For me I’m not going to judge Rose on when he’s chosen to come out and talk about it. He’s off medication now, he’s clearly doing better and confident and happy enough within himself to talk about it. There is no easy or right time to come out and discuss this when you’re a sportsmen in the public eye. I for one am backing him 100%(not suggesting you aren’t), hopefully he has a fear World Cup and comes back chomping at the big because for me he is still our best LB if he gets back properly fit...

 

[billyiddo]

Because a lot of what he said can be "interpreted" and won't help him (brick people say), with his family (who he has admitted leaving out) or professionally (club's viewpoint).

Effectively he had very little good to say about Spurs or his teammates (admittedly more by omission) and paints "England" as this great escape (probably some insight into his mental issues, anywhere but where I am is going to be better).

Question is has it really helped him? (not sure I see how)

Has it helped him? I think being able to talk about your mental health/problems is a positive and for someone recovering from depression that has to be seen as a good sign - could he have worded things a little better? Sure, but then i get the impression he's a man that speaks franky and with little prior planning as to what he's going to say so it's going be a little all over the place what he says.

Regarding the part in bold - i think that's key, you're infering that he is attacking the club because he doesn't really talk about it, it's an interview by an England player on England duty talking about his mental health issues and his brother nearly getting murdered, Spurs isn't really the talking point..

 

[BrainOfLevy]

We agree to disagree?

Must say I am curious as to why this should be seen as so much of a negative for Rose that he has spoken out? What specifically will be the negative consequence? The reaction has been overwhelmingly positive across all platforms.

If he makes a mistake at the World Cup, and anyone decides to blame him, they will look like the biggest macarons of all time. Although maybe that's what you are saying. Now it's almost like anyone can't criticize Rose if he does something wrong, and maybe that will cause divisions in the camp and force the focus elsewhere? Maybe other players will think they are not treated fairly and Rose gets protected?

 

[BrainOfLevy]

Has it helped him? I think being able to talk about your mental health/problems is a positive and for someone recovering from depression that has to be seen as a good sign - could he have worded things a little better? Sure, but then i get the impression he's a man that speaks franky and with little prior planning as to what he's going to say so it's going be a little all over the place what he says.

Regarding the part in bold - i think that's key, you're infering that he is attacking the club because he doesn't really talk about it, it's an interview by an England player on England duty talking about his mental health issues and his brother nearly getting murdered, Spurs isn't really the talking point..

I agree here. If you really wanted to look at it like he has no love for Spurs from those quotes, maybe you can. And frankly, maybe it is true. But really, it isn't even that important whether he loves or appreciates our club or not. He's talking about way bigger things.

 

[scaramanga]

Im really not seeing any reason why giving this interview is even ill advised tbh mate, asides from a few peoples noses being put out of joint on the internet (missguidedly too imo) he hasn't really done anything other than open up about some dark stuff going on in his life - surely that's gotta be better than bottling it up? maybe if Aaron Lennon was able to speak out about similar issues then.had he could have sort help a lot sooner

I'm sure I remember Lennon showing gratitude towards those who had helped him, not making veiled comments sending blame their way.

 

[Robspur12]

I'm sure I remember Lennon showing gratitude towards those who had helped him, not making veiled comments sending blame their way.

Part of the reason for Rose’s depression was the treatment he was undergoing. I don’t think he was “attacking” the club at all but rather he was saying he didn’t cope very well with that treatment. In fact in the piece he refers to Spurs several times as “my club” rather than just as “Spurs.”As I have said before, Rose has said that his relationship with Poch is very good and Poch knows how to get the best out of him. Depression is a complex illness. It affects people differently and they react to it differently.

 

[Yermiyahu]

I don't think you can blame someone for sounding negative about a time where they were in a dark place and suffering with depression tbh - especially in his case where a lot of it stems from being injuried and missing games, training/recovering alone - all Tottenham related stuff and i can totally understand why breaking that negative routine, like with the England stuff he mentions, would have been seen as a bit of an escape for him - don't think we should take it as an attack on the club.

Rose is shooting from the hip about real things here and i think it's terrible really that people choose to focus on something as trivial as "he may have said something negative about the club" when he's talking about clinical depression, racisim and attempted murder...

Let us not forget that his Uncle committed suicide in the midst of his recovery from injury, tbh that's almost enough to tip anyone over the edge.

 

[thfcsteff]

Must say I am curious as to why this should be seen as so much of a negative for Rose that he has spoken out? What specifically will be the negative consequence? The reaction has been overwhelmingly positive across all platforms.

If he makes a mistake at the World Cup, and anyone decides to blame him, they will look like the biggest macarons of all time. Although maybe that's what you are saying. Now it's almost like anyone can't criticize Rose if he does something wrong, and maybe that will cause divisions in the camp and force the focus elsewhere? Maybe other players will think they are not treated fairly and Rose gets protected?

I will simply say this.
I am thinking of what is best for Danny Rose, a high-profile athlete who is under the microscope and in the public eye.
I am not sure how much of my verbose replies you've read, but I genuinely cannot be any clearer than I have been in those with regards to my opinion.
I am not even thinking of his career as a footballer. I am thinking of him as someone who appears to have some deep and developing issues with depression/depression-related issues. I believe such a person needs protection from further public scrutiny.

 

[thfcsteff]

No the Poch thing has nothing to do with you protecting him although I must say if it was Poch who had depression and come out with these sound bites I don’t think there would be any sort of discussion on here about what he had said - just because it’s Rose who has ruffled some peoples feathers on here previously hes an easy target.

For me I’m not going to judge Rose on when he’s chosen to come out and talk about it. He’s off medication now, he’s clearly doing better and confident and happy enough within himself to talk about it. There is no easy or right time to come out and discuss this when you’re a sportsmen in the public eye. I for one am backing him 400%(not suggesting you aren’t), hopefully he has a fear World Cup and comes back chomping at the big because for me he is still our best LB if he gets back properly fit...

The first part of your answer contradicts itself. You clearly still have an agenda with regards to Poch and the perceived "over-protection" he has received from the likes of me (which of course is rubbish, but there we go, perceptions and all). Your next comment about Rose being an "easy target" further conforms you either don't -or don't want to- understand the points I am making.

Your final paragraph tells me you are thinking about Danny Rose the footballer. Whilst I certainly understand that, it is important you know that my observations are on Danny Rose, the professional athlete who is depressed/suffers from depression. Again, no worries disagreeing, I just cannot be sure you ever understood the points I've been making.

 

[90291Spur]

No the Poch thing has nothing to do with you protecting him although I must say if it was Poch who had depression and come out with these sound bites I don’t think there would be any sort of discussion on here about what he had said - just because it’s Rose who has ruffled some peoples feathers on here previously hes an easy target.

For me I’m not going to judge Rose on when he’s chosen to come out and talk about it. He’s off medication now, he’s clearly doing better and confident and happy enough within himself to talk about it. There is no easy or right time to come out and discuss this when you’re a sportsmen in the public eye. I for one am backing him 400%(not suggesting you aren’t), hopefully he has a fear World Cup and comes back chomping at the big because for me he is still our best LB if he gets back properly fit...

As someone married to a therapist I can tell you that coming off anti-depression medication takes a long time and is really hard. Many people - even those on anti-depressant meds for a short time - have a tough time tapering off and suffer from many symptoms that mimic depression. It’s not like coming off anti-biotics and frequently requires intensive therapy and lots of hard work looking at yourself, your life, your patterns of behaviour and other challenging issues. Throw in the grief that Rose has endured, his injuries and the fact that lots of this plays out in public and it’s not a simple equation.

We all respond to these things differently. Some on here seem understanding and empathetic, others think he should be further publicly shamed to deter others from being fragile humans. The bottom line is that we know just about fcuk all about Danny Rose the man (some don’t care at all about Danny Rose the man) so we can’t really judge.

What we all want is what’s best for Tottenham. Hopefully that will align with what’s best for Rose.

 

[thfcsteff]

Let us not forget that his Uncle committed suicide in the midst of his recovery from injury, tbh that's almost enough to tip anyone over the edge.

A terrible thing. It also suggests that he his family tree holds some pre-disposition to clinical depression, and I can only imagine how the situation must've messed with him, not only from the simple perspective of deep sadness, but the scarier perspective of self-questioning.

 

[thfcsteff]

As someone married to a therapist I can tell you that coming off anti-depression medication takes a long time and is really hard. Many people - even those on anti-depressant meds for a short time - have a tough time tapering off and suffer from many symptoms that mimic depression. It’s not like coming off anti-biotics and frequently requires intensive therapy and lots of hard work looking at yourself, your life, your patterns of behaviour and other challenging issues. Throw in the grief that Rose has endured, his injuries and the fact that lots of this plays out in public and it’s not a simple equation.

We all respond to these things differently. Some on here seem understanding and empathetic, others think he should be further publicly shamed to deter others from being fragile humans. The bottom line is that we know just about fcuk all about Danny Rose the man (some don’t care at all about Danny Rose the man) so we can’t really judge.

What we all want is what’s best for Tottenham. Hopefully that will align with what’s best for Rose.

100% agreed.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

I will simply say this.
I am thinking of what is best for Danny Rose, a high-profile athlete who is under the microscope and in the public eye.
I am not sure how much of my verbose replies you've read, but I genuinely cannot be any clearer than I have been in those with regards to my opinion.
I am not even thinking of his career as a footballer. I am thinking of him as someone who appears to have some deep and developing issues with depression/depression-related issues. I believe such a person needs protection from further public scrutiny.

I read everything you say with interest, as always. Just trying to go one level deeper here to understand what specifically the negative consequences will be?

Is it that further public scrutiny may be push him further to the edge? In wish case I don’t think I agree. Attitudes in this country and more generally have come a long way on mental health. The response Aaron Lennon got was fantastic. Clarke Carlisle has come out in support of Rose. Prince William has commended him for speaking out. And frankly, Rose, whether he’s in a healthy state or otherwise, strikes me as a character that is happiest speaking his mind. Maybe it’s been fantastic for him to be able to get this off of his chest, and at the same time have him feel like he’s raising awareness for others too.

I can see that he’s somewhat sensitive to criticism. The idea that Spurs fans gave him stick which he’s never forgiven us for is something I find quite laughable...he got somewhere near as much abuse as other spacegoats have even when he was performing as an average player, and as soon as he started performing to his fullest potential his name got sung with regularity. So I can see why you say scrutiny may not be helpful for him. But in this case, with attitudes shifting on mental health, and himself feeling like he has been heard (which is often what people with mental suffering want to help them feel better - to be understood) I don’t think anyone bar Rose and the people responsible for him are in a position to tell him what is right and wrong. Southgate seems to love him, and I’m not sure he’s feeling as negatively towards his interview as you are for example. I may be wrong, but most of the football world seems to think it’s another important step in the changing attitudes around mental health.

 

[scaramanga]

We all respond to these things differently. Some on here seem understanding and empathetic, others think he should be further publicly shamed to deter others from being fragile humans.

He can be as fragile as he likes, what I can't accept is him being a clam towards his teammates and the club.

What we all want is what’s best for Tottenham. Hopefully that will align with what’s best for Rose.

What's best for Spurs is to ensure that the next player who fancies a move to City doesn't learn that they can accelerate the process by publicly being a clam about their teammates and the team.

We should give him all the help he needs to get well but he rots in the stiffs until the end of his contract.